COMMENTS: 76
Generation Y Refuses Race-Gender Dichotomy
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According to PBS News Hour, 5.7 million people under the age of 30 voted in the primaries, a 109 percent increase from the last presidential election. There's no question that young people are excited about this political moment; there's no question that we care deeply about issues of race, gender, class, and religion; we are not, however, endeared to partisanship. Chalk it up to Facebook, competitive college admissions, or all of the other phenomena that influence us to see ourselves as individual project, but it's clear that we resist groupthink. We shy away from taking on any sort of movement identity, preferring to vote for the individual candidate and his or her policies, and preferring to be seen as individual people -- not a texting, IM-ing mass of technologically superior and socially inferior sons and daughters. As my peer Keli Goff put it in her wonderful book of the same name, we're into "party crashing."
When we do take the leap to identify with a movement, as I have in the case of feminism, we still seem to buck against the idea that our affiliation determines our vote. I, for example, am an Obama voter, but was and will continue to be an avid Clinton supporter. I hate the sexist coverage that she endured, and have written and spoken out about it widely, but that doesn't change my vote. My feminism is not just about gender equality in government, but also about racial justice, global security, community ethics, etc., and I resent being made to feel as if there is a "right" way to vote if I am a feminist. I'm grateful for being challenged to justify my choice to pull the lever for Obama by feminist friends and mentors, but only when it's initiated in the spirit of dialogue, not a litmus test.
Our tendency towards thinking and acting solo isn't such a surprise when you consider the ethnic and cultural origins of this generation. The country is becoming more and more interracial, thanks to the increasing incidence of interracial pairings like Obama's parents, as pointed out by public education projects like Loving Day. And further, genealogy and genetic efforts like Henry Louis Gates Jr.'s The Root are pointing out that even before interracial unions had been destigmatized (at least in urban centers), plenty of our ancestors were crossing the color line behind bedroom doors. It's not so strange these days to meet a Chinese-Chilean guy living in Brooklyn or a Vietnamese Baptist in Houston. How could we affiliate with one party/movement/organization when we contain such a multitude of loyalties in our own little legacies?
The million-dollar question: How, with a generation bent on individuality and multiplicity, do we confront racism, sexism and all the other insipid -isms that have been brought to light by this unprecedented campaign? To my mind, we must continue to use novel interventions -- like the Women's Media Center's great montage "Sexism Sells, but We're Not Buying It," the brand-new blog Michelle Obama Watch, and the evergreen experts at Racialicious -- to educate people. We must use humor -- as my group blog Feministing often does, as the brilliant Sarah Haskins does on Current TV, as Ann Telnaes does through cartooning over at Women's eNews. (Note: It's not just the boys -- John Stewart, Stephen Colbert, and the Onion crew -- that know the power of a laugh.)
We must take our roles as media consumers dead seriously, calling television executives and newspaper editors on their misguided choices and celebrating them when they get it right. In an increasingly corporatized media landscape, it is your dollar, not your disgust, that will most readily get big-wig attention. Don't buy sexist magazines, don't tune into to racist radio, and don't watch reductive, recycled infotainment being pawned off as news.
But most of all, it seems to me, we must continue to push for a deeper, more authentic conversation overall. We must let the mainstream media know that we don't want to debate "reject" or "denounce" for 24 hours or go on witch hunts for Geraldine Ferraro or Samantha Power. We want to understand what these women were trying to say. We want to explore the real issues. We want to, as my co-panelist Juan Gonzalez of Democracy Now so brilliantly put it, call into question the whole idea of empire. The debate shouldn't center on the quandary: How can we make our empire more effective? But, do we want to be an empire in the first place?
And we must demand that our candidates rise to the occasion, as I believe Obama did so beautifully with his speech on race following the Reverend Wright controversy. He brought that conversation to a new level, and we are all better off for it. We need to continue to push for that kind of brazen truth-telling -- about gender, certainly, about class, for sure. That's what politics is supposed to be about -- not partisanship or strategic spinning, but honesty and uplift. Call me naïve, but that's what the young are supposed to be, right?
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Posted by: daniel347x on Jun 18, 2008 4:06 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Overcoming the race-gender dichotomy by saying "they're both fantastic" is like saying I support gay rights - you can take me seriously because I'm not gay myself. ("I want to overcome the race-gender divide - and you can take me seriously because I'm a big fan of both of them.")
Near the end, the author gives a token statement about the need to call into question the whole idea of empire, but does not see the glaring contradiction with the fact that Hillary Clinton and likely Barack Obama are massively in support of empire and of capitalism.
Building a movement against dwarfing class disparity and capitalism is a tremendous task that needs to be undertaken with the support and in coalition with movements for women's justice and civil rights, labor movements and the many other movements for human and social justice. It cannot be relegated to a token comment at the end of an article because it sounds nice there.
We need to transform society, and not just change the power dynamics of injustice.
Dan Nissenbaum
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» Then this articles is a busllshit sandwich
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» RE: Then this articles is a busllshit sandwich
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» RE: Hillary like W. was born with a Silver foot in her mouth
Posted by: Purple Girl
» RE: Hillary like W. was born with a Silver foot in her mouth
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» RE: Hillary like W. was born with a Silver foot in her mouth
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» RE: Hillary like W. was born with a Silver foot in her mouth
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» RE: Tragic: "Refusing the Race-Gender dichotomy" as a tool to ignore class
Posted by: Bozwell
» It's interesting how much Purple Girl and Bozwell...
Posted by: writer7
» Race/Gender is a smokescreen; It's time to examine the real problem
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: Tragic: "Refusing the Race-Gender dichotomy" as a tool to ignore class
Posted by: hagwind
» I take it you're voting for Ron Paul then
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» RE: I take it you're voting for Ron Paul then
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» Elections, Not Party
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» Typo
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» RE: Elections, Not Party
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» They Don't Count Though
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» RE: They Don't Count Though
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Posted by: Purple Girl on Jun 18, 2008 4:55 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My Genereation ('63)was caught between the Boomers and the so called 'Me' Generation. I've come to Regard the reference to Me as meaning- who will have to carry the weight of the Boomers as they Age- Me. Who will have to clean Up the Mess they've left behind- Me. Who will have to be a worker until death to help the next generation not have to carry the load Alone- Me.But I am glad to help. I find Your Generation a generation which enjoys the perks, but recognizes their community responsiblity. You may be the first generation to truely embrace all that our Founding Fathers Dreamed of ...Equality & justice for All.
The Boomers got so caught up in their own 'entitlements',Their own Self righteousness and their own Vendettas- they have forgotten about all those behend them and frankly those who they were to care for ahead of them. 'Spoiled Brats' my mother calls them- to young to be part of the 'Greatest Generation' ('33).
I always admired the 'Hippie ' Movement -wishing I could have been older- now I realize they were a Sham.
I now am thrilled to be able to be a help to this new generation of young adults who live up to the ideals the Boomers just Talked about.
So I will grant you this...In any way and in every way I will be there to be sure the Load is not to heavy for your Generation.I will not just cheer you on - I will be next to you.But beware the older gnerations have been playing con games and subliminal Deceptions for Decades- We must be viligent in detecting thier manipulations.
Note about the Womens Movement( which I cut my teenage teeth on in the late'70's)- It began as a Liberation movement , not a 'Pay Backs A Bitch'- our goal was to Prove we could earn our place at the table, not that we needed the bar lowered or special consideration and Treatment. it undermines our efforts. We also were a movement who knew we must fight for equality for All, not just ourselves. Women like Hillary & Ferraro have either forgotten our basic tenents or never had them to begin with.WE must play by the Rules,even when unfair- it only proves we can meet any challenge regardless of the obstacles- validates Us even more making it impossible to deny Us our place.Granted we want to change the way the game is played- but we have to get in it first, and on our own merits.That which does not kill us makes Us Strong.
Also I already have an appt today with the Flint Obama Office today to start putting not only my money -but my efforts where my mouth is....
Oh Yes WE Can!!!!
GoodBye Boomers, Your Time has Expired!
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» RE: This Lil Sis to the Boomers, Is Beaming Ear To Ear !
Posted by: Bozwell
» I am of the 50's and WE WERE the DEFINITION OF FEMINISM, Lived it,
Posted by: Turiye
» RE: I am of the 50's and WE WERE the DEFINITION OF FEMINISM, Lived it,
Posted by: hagwind
» Spoken like a true Baby Boomer...which you are
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» purple girl has a lot of free time on her/his? hands
Posted by: 113121
» RE: Spoken like a true Baby Boomer...which you are
Posted by: rclord
» Boomers just like to call people born in the early 60s boomers so they don't feel old.
Posted by: rclord
» I'm sorry, but statistically speaking, you're incorrect
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» even if all of what you said is true
Posted by: rclord
» Okay, let's go through this one more time...
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» I understand only too well
Posted by: rclord
» I didn't define it; I'm just imparting the information
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» I accept that the baby boom is a notably large increase in births...
Posted by: rclord
» It all derives from what's been historically called a "generation"
Posted by: nochicagoboys
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Posted by: ankhet on Jun 18, 2008 4:55 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of course, actually taking a position on some issue is out of the question, as that might disturb the writer's atomic individualism.
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» RE: Kum-ba-ya
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» Seriously?
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» RE: Seriously?
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Posted by: hagwind on Jun 18, 2008 4:55 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I could make similiar big sprawling generalizations about my generation (middle-of-the-boom boomers) too. We antiwar organizers were all-fired-up independent too. We didn't get suckered by the Socialist Workers Party, and when (some of) our elders talked about "party discipline" in the old Communist Party, we sniggered, "So you just followed orders, eh?" The major antiwar bills in Congress were often sponsored by a Democrat and a Republican -- McGovern-Hatfield, Cooper-Church -- so I don't think that shoot-yourself-in-the-foot partisanship was the order of the day then either, at least not for those working for social and political change.
I grew up listening to adults say stuff like "I vote for the man [sic], not the party." Maybe those men came from the same party 95% of the time, but still, many, many people thought they should be voting for the person, not the party. Courtney Martin refers to her generation's "tendency towards thinking and acting solo" -- it's not new; it's good ol' "rugged individualism" dressed up in new rhetoric, and it's a big honking problem in this country.
Get this: John McCain could be a paragon of political and personal virtues, I could agree with 95% of what he says -- but if he were the candidate of the Republican Party as currently constituted, no way in hell would I vote for him. If Barack Obama -- not a paragon, but definitely one of the best major-party presidential candidates I've seen in my lifetime -- were the candidate of the Republican Party as currently constituted, I wouldn't vote for him either.
Voting for "the person, not the party" is, at best, short-sighted. The person's allegiances -- who does she listen to, who makes big donations to his campaign, etc. -- are almost certainly going to have a much greater impact on performance in office than the person's character or what s/he says s/he is for or against. "Thinking and acting solo" is likewise. The labor movement wasn't organized by lone wolves and mavericks and people too fastidious to occasionally subordinate their own solo wills for the collective good. Ditto the civil rights movement. Ditto any movement that ever achieved anything in this country.
Courtney Martin's million-dollar question:
How, with a generation bent on individuality and multiplicity, do we confront racism, sexism and all the other insipid -isms that have been brought to light by this unprecedented campaign?
If it is, then the 1.5 million-dollar question is "Didn't you notice 'racism, sexism and all the other insipid -isms' before this campaign?" If not, why not? Maybe they weren't covered in your "Free to Be . . . You and Me" Celebrate Diversity class? Sheesh. FDR died six years before I was born, but somehow I managed to meet and learn from many, many people who lived through and organized during the Depression and the New Deal. I didn't meet them by "thinking and acting solo" -- I met them because of the movements I threw myself into. I learned a helluva lot about myself and my own circumstances through those movements. I learned a helluva lot about diversity, though "diversity" wasn't a buzzword then and we didn't call it that. Maybe Ms. Martin and her friends would benefit from similar exposure. Or maybe they just want to pontificate to each other in panel discussions while the rest of us shake our heads and mutter old-fart stuff about learning from history and reinventing the wheel.
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» RE: Oh, wow! Generation Y looks a lot like Generations A, B, C , D, etc.
Posted by: Bozwell
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Posted by: lefty010 on Jun 18, 2008 5:07 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My biggest point of contention lies here:
And we must demand that our candidates rise to the occasion, as I believe Obama did so beautifully with his speech on race following the Reverend Wright controversy. He brought that conversation to a new level, and we are all better off for it. We need to continue to push for that kind of brazen truth-telling -- about gender, certainly, about class, for sure. That's what politics is supposed to be about -- not partisanship or strategic spinning, but honesty and uplift..
Yes you are right that we needed to have "that" conversation, but it wasn't good enough and eventually Obama was forced to throw the Rev. Wright and ALL that he was about under the bus in a big way in order to stay viable as a candidate.
Now McCain's batshit insane "spiritual advisor" (Hagee) can continue on with his litany of retarded preaching and all McCain had to do was renounce the endorsement. Case closed. He was not forced to go back and apologize and totally disconnect himself from the hate mongering, lying Hagee.
Hmmm... seems like a pretty big difference in this situation to me.
And yes, maybe to overcome some of your naivety could check out your candidate's positions on the issues.
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Posted by: bizeeb on Jun 18, 2008 5:15 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hillary Clinton is to femminism what Clarence Thomas is to Black Power. Neither Obamma nor Clinton, or ANYONE ELSE that the media allows to get this far, are going to stop the continuation of the American Empire. They don't even want to! Listen very closely, and critically, to what Obbama and Clinton have repeatedly said about the use American military power (and budget) and it becomes clear that the "War on Terror" will not be ending anytime soon. I highly reccomend that all alternet users go to politicalcompass.org and complete the 5 minute survey that then maps your idealogical position on a chart. Then compare where you stand in relation to Obbama/Clinton. Even more interesting though, is how closely Obbama/Clinton are to Bush/McCain.
As to your statement "as if there is a 'right' way to vote if I am a feminist" there usually is actually. Pro choice or not. I can't think of a single (partisan) election - i.e. not a primary - that it wasn't completely obvious who to vote for if you are at all left wing.
I get really tired of people saying "I don't like the whole liberal/conservative dichotomy, things are much more complex than that, I look at the individual candidate and make my decision based on their stand on the various issues blah blah blah." Spoken like a true Reagan Democrat. Pick a side. Actually the two sides that we get to choose from at election time are, as Nader pointed out, not different sides at all, just slightly different versions of the same thing.
Lastly, if you actually think that all of those young voters that registered to vote, actually will vote in November, (remember "Rock the Vote" and "Vote or Die") than you're a complete fool. McCain, sadly, stands a very real chance of becoming the 44th President. (I hope and pray that I'm wrong.)
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Posted by: fdgsr on Jun 18, 2008 6:06 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We have dwelt too long on these handles and boxes to deal with real issues. I am a truthist. As a truthist, I can vote the real issues without fear of losing one or more of my handles or getting out of the box where I belong, or receiving a handle or being put into a box against my will. However, someone will assume that I am sexist, racist, socialist, or communist, or religionist, if I allow myself to be influenced ever so slightly by any of the real or artificial divisions we recognize in the vernacular.
Note the fear of the label anti-Semitism. All logic, good sense, reason, and democratic ideals melt to a mass of goo when men and women of otherwise good minds confront issues of human rights violations by Jews, failures of democracy in Israel, elections in America, sucking up to the common wisdom, or press coverage historic events. Note the fear of the racist label if one chooses a mate of a different race or ethnic origin. Note the fear of censure if one finds a single virtue in a tyrant or a fault in an icon of trust. Note the fear of being non-compliant it one does not wear a flag pin in public, or perform the salute to the flag or the national anthem exactly as prescribed. Note the impact of the statement, "I am a Catholic, but I am not very religious." or "I am very religious, but I am not Christian." or "I am Muslim, but I do not mistreat any people of the book." How about, "I am atheist, but extremely moral and kind to animals." Finally, "I am right because I have a right to believe whatever I want to."
"Judge not, lest you be judged, but judge, lest you be censured for violations of CW."
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Posted by: Phred42 on Jun 18, 2008 6:11 AM
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lol
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Posted by: lorenbliss on Jun 18, 2008 6:11 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Without recognition of class-struggle, the escalating atrocities of the present appear to be nothing more than random phenomenon coincidentally concentrated in place and time. But when class-struggle is acknowledged, those atrocities become part of a pattern of savagery traceable to the Abrahamic core-doctrines of divinely ordained male despotism, and perhaps to the very emergence of patriarchy some 5000 years ago.
But whatever the source of the savagery and however it is named -- whether it is exalted as “godliness” and imposed by “god’s chosen people,” labeled führerprinzip and enforced by übermenschen, or enshrined in law as “owner’s prerogatives” and “executive privilege” -- its principles are ultimately identical, and murderous oppression is always its result.
While the natural response to oppression is resistance, resistance without recognition of class-struggle invariably fails. Why? Because whether the oppressors find inspiration in the bible or Mein Kampf or the doctrines of corporate management or all of these, they have their motives and rationale clearly fixed in their predatory minds, and their depredations are thus not only purposefully vicious but often committed with sadistic relish. Nevertheless these hideous truths become obvious only through the clarifying lens of class-struggle
Alas, Courtney E. Martin’s generation -- and in fact every U.S. generation from the baby-boomers onward -- have been methodically denied not just the concept of class-struggle but every one of the many other vital instruments of consciousness-raising now gathering dust and cobwebs in a socialist toolbox too long scorned and belittled as irrelevant. More than anything else, it was by that denial -- that extended act of intellectual robbery -- the ruling class was able to subvert the New Deal and force all of us, the entire U.S. working class, ever closer to the ultimate degradation of genuine serfdom.
Thus Ms. Martin can proclaim what she supposes is a manifesto of radical values -- “we care deeply about issues of race, gender, class, and religion… we need to continue to push for that kind of brazen truth-telling -- about gender, certainly, about class, for sure” -- without the slightest possibility any of her assertions will ever threaten the ruling class with economic justice or loss of power. Though it is surely not Ms. Martin’s fault she has been intellectually robbed, she might as well be telling us all we need do to take back the country is “visualize change.”
If I may paraphrase Dan Nissenbaum’s comment above, “we need to transform society, and not just change the language by which we address injustice.” A good start -- for Ms. Martin as well as a great many others -- would be to read the works of Karl Marx and reflect on how the tyrannosaur of capitalism is far deadlier today than it was 150 years ago. Which is why Marxism -- instead of being obsolete -- is now more relevant than ever.
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» Good one, lorenbliss
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Posted by: lorenbliss
» RE: The Sad Intellectual Legacy of No Intellectual Legacy
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» RE: The Sad Intellectual Legacy of No Intellectual Legacy
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» RE: The Sad Intellectual Legacy of No Intellectual Legacy
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Posted by: hms2004 on Jun 18, 2008 7:12 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: WFT will she stand for?
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» RE: WFT will she stand for?
Posted by: BreeMass
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Posted by: ladyoracle on Jun 18, 2008 8:32 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here's what I mean: stand up for Hillary but vote for Obama. If you don't put your vote where your mouth is, then what good was your mouth or your vote? I think the reason that politically interested 20-somethings can't seem to get anything real done in the sociopolitical landscape is that very problem. We're all too divergent and only halfway come together sometimes, and ultimately we have no big group voice advocating for anything. So, in our little disparate corners of the globe we contradict ourselves guilt-free, according to this author. And it's mostly true, but not at all worth celebrating. This was the absurd mentality that caused my so-called feminist ex-boyfriend to think wearing t-shirts that made jokes about domestic violence was "ironic."
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» RE: A more authentic coversation? Let's start when you have somthing to say.
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Posted by: GreyFoxThree on Jun 18, 2008 8:45 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Johny Walton
Is your ISP spying on you?
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Posted by: Verjenie on Jun 18, 2008 9:25 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Puleeez stop the petty bickering. It aint silver and it aint gold
to dis, dis, dis.
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Posted by: pdxstudent on Jun 18, 2008 9:47 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When the "multitude of loyalties" is not taken as naturally given, but as ideological obfuscation, it's not hard to drop them to the side while rallying behind the one thing that matters most for every human being that has ever lived: how we get our living. This is an equal opportunity rallying point like none other: not only white, heterosexual men, but black, trans-gendered women all have to worry about it. All are conditioned by it. The working-poor in Mexico and China and the United States already have more in common than multiculturalists pre-suppose by foregrounding (i.e. commodifying) their culture before their material conditions of existence.
There is no real obstacle to organizing. Our info-matic culture is ripe---and at the rate we're going about it, as corporations and other Capitalist interests take over the internet like they have the air-waves, in danger of rotting---for the revolutionary organization. The biggest danger is purely ideological, and it comes variously in the form of nation, sex, race, religion, age, sexual orientation. These are not the categories that fundamentally determine how you get your living; they mitigate it for sure. They are identities generated by our economic activity, but do not come before it. Political organizing on the basis of economic interest, in the interest of how we get our living, is not the only but the most basic and necessary form of political organization.
The only other sort of political concern that might dig deeper than economics is ecology, though I think they are really inseparable, and can only move forward when treated as such.
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Posted by: BreeMass on Jun 18, 2008 10:19 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» What Remarks?
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» RE: What Remarks?
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Posted by: arclight7 on Jun 18, 2008 11:45 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If anything, it's gone backwards.
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Posted by: prisonslavery on Jun 18, 2008 1:08 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This historic moment occurred on February 8, 1864 in the United States Senate when the great Abolitionist Senator from Massachusetts, Charles Sumner submitted his joint resolution S.B.24 for the then new Thirteenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would abolish all slavery forever.
S.B.24:
"Everywhere within the limits of the United States, and of each State or Territory thereof, all persons are equal before the law,
so that no person can hold another as a slave."
Senator Howard, Chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, attempted to discredit Sumner's proposition by appealing to the masculine insecurities and fears of the Senators with this statement:
"I suppose before the law a woman would be equal to a man, a woman would be as free as a man. A wife would be equal to her husband and as free as her husband before the law."
Sumner's joint resolution failed to get the endorsement of the Senate's Judiciary Committee. Instead, the proposition submitted by the self proclaimed slaveholder, Senator Henderson, of Missouri, passed the Senate on April 8, 1864.
Thirteenth Amendment:
"Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, EXCEPT AS A PUNISHMENT FOR CRIME WHEREOF THE PARTY SHALL HAVE BEEN DULY CONVICTED, shall exist within the United States or any place subject to their jurisdiction."
Courageously, Sumner opposed the stated EXCEPTION for slavery AS A PUNISHMENT FOR CRIME; and he further exposed its origins as coming from the 1787 Jeffersonian Ordinance, and sequentially from the Missouri State Constitution of February 15, 1819.
What would we, as a people, be today if Sumner's proposition had passed 144 years ago? Would we be free from all vestiges of black chattel slavery, would we have equality between men and women, would workers be free from wage slavery, would prisoners be free from "slavery…as a punishment for crime"; and would the world be free from war, poverty and hunger?
If we are products of our environment, and if our environment had changed in the positive with Sumner's proposition - what collective and individual values, privileges, material, social, political and economic advantages would we have otherwise gained. Would our environment now be free from slavery, racism, sexism, ageism, poverty, war, and corporate fascism?
However positive our lives could have changed, and however the cumulative differences might have been, the fact is that Sumner's proposition was defeated.
Senator Sumner, Chair of the Senate Select Committee on Slavery and the Treatment of Freedmen, stated:
"Beyond my general desire to see an act of universal emancipation that shall at once and forever settle this great question, so that it may no longer be the occasion of strife between us, there are two other ideas which are ever present to my mind as a practical legislator: first, to strike at slavery wherever I can hit it; and secondly, to clean the statute-book of all existing supports of slavery, so that it may find nothing there to which it may cling for life. To do less than this at the present moment, when slavery is still menacing, would be an abandonment of duty.
So long as a single slave continues anywhere beneath the flag of the Republic I am unwilling to rest. Too well I know the vitality of slavery with its infinite capacity of propagation, and how little slavery it takes to make a slave State with all the cruel pretensions of slavery…"
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» RE: One Emancipative Moment in History
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Posted by: mutantfromspace on Jun 18, 2008 1:12 PM
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Posted by: SusanMcGee on Jun 18, 2008 7:24 PM
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But it is also ageism to think that you and the people your age are the ONLY people who have the "answer" or answers.
Goodness, do you think only people your age embrace feminism as an ideology that incorporates work around race, genders, orientations, faiths, abilities, etc. etc. etc.?
Do you think only people your age are able to incorporate an analysis that includes being anti-racist and anti-sexist?
Boomers are not monolithic. Individuals and collectives in the late 60s and early 70s started some revolutionary movements in the United States.
Read some history. Look at the history of resistance movements in the United States, not just feminism and civil rights, but environmental movements, anti-nuclear power movements, health care movements to ban cigarettes, etc. etc. etc.
Learn some humility, for gosh sakes.
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Posted by: desidid on Jun 19, 2008 4:54 AM
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Posted by: Mahogany1 on Jun 19, 2008 11:07 PM
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» RE: Don't want to rock the boat
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Posted by: daniel347x on Jun 18, 2008 4:06 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Overcoming the race-gender dichotomy by saying "they're both fantastic" is like saying I support gay rights - you can take me seriously because I'm not gay myself. ("I want to overcome the race-gender divide - and you can take me seriously because I'm a big fan of both of them.")
Near the end, the author gives a token statement about the need to call into question the whole idea of empire, but does not see the glaring contradiction with the fact that Hillary Clinton and likely Barack Obama are massively in support of empire and of capitalism.
Building a movement against dwarfing class disparity and capitalism is a tremendous task that needs to be undertaken with the support and in coalition with movements for women's justice and civil rights, labor movements and the many other movements for human and social justice. It cannot be relegated to a token comment at the end of an article because it sounds nice there.
We need to transform society, and not just change the power dynamics of injustice.
Dan Nissenbaum
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» Then this articles is a busllshit sandwich
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» RE: Then this articles is a busllshit sandwich
Posted by: emmas
» RE: Hillary like W. was born with a Silver foot in her mouth
Posted by: Purple Girl
» RE: Hillary like W. was born with a Silver foot in her mouth
Posted by: daniel347x
» RE: Hillary like W. was born with a Silver foot in her mouth
Posted by: hagwind
» RE: Hillary like W. was born with a Silver foot in her mouth
Posted by: Moira61
» RE: Tragic: "Refusing the Race-Gender dichotomy" as a tool to ignore class
Posted by: Bozwell
» It's interesting how much Purple Girl and Bozwell...
Posted by: writer7
» Race/Gender is a smokescreen; It's time to examine the real problem
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» RE: Tragic: "Refusing the Race-Gender dichotomy" as a tool to ignore class
Posted by: hagwind
» I take it you're voting for Ron Paul then
Posted by: EinMD
» RE: I take it you're voting for Ron Paul then
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» Elections, Not Party
Posted by: pdxstudent
» Typo
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» RE: Elections, Not Party
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» They Don't Count Though
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» RE: They Don't Count Though
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Posted by: Purple Girl on Jun 18, 2008 4:55 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My Genereation ('63)was caught between the Boomers and the so called 'Me' Generation. I've come to Regard the reference to Me as meaning- who will have to carry the weight of the Boomers as they Age- Me. Who will have to clean Up the Mess they've left behind- Me. Who will have to be a worker until death to help the next generation not have to carry the load Alone- Me.But I am glad to help. I find Your Generation a generation which enjoys the perks, but recognizes their community responsiblity. You may be the first generation to truely embrace all that our Founding Fathers Dreamed of ...Equality & justice for All.
The Boomers got so caught up in their own 'entitlements',Their own Self righteousness and their own Vendettas- they have forgotten about all those behend them and frankly those who they were to care for ahead of them. 'Spoiled Brats' my mother calls them- to young to be part of the 'Greatest Generation' ('33).
I always admired the 'Hippie ' Movement -wishing I could have been older- now I realize they were a Sham.
I now am thrilled to be able to be a help to this new generation of young adults who live up to the ideals the Boomers just Talked about.
So I will grant you this...In any way and in every way I will be there to be sure the Load is not to heavy for your Generation.I will not just cheer you on - I will be next to you.But beware the older gnerations have been playing con games and subliminal Deceptions for Decades- We must be viligent in detecting thier manipulations.
Note about the Womens Movement( which I cut my teenage teeth on in the late'70's)- It began as a Liberation movement , not a 'Pay Backs A Bitch'- our goal was to Prove we could earn our place at the table, not that we needed the bar lowered or special consideration and Treatment. it undermines our efforts. We also were a movement who knew we must fight for equality for All, not just ourselves. Women like Hillary & Ferraro have either forgotten our basic tenents or never had them to begin with.WE must play by the Rules,even when unfair- it only proves we can meet any challenge regardless of the obstacles- validates Us even more making it impossible to deny Us our place.Granted we want to change the way the game is played- but we have to get in it first, and on our own merits.That which does not kill us makes Us Strong.
Also I already have an appt today with the Flint Obama Office today to start putting not only my money -but my efforts where my mouth is....
Oh Yes WE Can!!!!
GoodBye Boomers, Your Time has Expired!
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» RE: This Lil Sis to the Boomers, Is Beaming Ear To Ear !
Posted by: Bozwell
» I am of the 50's and WE WERE the DEFINITION OF FEMINISM, Lived it,
Posted by: Turiye
» RE: I am of the 50's and WE WERE the DEFINITION OF FEMINISM, Lived it,
Posted by: hagwind
» Spoken like a true Baby Boomer...which you are
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» purple girl has a lot of free time on her/his? hands
Posted by: 113121
» RE: Spoken like a true Baby Boomer...which you are
Posted by: rclord
» Boomers just like to call people born in the early 60s boomers so they don't feel old.
Posted by: rclord
» I'm sorry, but statistically speaking, you're incorrect
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» even if all of what you said is true
Posted by: rclord
» Okay, let's go through this one more time...
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» I understand only too well
Posted by: rclord
» I didn't define it; I'm just imparting the information
Posted by: nochicagoboys
» I accept that the baby boom is a notably large increase in births...
Posted by: rclord
» It all derives from what's been historically called a "generation"
Posted by: nochicagoboys
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Posted by: ankhet on Jun 18, 2008 4:55 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Of course, actually taking a position on some issue is out of the question, as that might disturb the writer's atomic individualism.
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» RE: Kum-ba-ya
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» Seriously?
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Posted by: hagwind on Jun 18, 2008 4:55 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I could make similiar big sprawling generalizations about my generation (middle-of-the-boom boomers) too. We antiwar organizers were all-fired-up independent too. We didn't get suckered by the Socialist Workers Party, and when (some of) our elders talked about "party discipline" in the old Communist Party, we sniggered, "So you just followed orders, eh?" The major antiwar bills in Congress were often sponsored by a Democrat and a Republican -- McGovern-Hatfield, Cooper-Church -- so I don't think that shoot-yourself-in-the-foot partisanship was the order of the day then either, at least not for those working for social and political change.
I grew up listening to adults say stuff like "I vote for the man [sic], not the party." Maybe those men came from the same party 95% of the time, but still, many, many people thought they should be voting for the person, not the party. Courtney Martin refers to her generation's "tendency towards thinking and acting solo" -- it's not new; it's good ol' "rugged individualism" dressed up in new rhetoric, and it's a big honking problem in this country.
Get this: John McCain could be a paragon of political and personal virtues, I could agree with 95% of what he says -- but if he were the candidate of the Republican Party as currently constituted, no way in hell would I vote for him. If Barack Obama -- not a paragon, but definitely one of the best major-party presidential candidates I've seen in my lifetime -- were the candidate of the Republican Party as currently constituted, I wouldn't vote for him either.
Voting for "the person, not the party" is, at best, short-sighted. The person's allegiances -- who does she listen to, who makes big donations to his campaign, etc. -- are almost certainly going to have a much greater impact on performance in office than the person's character or what s/he says s/he is for or against. "Thinking and acting solo" is likewise. The labor movement wasn't organized by lone wolves and mavericks and people too fastidious to occasionally subordinate their own solo wills for the collective good. Ditto the civil rights movement. Ditto any movement that ever achieved anything in this country.
Courtney Martin's million-dollar question:
How, with a generation bent on individuality and multiplicity, do we confront racism, sexism and all the other insipid -isms that have been brought to light by this unprecedented campaign?
If it is, then the 1.5 million-dollar question is "Didn't you notice 'racism, sexism and all the other insipid -isms' before this campaign?" If not, why not? Maybe they weren't covered in your "Free to Be . . . You and Me" Celebrate Diversity class? Sheesh. FDR died six years before I was born, but somehow I managed to meet and learn from many, many people who lived through and organized during the Depression and the New Deal. I didn't meet them by "thinking and acting solo" -- I met them because of the movements I threw myself into. I learned a helluva lot about myself and my own circumstances through those movements. I learned a helluva lot about diversity, though "diversity" wasn't a buzzword then and we didn't call it that. Maybe Ms. Martin and her friends would benefit from similar exposure. Or maybe they just want to pontificate to each other in panel discussions while the rest of us shake our heads and mutter old-fart stuff about learning from history and reinventing the wheel.
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» RE: Oh, wow! Generation Y looks a lot like Generations A, B, C , D, etc.
Posted by: Bozwell
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Posted by: lefty010 on Jun 18, 2008 5:07 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My biggest point of contention lies here:
And we must demand that our candidates rise to the occasion, as I believe Obama did so beautifully with his speech on race following the Reverend Wright controversy. He brought that conversation to a new level, and we are all better off for it. We need to continue to push for that kind of brazen truth-telling -- about gender, certainly, about class, for sure. That's what politics is supposed to be about -- not partisanship or strategic spinning, but honesty and uplift..
Yes you are right that we needed to have "that" conversation, but it wasn't good enough and eventually Obama was forced to throw the Rev. Wright and ALL that he was about under the bus in a big way in order to stay viable as a candidate.
Now McCain's batshit insane "spiritual advisor" (Hagee) can continue on with his litany of retarded preaching and all McCain had to do was renounce the endorsement. Case closed. He was not forced to go back and apologize and totally disconnect himself from the hate mongering, lying Hagee.
Hmmm... seems like a pretty big difference in this situation to me.
And yes, maybe to overcome some of your naivety could check out your candidate's positions on the issues.
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Posted by: bizeeb on Jun 18, 2008 5:15 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hillary Clinton is to femminism what Clarence Thomas is to Black Power. Neither Obamma nor Clinton, or ANYONE ELSE that the media allows to get this far, are going to stop the continuation of the American Empire. They don't even want to! Listen very closely, and critically, to what Obbama and Clinton have repeatedly said about the use American military power (and budget) and it becomes clear that the "War on Terror" will not be ending anytime soon. I highly reccomend that all alternet users go to politicalcompass.org and complete the 5 minute survey that then maps your idealogical position on a chart. Then compare where you stand in relation to Obbama/Clinton. Even more interesting though, is how closely Obbama/Clinton are to Bush/McCain.
As to your statement "as if there is a 'right' way to vote if I am a feminist" there usually is actually. Pro choice or not. I can't think of a single (partisan) election - i.e. not a primary - that it wasn't completely obvious who to vote for if you are at all left wing.
I get really tired of people saying "I don't like the whole liberal/conservative dichotomy, things are much more complex than that, I look at the individual candidate and make my decision based on their stand on the various issues blah blah blah." Spoken like a true Reagan Democrat. Pick a side. Actually the two sides that we get to choose from at election time are, as Nader pointed out, not different sides at all, just slightly different versions of the same thing.
Lastly, if you actually think that all of those young voters that registered to vote, actually will vote in November, (remember "Rock the Vote" and "Vote or Die") than you're a complete fool. McCain, sadly, stands a very real chance of becoming the 44th President. (I hope and pray that I'm wrong.)
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» Paragraph breaks
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» RE: Paragraph breaks
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Posted by: fdgsr on Jun 18, 2008 6:06 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We have dwelt too long on these handles and boxes to deal with real issues. I am a truthist. As a truthist, I can vote the real issues without fear of losing one or more of my handles or getting out of the box where I belong, or receiving a handle or being put into a box against my will. However, someone will assume that I am sexist, racist, socialist, or communist, or religionist, if I allow myself to be influenced ever so slightly by any of the real or artificial divisions we recognize in the vernacular.
Note the fear of the label anti-Semitism. All logic, good sense, reason, and democratic ideals melt to a mass of goo when men and women of otherwise good minds confront issues of human rights violations by Jews, failures of democracy in Israel, elections in America, sucking up to the common wisdom, or press coverage historic events. Note the fear of the racist label if one chooses a mate of a different race or ethnic origin. Note the fear of censure if one finds a single virtue in a tyrant or a fault in an icon of trust. Note the fear of being non-compliant it one does not wear a flag pin in public, or perform the salute to the flag or the national anthem exactly as prescribed. Note the impact of the statement, "I am a Catholic, but I am not very religious." or "I am very religious, but I am not Christian." or "I am Muslim, but I do not mistreat any people of the book." How about, "I am atheist, but extremely moral and kind to animals." Finally, "I am right because I have a right to believe whatever I want to."
"Judge not, lest you be judged, but judge, lest you be censured for violations of CW."
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Posted by: Phred42 on Jun 18, 2008 6:11 AM
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lol
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Posted by: lorenbliss on Jun 18, 2008 6:11 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Without recognition of class-struggle, the escalating atrocities of the present appear to be nothing more than random phenomenon coincidentally concentrated in place and time. But when class-struggle is acknowledged, those atrocities become part of a pattern of savagery traceable to the Abrahamic core-doctrines of divinely ordained male despotism, and perhaps to the very emergence of patriarchy some 5000 years ago.
But whatever the source of the savagery and however it is named -- whether it is exalted as “godliness” and imposed by “god’s chosen people,” labeled führerprinzip and enforced by übermenschen, or enshrined in law as “owner’s prerogatives” and “executive privilege” -- its principles are ultimately identical, and murderous oppression is always its result.
While the natural response to oppression is resistance, resistance without recognition of class-struggle invariably fails. Why? Because whether the oppressors find inspiration in the bible or Mein Kampf or the doctrines of corporate management or all of these, they have their motives and rationale clearly fixed in their predatory minds, and their depredations are thus not only purposefully vicious but often committed with sadistic relish. Nevertheless these hideous truths become obvious only through the clarifying lens of class-struggle
Alas, Courtney E. Martin’s generation -- and in fact every U.S. generation from the baby-boomers onward -- have been methodically denied not just the concept of class-struggle but every one of the many other vital instruments of consciousness-raising now gathering dust and cobwebs in a socialist toolbox too long scorned and belittled as irrelevant. More than anything else, it was by that denial -- that extended act of intellectual robbery -- the ruling class was able to subvert the New Deal and force all of us, the entire U.S. working class, ever closer to the ultimate degradation of genuine serfdom.
Thus Ms. Martin can proclaim what she supposes is a manifesto of radical values -- “we care deeply about issues of race, gender, class, and religion… we need to continue to push for that kind of brazen truth-telling -- about gender, certainly, about class, for sure” -- without the slightest possibility any of her assertions will ever threaten the ruling class with economic justice or loss of power. Though it is surely not Ms. Martin’s fault she has been intellectually robbed, she might as well be telling us all we need do to take back the country is “visualize change.”
If I may paraphrase Dan Nissenbaum’s comment above, “we need to transform society, and not just change the language by which we address injustice.” A good start -- for Ms. Martin as well as a great many others -- would be to read the works of Karl Marx and reflect on how the tyrannosaur of capitalism is far deadlier today than it was 150 years ago. Which is why Marxism -- instead of being obsolete -- is now more relevant than ever.
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» Good one, lorenbliss
Posted by: hagwind
» RE: Good one, lorenbliss
Posted by: lorenbliss
» RE: The Sad Intellectual Legacy of No Intellectual Legacy
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» RE: The Sad Intellectual Legacy of No Intellectual Legacy
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» RE: The Sad Intellectual Legacy of No Intellectual Legacy
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Posted by: hms2004 on Jun 18, 2008 7:12 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: WFT will she stand for?
Posted by: Bozwell
» RE: WFT will she stand for?
Posted by: BreeMass
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Posted by: ladyoracle on Jun 18, 2008 8:32 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here's what I mean: stand up for Hillary but vote for Obama. If you don't put your vote where your mouth is, then what good was your mouth or your vote? I think the reason that politically interested 20-somethings can't seem to get anything real done in the sociopolitical landscape is that very problem. We're all too divergent and only halfway come together sometimes, and ultimately we have no big group voice advocating for anything. So, in our little disparate corners of the globe we contradict ourselves guilt-free, according to this author. And it's mostly true, but not at all worth celebrating. This was the absurd mentality that caused my so-called feminist ex-boyfriend to think wearing t-shirts that made jokes about domestic violence was "ironic."
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» RE: A more authentic coversation? Let's start when you have somthing to say.
Posted by: BreeMass
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Posted by: GreyFoxThree on Jun 18, 2008 8:45 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Johny Walton
Is your ISP spying on you?
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Posted by: Verjenie on Jun 18, 2008 9:25 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Puleeez stop the petty bickering. It aint silver and it aint gold
to dis, dis, dis.
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Posted by: pdxstudent on Jun 18, 2008 9:47 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When the "multitude of loyalties" is not taken as naturally given, but as ideological obfuscation, it's not hard to drop them to the side while rallying behind the one thing that matters most for every human being that has ever lived: how we get our living. This is an equal opportunity rallying point like none other: not only white, heterosexual men, but black, trans-gendered women all have to worry about it. All are conditioned by it. The working-poor in Mexico and China and the United States already have more in common than multiculturalists pre-suppose by foregrounding (i.e. commodifying) their culture before their material conditions of existence.
There is no real obstacle to organizing. Our info-matic culture is ripe---and at the rate we're going about it, as corporations and other Capitalist interests take over the internet like they have the air-waves, in danger of rotting---for the revolutionary organization. The biggest danger is purely ideological, and it comes variously in the form of nation, sex, race, religion, age, sexual orientation. These are not the categories that fundamentally determine how you get your living; they mitigate it for sure. They are identities generated by our economic activity, but do not come before it. Political organizing on the basis of economic interest, in the interest of how we get our living, is not the only but the most basic and necessary form of political organization.
The only other sort of political concern that might dig deeper than economics is ecology, though I think they are really inseparable, and can only move forward when treated as such.
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» RE: Workers of the World Say: I Contain Multitudes
Posted by: ankhet
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Posted by: BreeMass on Jun 18, 2008 10:19 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» What Remarks?
Posted by: pdxstudent
» RE: What Remarks?
Posted by: BreeMass
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Posted by: arclight7 on Jun 18, 2008 11:45 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If anything, it's gone backwards.
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Posted by: prisonslavery on Jun 18, 2008 1:08 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This historic moment occurred on February 8, 1864 in the United States Senate when the great Abolitionist Senator from Massachusetts, Charles Sumner submitted his joint resolution S.B.24 for the then new Thirteenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would abolish all slavery forever.
S.B.24:
"Everywhere within the limits of the United States, and of each State or Territory thereof, all persons are equal before the law,
so that no person can hold another as a slave."
Senator Howard, Chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, attempted to discredit Sumner's proposition by appealing to the masculine insecurities and fears of the Senators with this statement:
"I suppose before the law a woman would be equal to a man, a woman would be as free as a man. A wife would be equal to her husband and as free as her husband before the law."
Sumner's joint resolution failed to get the endorsement of the Senate's Judiciary Committee. Instead, the proposition submitted by the self proclaimed slaveholder, Senator Henderson, of Missouri, passed the Senate on April 8, 1864.
Thirteenth Amendment:
"Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, EXCEPT AS A PUNISHMENT FOR CRIME WHEREOF THE PARTY SHALL HAVE BEEN DULY CONVICTED, shall exist within the United States or any place subject to their jurisdiction."
Courageously, Sumner opposed the stated EXCEPTION for slavery AS A PUNISHMENT FOR CRIME; and he further exposed its origins as coming from the 1787 Jeffersonian Ordinance, and sequentially from the Missouri State Constitution of February 15, 1819.
What would we, as a people, be today if Sumner's proposition had passed 144 years ago? Would we be free from all vestiges of black chattel slavery, would we have equality between men and women, would workers be free from wage slavery, would prisoners be free from "slavery…as a punishment for crime"; and would the world be free from war, poverty and hunger?
If we are products of our environment, and if our environment had changed in the positive with Sumner's proposition - what collective and individual values, privileges, material, social, political and economic advantages would we have otherwise gained. Would our environment now be free from slavery, racism, sexism, ageism, poverty, war, and corporate fascism?
However positive our lives could have changed, and however the cumulative differences might have been, the fact is that Sumner's proposition was defeated.
Senator Sumner, Chair of the Senate Select Committee on Slavery and the Treatment of Freedmen, stated:
"Beyond my general desire to see an act of universal emancipation that shall at once and forever settle this great question, so that it may no longer be the occasion of strife between us, there are two other ideas which are ever present to my mind as a practical legislator: first, to strike at slavery wherever I can hit it; and secondly, to clean the statute-book of all existing supports of slavery, so that it may find nothing there to which it may cling for life. To do less than this at the present moment, when slavery is still menacing, would be an abandonment of duty.
So long as a single slave continues anywhere beneath the flag of the Republic I am unwilling to rest. Too well I know the vitality of slavery with its infinite capacity of propagation, and how little slavery it takes to make a slave State with all the cruel pretensions of slavery…"
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» RE: One Emancipative Moment in History
Posted by: desidid
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Posted by: mutantfromspace on Jun 18, 2008 1:12 PM
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Posted by: SusanMcGee on Jun 18, 2008 7:24 PM
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But it is also ageism to think that you and the people your age are the ONLY people who have the "answer" or answers.
Goodness, do you think only people your age embrace feminism as an ideology that incorporates work around race, genders, orientations, faiths, abilities, etc. etc. etc.?
Do you think only people your age are able to incorporate an analysis that includes being anti-racist and anti-sexist?
Boomers are not monolithic. Individuals and collectives in the late 60s and early 70s started some revolutionary movements in the United States.
Read some history. Look at the history of resistance movements in the United States, not just feminism and civil rights, but environmental movements, anti-nuclear power movements, health care movements to ban cigarettes, etc. etc. etc.
Learn some humility, for gosh sakes.
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Posted by: desidid on Jun 19, 2008 4:54 AM
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Posted by: Mahogany1 on Jun 19, 2008 11:07 PM
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» RE: Don't want to rock the boat
Posted by: desidid
MoveOn Launches Campaign for Bold Progressive Reforms as the Obama Era Begins
Obama's Promise of Change Comes Wrapped in Red, White and Blue
Reactions to Obama's Historic Moment From Around the Globe




