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Election 2008

Will Wall Street's Meltdown Turn America Into a Police State?

By Scott Thill, AlterNet. Posted September 30, 2008.


Failing banks? Endless war? Call Homeland Security.
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"Raw capitalism is dead." -- Henry Paulson, U.S. Treasury secretary

"Can't we just all go out and say things are OK?" -- President Bush, to congressional leaders during bailout negotiations

I'm not much of an Army Times reader, but after reading that a brigade was shipping from Iraq in October to serve as "an on-call federal response force for natural or manmade emergencies and disasters, including terrorist attacks" in the homeland right before the election, my antennae perked up. Same as they did when I read that an electoral college doomsday scenario exists in which Dick Cheney casts the deciding vote that gives McCain-Palin the White House.

That is, if Cheney and Bush don't take it for themselves. That may sound like fantasy, but don't kill the messenger. They are all strands of the Gordian knot the Bush administration has tied around the neck of the American people for the last two presidential terms, best represented today by the failed bailout of banks, brokers and other complicit parties that have since jacked the American people out of trillions. And while the Army Times revelation or election doomsday may turn out to be paranoia rather than prescience, the evidence just isn't there.

Like I said: antennae.

They've come in handy as bullshit detectors since Bush stole the election from a flat-footed Al Gore and set about engineering the greatest transfer of public wealth into private hands in American history. If you factor in Monday's failed takeover, as well as the $5 trillion the American people now owe thanks to the "bailout" of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, not to mention the continuing hyper-expensive occupation of Iraq and so on, our citizenry is now so far in the hole that it's pointless griping about numbers. If you want one, use the figure put forth by Dennis Kucinich: half a quadrillion dollars. We have evolved past the point of economic or geopolitical reality and entered a phase of pure concept.

And all vectors of that phase point toward the conclusion that the proverbial shit has totally hit the fan -- head on, and all over again.

Meet the New Rome, Same as the Old Rome

"Franklin Roosevelt had to save capitalism from itself," Los Angeles Times business editor Tom Petruno told me as Washington Mutual and Wachovia became the latest banking dominoes to fall. "Is history repeating?"

Indeed, it is, as one could tell from the repetitive usage of loaded terms and phrases like "Great Depression," "meltdown," "apocalypse," "Armageddon" and more to describe the just-on-time cratering of the American economy. After the strange bedfellows in both parties torpedoed Bush, Bernanke and Paulson's so-called bailout, more than $1 trillion of market value in American equities disappeared in a single day. The Dow Jones average set a record for quickest suicide dive in a single day. Other indexes sunk to multiyear lows, wiping out years of value, and stocks across the board went negative like Ann Coulter. In fact, the only major stock that actually advanced on Monday was Campbell Soup.

Can there be a more fitting metaphor for the American economy stuck beneath the Bush administration's thumb?

But the reruns, and their loaded terminology, are merging: Bush himself is just another iteration of the infamous "New World Order" instituted by his father while trying to, what else, convince the American public that it needed to go to war against Saddam Hussein. The revisionism is transparent, befitting a government that cares nothing of what its people actually think. Jon Stewart of "The Daily Show" recently juxtaposed Bush's address on the financial cataclysm with his pre-invasion speech in 2003 and found -- surprise! -- they were exactly the same.


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See more stories tagged with: bush, election08, civil liberties, paulson, bailout

Scott Thill runs the online mag Morphizm.com. His writing has appeared on Salon, XLR8R, All Music Guide, Wired and others.

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The First Thing to Do is Stop This Bailout ...
Posted by: mmckinl on Sep 30, 2008 12:55 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can not afford to throw $700 billion Dollars to Wall Street. Paulson has already shown he plays favorites. By lending AIG $85 Million he saved his old firm Goldman Sacks $20 billion.

The rest of the $700 Billion will parceled out the same way ... to the Wall Street Boys Club.

Call Capitol Hill Now. I know many of you have called already ... Call Again !

We need to start taking a stand and this is as good a place as any ...


Find Your Reps By Zip

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Paranoia or a rational reaction?
Posted by: NoMcCainPalin on Sep 30, 2008 1:44 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
By definition, "paranoia" is a disturbed thought process characterized by excessive fear.

In my mind, the operative term is "excessive."

If "excessive" fear is created by a president who did that previously to scare the American people --like Bush did before the Iraq invasion -- I think that worrying about a possible police state is completely rational.

The most likely scenario would be an economic meltdown in which panicked people began withdrawing all their funds from banks. If that happened, I could easily see riots breaking out followed by martial law -- especially if Stupid Sarah and her senile running mate are in charge.

Finally, if you are an undecided voter, learn the truth about Mean Old McCain and his so-called "heroic" war record) by clicking on: Vote Against McCain (one of the HOTTEST anti-McCain sites on the Web)

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NSPD51 - the vehicle Bush can use
Posted by: kegbot1 on Sep 30, 2008 4:57 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thill writes an excellent article but fails to note the mechanics of what Bush could do.

This is the link to Directive 51:

http://tinyurl.com/yqthor

Enacted in May 2007, it allows the POTUS to essentially take over functions of government in the event of what can only be called broadly defined emergencies. Read it and understand that this gives the POTUS incredible leeway (of course Bush has this already with signing statements and a host of other executive orders) to, in essence, declare martial law.

In fact, this crisis gives Bush a golden opportunity to use 51 if he wants to. With Congress out of town, if things get much worse, Bush can say Congress has abdicated their responsibility to the nation and that he, the President, is forced for the good of the country, to invoke 51 and step in.

And who would stop him? Really?

Remember you read it here first.

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» RE: NSPD51 - the vehicle Bush can use Posted by: purplewarrior
» Possible reasons already in place Posted by: truthlover
I AM NOT AFRAID
Posted by: caru on Sep 30, 2008 4:58 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
WE ALL NEED TO MOVE INTO A POST PETROLEUM LOCAL ECONOMY.

PERMACULTURE LIVES!

CAPITALISM DIES!

COOPERATION LIVES!

COMPETITION DIES!

I AM NOT AFRAID OF ANYTHING - THE POLICE STATE WILL COLLAPSE INTO ITS EVIL SELF. I BELIEVE IN LIFE ON EARTH. I ENCOURAGE ALL TO OPEN YOUR HEARTS AND FORGET ABOUT THE ILLUSION OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. WE ARE SPIRITUAL BEINGS ON THE MOST BEAUTIFUL PLANET FOR LIGHT YEARS. WE DO NOT NEED THE MARKET TO FEEL SAFE. WE DO NOT NEED MILLIONAIRES AND BILLIONAIRES TO FEEL SAFE. WE ONLY NEED THE GREEN EARTH AND THE BLUE OCEANS AND SKY.


DISASTER WILL CONSUME ITS OWN DISASTER. LET THE MARKET AND CAPITALISM FAIL. LET THE POLICE STATE FAIL. LET THE FEDERAL RESERVE FAIL. LETS RETURN TO A STATE OF PLANETARY HEALTH.


OM SHANTI.

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» RE: I AM NOT AFRAID. GOODY! Posted by: Nightstallion
» RE: I AM NOT AFRAID. GOODY! Posted by: sirios
» RE: I AM NOT AFRAID Posted by: Dboy
» CARU FOR PRESIDENT Posted by: HoboHomo
» RE: I AM NOT AFRAID Posted by: kittybrat
Ok this is the sixth time on Alternet I've said it
Posted by: witchjug on Sep 30, 2008 5:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Come January we will be burning cash to keep warm and beating up old people for their gold fillings.

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MELTDOWN REVEALS RACIST OLIGARCHY
Posted by: Al-Arkam on Sep 30, 2008 5:18 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From its birth the USA has always been a racist oligarchy, never a true democracy. The current meltdown and the corrupt ruling class' plans to ignite more unjust wars with Iran and Venezuela, while crushing most of the middle class and eradicating most of the poor at home, simply force the masses to see through the facade of liberal democracy. The forty million slave descendants inside the USA, like all 250 million slave descendants in the West, continue to suffer from intense ethnocide and forced assimilation. By imposing these evil practices on us the U.S. government is blatantly violating United Nations Covenants. We the Afrodescendants must accelerate our battle for Human Rights and Reparations, then engage in an orderly Exodus, or face extinction in a dying empire.
As-Salaam-Alalikum,
Minister Malik Al-Arkam
www.allforreparations.org

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» I'VE BEEN HOODWINKED Posted by: hoorah
THE BANKERS HAVE BEEN GIVEN A LEGAL MONOPOLY ON THE DISTRIBUTION OF
Posted by: Raymond Emerson on Sep 30, 2008 5:19 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the capital necessary for our economy to function. They have now screwed it up. You know and I know that the working stiff is going to catch the results. Lets try to put some padding down so he won't get hit so hard. Then the monopoly needs to be broken.

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Dear author, I grew up in post WWII America when people were not afraid of the police.
Posted by: Nightstallion on Sep 30, 2008 5:25 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They may now kill or maim on suspicion. ANY movement on your part after police arrive may be considered resisting arrest. You may have a right to a free trial but you do not have the right to be treated with dignity. You will be treated guilty until proven innocent and you will never even complain about the change in behavior because you weren’t born till after the change took place!

NO ONE WAS EVER CUFFED IN A CAR ON SUSPICION OF ANYTHING BEFORE 1962;
ONLY THOSE WHO RESISTED WITH DEADLY FORCE WERE CUFFED BUT, NOW
YOU STUPID ASSHOLES WILL TOLERATE THAT TREATMENT AS COMPLYING
WITH YOUR OPPRESSOR! YOU HAVE BEEN BRAINWASHED INTO ACCEPTING THIS
TREATMENT BY POLICE MENTALITY TELEVISION SHOWS THAT AGGRANDISE
THIS TREATMENT OF YOU AND SOME OF YOU EVEN SWILL YOUR BEER AND
SHOUT HURRAH HEIL AND VIVA AND CRY BRING ON THE POPCORN! YOU
DESERVE THIS FUCKING POLICE STATE AND I HOPE TO RUB YOUR NOSES IN IT!
IT IS YOUR POWERFUL BRAINS WHO HAVE ARRANGED THIS SHIT FOR
EVERYONE! THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE PSYCHOLOGIES OF A POLICE
OFFICER AND A CRIMINAL IS THE FUCKING BADGE! I SERVED TIME IN PULASKI
COUNTY INDIANA IN A COUNTY SHERRIFS OFFICE AS AN RTO IN TRAINING AND
KNOW THIS TO BE TRUE! I WATCHED! I LISTENED! AFTER TWO WEEKS & SOME
DAYS I WALKED OFF, BECAUSE I HAD JOINED TO PROTECT AND SERVE EVERYONE NOT JUST THE RICH ELITE!

You may lie to yourselves and everyone else little men but you cannot lie to me because I was there growing up when this change took place. At first I was cold with fear then I got really pissed off because no one would listen to me about this change I saw or they would say shit to me like: “Oh, gee well what the fuck over: what the fuck out!” Just shut it about that shit you can’t do anything about it anyway!

BTW: Hey Lisa! You still think I am nuts!? Read these articles and ask questions for a change don't just mimic your superiors commission generated crapola!

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» were not afraid of the police. Wow. Posted by: Nightstallion
» The stuff on television Posted by: robert.noll
» RE: The stuff on television Posted by: kegbot1
LOL we already ARE a Police State!
Posted by: GreyFoxThree on Sep 30, 2008 5:48 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
LOL, Dictator Bush and his Regime saw to it a long time ago that the US became a Police State. Are you really that blind?

Jiff
Online Privacy when it Counts

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The Vice President has no role in the electoral college
Posted by: Elmo409 on Sep 30, 2008 6:03 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Read the Constitution -- Article II Section 1 specifically grants to the House of Representatives the job of breaking a tie in the electoral college. The Vice President has no part in so doing.

Also, if there is no election, the terms of the current President and Vice President will expire simultaneously on January 20th which would put the succession onto the Speaker of the House -- whoever that might be at that time.

Military officers take an oath to defend and protect the Constitution first and to obey the orders of the President afterward. If the Constitution says that Nancy Pelosi is the President, my bet is that the military would support even her before they would support a coup led by an idiot and a thief.

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» One Shuddering In The Wilderness Posted by: Direct Democracy
It's like watching a financial 9/11...
Posted by: browsercat on Sep 30, 2008 6:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
...in slow motion. We spoke up, we stopped one version of the bailout, now let's stay together and keep up the pressure.

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usterroristnation
Posted by: usterroristnation on Sep 30, 2008 6:48 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We sure are living in some interesting times, are we not ? And not just in the US. Anyone read on the eve of the jewish new year where the chief israeli schmuck Ehud Olmert (where DO they get these names ??)declared his country would HAVE TO withdraw from all the land it illegally catured from the Palestinians and the Syrians in 1967 ! He said " I am not trying to justify retrospectively what we did for 35 years - for a large part of that time I was unwilling to look at reality in all it's depth ". He went on to say that such a move would have to include part of Jerusalem which was also illegally captured in 1967. This is the first honest statement to come out of the mouth of an israeli leader in over 40 years. And on such a momentous day around the world, thanks to the fruits of America's "financial terrorism" what do his jewish colleagues in Washington do ??? Why take a vacation of course. Is it any wonder America has got itself in so much trouble. Like so many things wrong with America the financial institutions are the problem AND the solution.

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» RE: usterroristnation Posted by: Dboy
» RE: usterroristnation Posted by: PirateJesus
If McCain win..yes! and here's why
Posted by: jeffrey7 on Sep 30, 2008 7:20 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
MY HOLIDAY WITH JOHN McCAIN

It was just before John McCain's last run at the presidential nomination in 2000 that my husband and I vacationed in Turtle Island in Fiji with John McCain, Cindy, and their children, including Bridget (their adopted Bangladeshi child).
It was not our intention, but it was our misfortune to be in close quarters with John McCain for almost a week, since Turtle Island has a small number of bungalows and their focus on communal meals force all vacationers who are there at the same time to get to know each other intimately.
He arrived at our first group meal and started reading quotes from a pile of William Faulkner books with a forest of Post-Its sticking out of them. As an English Literature major myself, my first thought was "if he likes this so much, why hasn't he memorized any of this yet?" I soon realized that McCain actually thought we had come on vacation to be a volunteer audience for his "readings" which then became a regular part of each meal. Out of politeness, none of the vacationers initially protested at this intrusion into their blissful holiday, but people's buttons definitely got pushed as the readings continued day after day.
Unfortunately this was not his only contribution to our mealtime entertainment. He waxed on during one meal about how Indo-Chine women had the best figures and that our American corn-fed women just couldn't meet up to this standard. He also made it a point that all of us should stop Cindy from having dessert as her weight was too high and made a few comments to Amy, the 25 year old wife of the honeymooning couple from Nebraska that she should eat less as she needed to lose weight.
McCain's appreciation of the beauty of Asian women was so great that David the American economist had to move his Thai wife to the other side of the table from McCain as McCain kept aggressively flirting with and touching her.
Needless to say I was irritated at his large ego and his rude behavior towards his wife and other women, but decided he must have some redeeming qualities as he had adopted a handicapped child from Bangladesh. I asked him about this one day, and his response was shocking: "Oh, that was Cindy's idea – I didn't have anything to do with it. She just went and adopted this thing without even asking me. You can't imagine how people stare when I wheel this ugly, black thing around in a shopping cart in Arizona . No, it wasn't my idea at all."
I actively avoided McCain after that, but unfortunately one day he engaged me in a political discussion which soon got us on the topic of the active US bombing of Iraq at that time. I was shocked when he said, "If I was in charge, I would nuke Iraq to teach them a lesson". Given McCain's personal experience with the horrors of war, I had expected a more balanced point of view. I commented on the tragic consequences of the nuclear attacks on Japan during WWII –- but no, he was not to be dissuaded. He went on to say that if it was up to him he would have dropped many more nuclear bombs on Japan. I rapidly extricated myself from this conversation as I could tell that his experience being tortured as a POW didn't seem to have mellowed out his perspective, but rather had made him more aggressive and vengeful towards the world.

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Now for the real truth.......
Posted by: jeffrey7 on Sep 30, 2008 7:34 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
America already is a 'Police State'!! Has been for more than 30 years. It started with Nixon and COINTELPRO. It was advanced by Bush 1
by making sure there are TWO OFFICER LEVEL CIA AGENTS in EVERY COUNTY in America spying on US!!!!
If you think you're free,try walking down the street in your underwear. Go to DC and mount a protest,it's our Right,but you'll be arrested for being so 'FREE'.
It's not Wall St melting down that we need to worry about. That will just make living hard on the rich,and,they could use a good 'dressing down'. It's the meltdown of the Bill of Rights that leads us into a 'Police State'. They used the OJ trial,and, Michael Jackson's child molestation case to secretly water down our Rights to Privacy,freedom of speech and our right to gather. That should have been the big story but OJ and Jacko 'buried the lead' as it's known in the business. If we are to get our country and our Rights back,which will not be easy, we need to remove ALL the 'elected ones' and put in fresh blood that owes no one except the people that can only contribute a vote and not $10,000.
Write-in Jeffrey 7 (Smith) for Prez '08

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The keys to defeating the Global Police State
Posted by: SevenStarHand on Sep 30, 2008 8:03 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Those "atop the pyramid" fear two things the most. Those are 1}-you finally learning the truth and growing wise and 2} everyone cooperating. You can thank me for saving your lives after we all cooperate to end this great deception.

Here is truth and wisdom...

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commendation fraud
Posted by: Howard on Sep 30, 2008 8:43 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
According to the atrocious and scandalous information that is beginning to seep into the news about what is really going on, maybe it is time for the Bush Administration to secure outrageous bonus payments for the people responsible for the economic crisis.

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BushCo is preparing for civil unrest - why?
Posted by: mgloraine on Sep 30, 2008 9:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The fact that they are preparing to counter civil unrest and possibly armed insurrection indicates that BushCo is planning to do something which could trigger a citizens' rebellion. Starting another war, declaring martial law, suspending the Constitution, dissolving Congress, cancelling elections...the mind fairly boggles at the possibilities.

Every day that Cheney and Bush continue to occupy their offices as if they were elected officials places our nation, our economy, our freedom, and our very lives in jeopardy. Cheney-Bush have already demonstrated their willingness to sacrifice American lives and to torture and murder entire populations for control of resources and personal wealth; is there any doubt that they are willing to start killing Americans at home to carry out the next phase of their crime spree? If we don't give them the $700B via Congressional capitulation, they'll come and take it anyway. If we don't vote for McCain, they'll change the vote counts to suit their whims, then use the army and mercenary death squads (Blackwater) to crush people who rise up in anger.

Extraordinary measures requiring extraordinary powers and the suspension of Constitutional norms have been the most consistent characteristic of all BushCo policies and plans for dealing with events, both foreign and domestic. We can not be surprised that they are planning unconstitutional "unusual solutions" for whatever events they may be engineering for the months to come.

I guess it's time to look for a way to flee the country before the shooting starts. A citizens' rebellion would meet with a brutal slaughter, and most of us are not armed or inclined toward martyrdom. Congress has betrayed us, and the former Supreme Court and Department of Justice are now just appendages of BushCo, so Americans are really on their own and under attack from a hostile fascist regime. What are our options?

I see the end of America coming, and it looks like BushCo is planning for a violent ending.

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» usterroristnation Posted by: usterroristnation
Thomas Jefferson's opinion of banking institutions' effect on Democracy
Posted by: fanny666 on Sep 30, 2008 9:52 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."
-Thomas Jefferson, in a letter to the Secretary of the Treasury Albert Gallatin (1802)

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» usterroristnation Posted by: usterroristnation
End of the Bush Presidency
Posted by: boing007 on Sep 30, 2008 9:54 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I see the end of America coming, and it looks like BushCo is planning for a violent ending.

Sieg Heil! Sieg Heil!

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pure contempt?
Posted by: o on Sep 30, 2008 10:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"We have evolved past the point of economic or geopolitical reality and entered a phase of pure concept."

fk concept, its contempt 99.99% pure contempt.

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Beekay
Posted by: purplewarrior on Sep 30, 2008 10:50 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yesterday, ,in a brief slip, one of the white house reporters stated that Bush was disappointed but had a "directive" that could deal with the problem. Did anyone else hear this? I have been talking about the Continuity of Government provisions issued in 2007 which include a definition of Catastrophe as an "economic" disruption affecting the US population. We need to take the ability of this executive order seriously. If the media and the White House, the Congress and all the experts continue to define this thing as a crisis we may well end up with a CRISIS where the Constitution is suspended and a transfer of power to another regime could well be blocked, in the name of "CONTINUITY". I have written every senator, every news person, and every Congressional leader I can think of and I get the standard thanks for your input bs. I like to think of myself as a concerned citizen performing my civic duty to remain informed...am i over the edge on this thing?

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» RE: Beekay Posted by: cherylholmes
» RE: Beekay Posted by: HoboHomo
» RE: Beekay Posted by: bluebirdella
» RE: Beekay Posted by: hilly7
Right Wing Psychoholic In Denial
Posted by: Right Wing Psychoholic In Denial on Sep 30, 2008 11:36 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I know...I know...the Corporate Evil Empire -or the corporate-military-police state-dumbing down corporate media-run amok economy-so on and so on-industrial complex. But look at the other ones in history like Estruscan Evil Empire or Commie Evil Empire or Roman Evil Empire or Nazi Evil Empire...now I forgot what I was going to say...nevermind.

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Fear Mongering Again, Presidential Threats
Posted by: cherylholmes on Sep 30, 2008 11:58 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
worked in the past...c

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/
2008/09/26/jon-stewart-bush
-bailout_n_129588.html

bear with me..this site wouldn't let me post the entire web address in one line...

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What if Wall Street Doesn't Melt?
Posted by: PaulK on Sep 30, 2008 12:56 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
What if the best time for a meltdown was last week, and it didn't actually happen because the free market covers shortages pretty fast when money is involved? What if we are all sitting around waiting for last week's financial Armageddon? The operating term here is "last week"!

Usually, when an apocalyptic cult meets for the end of the world and it doesn't happen, they try four or five times more and assume they just didn't get the exact date right.

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We pay the cops salary,we're their boss too.
Posted by: jeffrey7 on Sep 30, 2008 2:24 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you go to any city council meeting you see where the cops get their rules of engagement. The city council set out the rules and without great public input we get the corrupted mess we now call 'law enforcement'.
If you want cops to act different,change their rules. Rewrite their working orders. Take away their guns,take away their right to warrantless searches for a burnt out taillight,take away their ability to accuse folks of 'obstructing an officer'. They use that one as badly as they used 'routine road checks' back in the 70's. BTW that action was judged 'Unconstitutional'. So was the first 'Three strikes rule'.
We lost our Liberties because too many folks were soft enough between the ears to believe everything some 'suit' laid out to them as 'problems with society that needed fixing'.
Freedoms lost take a revolution to get back.
Jeffreson knew that and said so but in America if you say those things and not be quoting some 'founding father' they come for you.
The guys on Mt Rushmore would have been calling for revolution for 20 years now. They'd also be called 'Terrorists' now.
It's time to clean house from city hall down to DC. Make new rules,get new people that don't 'owe' some rich asshole. Make the cops true 'Peace officers' by making them work without the protections of unfair laws,excessive abuse of power and the tools of our own destruction of the Bill of Rights via their guns. If they want us to disarm then I say THEY DISARM FIRST!!!!! Anything less is rulership by Tyrants.
Write-in Jeffrey7 for Prez '08

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and obama is out stumping...
Posted by: undrgrndgirl on Sep 30, 2008 3:26 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
FOR the bailout

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It's Not So Much The Police State I'm Afraid Of
Posted by: MJ Fields on Sep 30, 2008 3:39 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm much more afraid of my fellow Americans completely losing their minds when things really get bad. I don't know that we are psychologically equipped for it. We are just not used to going without things like food, power, and services. What about the generations who don't know life before ATMs and the Internet? It'll be like the aftermath of Katrina cranked up to 11 (notice that there has been no post-Ike news coverage or pleas for donations!). People have trampled each other to get the last X Box for Christmas at Walmart. What will they to do to each other for the last ramen noodles at the 99-cent store?

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» There's an old saying... Posted by: QuestionAuthority
Remember LBJ's "guns and butter"?
Posted by: Garvagh on Sep 30, 2008 4:10 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
To maintain public support for the idiotic Vietnam War, Lyndon Johnson acted totally irresponsibly regarding the budget and taxes, because he believed that if Americans were taxed sufficiently to pay for the war on an on-going basis, they would stop the war. G W Bush played the same kind of grossly dishonest game, so that the insane "war" on "terror" could be carried on in the Middle East, "protecting" Israel and risking bankruptcy of the US. The house price bubble was an act of organized deception emanating from the neocon warmongers bunker in Washington, also known as the office of the VP.

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PLUGGING ALTERNET - America a police state? NOT WHILE THERE IS BREATH LEFT IN MY BODY
Posted by: foreverhope on Sep 30, 2008 4:48 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
....and as long as we have Alternet! In case you've missed it today is the last day of fundraising for our favorite place to be, which is right here. So please put some money in the kitty if you can do it. With our fragile imperfect democracy we need Alternet more now than ever before in history. With our media, mainstream or otherwise, under assault I concur with the brilliant truthiness of Thomas Jefferson:

"The basis of our governments being the opinion of the people, the very first object should be to keep that right; and were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter."

-- Thomas Jefferson
letter to Edward Carrington, 1787

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Allah Akbar
Posted by: Direct Democracy on Sep 30, 2008 7:31 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One of the few areas where Osama Bin Laden and I agree is that the extreme right needs to be pushed and goaded and given every opportunity to wear out their welcome.

Americans have been sitting on their fat asses hoping that someone else would do something about the fascist threat for a quarter of a century.

FREE AMERICA

REVOLUTIONARY (DIRECT) DEMOCRACY

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9/11 vibrated my antennae
Posted by: edgeofnowhere on Sep 30, 2008 8:05 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
big time. As I watched the WTC 1,2 and 7 explode and collapse, I did get sort of a bad feeling. In the following months and years, as the Bush/Cheney team put off the investigation and rammed through the Patriot Act, invaded Iraq etc etc., that feeling got worse. As FEMA and Blackwater operated like Nazis in New Orleans, and as FEMA "internment" camps began to spring up, my antennae were vibrating at max cycles per second. Watching the Storm Troopers in Denver and St. Paul didn't help. I just can't seem to shake the feeling that the PNAC Neocons who pulled off the 9/11 attacks are not just going to fade into the night and let Obama waltz into the White House. Here's a gang that deliberately blew up 3,000 of their own citizens to make things go their way. I wouldn't bet on them just walking away from their power. Naomi Klein had it right -- shock and awe is our fate I fear. Be it the financial meltdown, or popular protests evolving into uprisings, they did not put all the takeover tools in place for nothing. Good luck to us all.

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» RE: 9/11 vibrated my antennae Posted by: pjnaltykins
The Winner, Losers and who's really behind this.
Posted by: hilly7 on Sep 30, 2008 8:54 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This has been in the making for a long time now and it looks and smells just like history. Bush is nothing more than a lap dog. The real Purps behind this planned event is the World Bankers and they offspring, Central Banks. Bush can gain control if this is a national disaster, and it pretty well is that.

But what does TPTB have to fear, McCain is an even bigger puppet, and did anyone catch Obama? He wants to give money too. Peloski is too busy blowing Curious George. We are sooo screwed.

I called and emailed to say no, even though that meant losing my Teamsters's pension I had frozen, and I sell real estate, 2 whammies. What was worse however was my freedoms (illusions of that is) are even eroding more. If the bail out happens, sure we will send signals to China, Russia, and other countries that we are protecting their ignorant, greedy, buy out of America, but at what cost? The coast of the USA and her people. Our dollar will not be worth the 4 cents it is now.

I have this problem with rewarding rich, greedy, merciless assholes for screwing me and thousands more. I have a feeling this is going to get dirty but the odds are in our favor because we're wounded and backed into a corner.

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America and Capitalism are...
Posted by: davidnofaxpaydayloan on Oct 1, 2008 2:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
America and Capitalism are both based on the freedom of choice. We as Americans and Capitalists should have the financial freedom to choose how we use our money, and we should be able to choose where we get a loan. The fact that certain states are banning a financial resource such as the payday loan industry is ridiculous. These states are taking away the availability of a loan to those who need money quickly, who don’t have the credit to attain one from a bank, who only need a few hundred dollars loaned instead of thousands. Don’t let the legislation take away your financial freedom and vote for your rights as an American citizen.

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Many politicians...
Posted by: davidnofaxpaydayloan on Oct 1, 2008 2:47 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Many politicians are no friend to the payday loans industry. In order to raise voter support they choose to ignore what is best for the citizens. Some states including, Georgia, North Carolina, and Oregon have completely driven out the payday loan companies. Politicians still choose to disregard the benefits of the industry even though statistics in these states show a spike in bankruptcy filings, bounced checks and foreclosures. Even though these negative statistics have come to light, several governors are still trying to follow suit. If the efforts to wipe the industry completely off the map prove successful, some possible repercussions might consist of increased unemployment rates, more debt, more foreclosures and an even more inapt economy.

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usterroristnation
Posted by: usterroristnation on Oct 1, 2008 6:23 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here's an interesting item in Europe today - thanks to America's financial terrorism the whole world's financial systems are in tatters. I see that Ireland - one of Europe's smallest island countries (pop 4.5M) has put together a $630 Billion dollar package to protect Irish investors and financial institutions - overnite ! That's just about the same size as Congress is pissing about trying to achieve - the jewish godfathers that control the Federal Reserve Bank and the US financial system are to blame for most of this disaster. Does the world still think that America is a powerful mighty country ?? Maybe the US does not have the funds to do this bail out ?

Give us a break here please......terrorists YES!....ethical and prudent financial managers NO !

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Police State is ALREADY here.
Posted by: Reader11722 on Oct 1, 2008 10:28 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Battalions of US soldiers who were in Iraq are being flown home and are patrolling (at the behest of the President) American Streets. Elimination of Posse Comitatus, yet another infringement on our rights by the gov't. Add it to the ever-growing list of violations:
They violate the 1st Amendment by opening mail, caging demonstrators and banning books like "America Deceived" from Amazon, Wikipedia and Facebook.
They violate the 2nd Amendment by confiscating guns during Katrina.
They violate the 4th Amendment by conducting warrant-less wiretaps.
They violate the 5th and 6th Amendment by suspending habeas corpus.
They violate the 8th Amendment by torturing at Gitmo.
They violate the entire Constitution by starting illegal wars without declaration.
Impeach them all (both parties) and save this great country.
Last link (unless Google Books caves to the gov't and drops the title):
America Deceived (book)

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Kim
Posted by: Kimmer on Oct 1, 2008 11:16 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The situation we have right now is why we were given the second amendment by our founding fathers.

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Beekay
Posted by: purplewarrior on Oct 1, 2008 12:03 PM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The article is back on Army Times today (it was removed yesterday) about the brigade coming home to in part deal with "civil unrest". Although the posse comitatus fiasco wiped out by Bush was repealed in the appropriations bill, Bush did sign a signing statement that protects his authority if he declares a national emergency and suspending the constitution. This national emergency, as defined in the Homeland Security Presidential Directive signed in May 2007 for Continuity of Government includes in its catastrophic definitions...an "economic" crisis that affects the US population. Pay Attention...keep talking...Anyway there is still Blackwater if all else fails.

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» RE: Beekay Posted by: hilly7
HOW DOES IT FEEL?
Posted by: cori on Oct 1, 2008 8:08 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How does it feel to get ripped off?
How does it feel to lose your job or your home
while the fats cats steal our tax dollars and make us pay as we strggle to survive while they suck us dry? Now its half our hard earned tax dollars that go to them while you or your family needs medical care or medication or maybe an operation. How does it feel to have your civil rights gone as you try and find a good school for your kids or a college you can afford? And as they profess the need for trillions more how does it feel to be getting poor while they tax your money to make themselves rich? How does it feel to be left in a ditch? Have you had enough? Well it feels bad and we are all getting F't. So It's time to let them know we ain't gonna take it anymore. Cause we're sick of their lies and there criminal schemes that are leaving us all on an American garbage dump of lost dreams. How does it feel?

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one way to fight back
Posted by: grkjr on Oct 2, 2008 7:42 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As this evolves around a economic situation ..One solution which the american people, us, have yet to take is make a list of who votes for this in both the senate and house and then don't vote for them at re-election time.. if all those who are complaining about this, and thats most of the people, vote those in congress out of office who are going along with this bailout, it will set the tone to once again listen to the voters who put you in office... and then if you do that well for sometime then we may let you vote your own conscious which has for now failed you.. and us. That no vote is already for obama and mccain.. or just continue to yell and scream and run in circles.

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Trick Or Treat
Posted by: penobscotdziekuje@yahoo.com on Oct 2, 2008 10:11 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Halloween maybe weeks away, but for America's proletariat, we've been tricked. Even if a bail out of America's financial institutions is enacted, will taxpayers see any of that money again? No one knows.
All the trappings of a police state are already in place: failing banks, armed troops roaming the streets of American cities-New Orleans, Galveston, etc. and rising unemployment, among other things. The upcoming credit crunch will make it hard for people to get any kind of loan. So don't buy that sports car or McMansion yet.
Someone said the government should give each working person a million dollars to stabilize the economy, but that would only encourage more spending and consumption. We're in a bind and we will miss out on the Fed's treat.
Like in the Charlie Brown Halloween story, some kids will get candy (Wall Street) while other could get a rock (the working poor).

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police officer committed suicide after taser
Posted by: ktothez on Oct 2, 2008 12:05 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
To the writer and those that believe all police force are part of martial law: not ALL policemen are bad people and have no souls. This is a very sad story. While I'm not disagreeing with your article, we have to keep in mind that people are still human beings and do make mistakes, despite their position, badge, wealth, or leadership.

I have included the article since this site doesn't allow full links to be included.

http://www.ny1.com/content/
top_stories/86607/
lieutenant-involved- in-taser-incident-takes-his-own-life/
Default.aspx

The victim of a Taser incident in Brooklyn was laid to rest today, hours after the apparent suicide of the NYPD lieutenant who last week ordered his tasering.
Lieutenant Michael Pigott was found dead at Floyd Bennett Field in Brooklyn with a self-inflicted gun shot wound.

Floyd Bennett Field was the location where members of the Emergency Services Unit have been undergoing a refresher course this week on police procedures for dealing with emotionally-disturbed people.

"Upon behalf of all of the members of the New York City Police Department, I extend deepest condolences to the family and friends of Lt. Michael W. Pigott," said Police Commissioner Ray Kelly in a statement today.

Police have admitted their error in the decision to stun Iman Morales, who stood on a ledge last Wednesday outside his Bedford-Stuyvesant apartment and refused to get down.
Morales is being laid to rest today.

"It's just horrible," said Morales' aunt, Ann DeJesus Negron. "For me, it's horrible because I would never had wished it on anyone. We never wanted, of course, this for Iman and we would have never wanted this to happen to the officers at all."

Pigott, a 21-year veteran of the force, had been stripped of his badge and gun after the incident. The NYPD said Pigott violated department guidelines in ordering the use of the Taser.

Officer Nicholas Marchesona, who pulled the trigger on the Taser, has been placed on desk duty.

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Nation of Sheep
Posted by: eagleeye on Oct 4, 2008 3:09 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The American people simply do not care what happens. They are brain dead. Ride public transit and ask whoever is sitting next to you what their opinion is on any current issue. They have no opinion and don't want to know what yours is. They don't vote because they say that it is a waste of time, but in reality they are just too lazy and self center to care. Sixty per cent don't vote and have never in their lives voted. Freedom? Equality? Justice? These mean nothing to them. A police state wouldn't matter to them. They might even welcome it. It would erase whatever sense of responsibility they may have had. During the '30's Congress's strong man was asked by a reporter: "Will fascism come to America?" "Yes", he said, "but it will be called Americanism."

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The solution, brought to us by the people who caused the problem
Posted by: Don G on Oct 4, 2008 8:04 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Part of the solution is get rid of the people who caused it in the first place. Hear, in their own words, what they said about the impending crisis in 2004 in this video compilation;

http://tinyurl.com/3nkrp7

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Police State closer than we realize?
Posted by: marid on Oct 5, 2008 9:12 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just for a starter lookup REX 84 and read a bit. I cannot vouch for the veracity but it makes for chilling reading. Money was given to build these things, no bid contracts again.

Check "Secret March 13th Meeting of US House" again, I cannot couch for it but it did occur. Again chilling in the extreme.

Why does my small town police force, which has never had an officer shot, have body armor and assault rifles?

Those mass arrests we have had around the country in the past couple of years have snagged thousands but very few of them have been charged. What were they really practicing for?

Even the most unthinkable acts become possible when we are fooled into believing they are impossible. The Sheep better look up soon.

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It's ALREADY a Police State
Posted by: PointMan on Oct 6, 2008 6:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Since when could a "democracy" declare global war on a noun pumped by 1000 plus lies and sweep a coverup as big as 9/11 under the rug?

Wall Sreet "bailout" is just more police state double-talk.

Get real...

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Panic Engenders Panic
Posted by: baldhawk on Oct 9, 2008 9:33 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The article contains far too much emotion that make the contents shaky. I checked every link, which I presume was provided to substantiate the contentions, and it require a lot of imagination to draw the conclusions the author draws.

The press is making the disaster a lot bigger than the figures support. The financial markets have rushed ahead of the real economy since about 1986, generating a lot more liquidity than was warranted, thanks to the rash of deregulation.

The market is likely to drop back to about the price it was in 1986, about 8000 points, which is a closer reflection of the real economy.

Most Americans and other common people in the world go to work every day (save those who lost jobs for the financial community crimes and indiscretions). Production continues; people buy food, and things they need; you can still get loans; and you can take money out of the bank. Unfortunately, many companies have lost their source of liquidity to run their business, so they had to shut down.

The Economic Stabilization Act (Paulson's bailout) was primarily intended to save the financial community. But other protections to the main street real economy have been put in place. However, the provision of the act are vague in some details, and leave room for lots of rules to implement it. Whether it brings benefit or harm depends on who is in charge of implementing it; the Assistant Secretary of the Treasury is in charge of the implementation, and Paulson says he'll step out; he will appoint an interim Assistant Secretary.

We need to pay attention to have the right person on that post. We need to stay alert, and pay attention to learn facts and above all, basic economics.

We are not helpless. Good Luck.

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student
Posted by: jkford on Oct 9, 2008 10:53 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How do you do this stuff? I'm a journalism student now and have a hard time putting a 10 page paper together. You amaze me!

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