COMMENTS: 441
The Whole World Is Rioting as the Economic Crisis Worsens -- Why Aren't We?
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Explosive anger is spilling out onto the streets of Europe. The meltdown of the global economy is igniting massive social unrest in a region that has long been a symbol of political stability and social cohesion.
It's not a new trend: A wave of upheaval is spreading from the poorer countries on the periphery of the global economy to the prosperous core.
Over the past few years, a series of riots spread across what is patronizingly known as the Third World. Furious mobs have raged against skyrocketing food and energy prices, stagnating wages and unemployment in India, Senegal, Yemen, Indonesia, Morocco, Cameroon, Brazil, Panama, the Philippines, Egypt, Mexico and elsewhere.
For the most part, those living in wealthier countries took little notice. But now, with the global economy crashing down around us, people in even the wealthiest nations are mad as hell and reacting violently to what they view as an inadequate response to their tumbling economies.
The Telegraph (UK) warned last month that protests over governments' handling of the crisis "are widespread and gathering pace," and "may spark a new revolution":
A depression triggered in America is being played out in Europe with increasing violence, and other forms of social unrest are spreading. In Iceland, a government has fallen. Workers have marched in Zaragoza, as Spanish unemployment heads towards 20 percent. There have been riots and bloodshed in Greece, protests in Latvia, Lithuania, Hungary and Bulgaria. The police have suppressed public discontent in Russia and will be challenged again at large gatherings this weekend.
Consider a snapshot of a single week of unrest, courtesy of the Guardian:
- Greece: "There are many wellsprings of the serial protests rolling across Europe. In Athens, it was students and young people who suddenly mobilized to turn parts of the city into no-go areas. They were sick of the lack of jobs and prospects, the failings of the education system and seized with pessimism over their future.
"This week it was the farmers' turn, rolling their tractors out to block the motorways, main road and border crossings across the Balkans to try to obtain better procurement prices for their produce."
- Latvia: "The old Baltic trading city had seen nothing like it since the happy days of kicking out the Russians and overthrowing communism two decades ago. More than 10,000 people converged on the 13th century cathedral to show the Latvian government what they thought of its efforts at containing the economic crisis. The peaceful protest morphed into a late-night rampage as a minority headed for the parliament, battled with riot police and trashed parts of the old city. The following day, there were similar scenes in Vilnius, the Lithuanian capital next door."
- France: "Burned-out cars, masked youths, smashed shop windows and more than a million striking workers. The scenes from France are familiar, but not so familiar to President Nicolas Sarkozy, confronting the first big wave of industrial unrest of his time in the Elysée Palace.
"France, meanwhile, is moving into recession, and unemployment is going up. The latest jobless figures were to have been released yesterday, but were held back, apparently for fear of inflaming the protests."
- Iceland: "Proud of its status as one of the world's most developed, most productive and most equal societies, Iceland is in the throes of what is, by its staid standards, a revolution.
"Riot police in Reykjavik, the coolest of capitals. Building bonfires in front of the world's oldest parliament. The yogurt flying at the free market men who have run the country for decades and brought it to its knees."
- Britain (via the Times of London): "Wildcat strikes flared at more than 19 sites across the country in response to claims that British tradesmen were being barred from construction jobs by contractors using cheaper foreign workers."
- Russia (via Al-Jazeera): "Thousands of protesters have rallied across Russia to criticize the government's economic policies and its response to the global financial crisis.
"Russian police forcefully broke up many of the anti-government protests on Saturday, arresting dozens of demonstrators."
At least in Western Europe, cries of "burn the shit down!" are being heard in countries with some of the highest standards of living in the world -- states with adequate social safety nets; countries where all citizens have access to decent health care and heavily subsidized educations. Places where minimum wages are also living wages, and a dignified retirement is in large part guaranteed.
The far ends of the ideological spectrum appear to be gaining currency as the crisis develops, and people grow increasingly hostile toward the politics of the status quo.
The Financial Times quotes Olivier Besancenot, a young leader of "France's extreme left," promising "to reinvent and re-establish the anti-capitalist project." "We want the established powers to be blown apart," Besancenot said. Europe's far right is gaining momentum, too, using the economy and populist outrage over immigration to gain a legitimacy it hasn't enjoyed in some time.
Notably absent from the list of countries where the economic crunch is rending the social fabric is the good ole US of A, a state with the greatest level of economic inequality in the wealthy world.
Outside of a few scattered and quickly contained protests, the citizens of the U.S. -- a country born of revolution, but with an elite that's been terrified of that legacy since immediately after its founding -- have been calm, despite opinion polls showing that Americans are more dissatisfied with the direction in which the country has been headed since they began measuring such things.
It's a baffling disconnect, considering that real wages for all but the top 10 percent of the economic pile haven't increased in 35 years.
It's more bizarre still when you consider that while European governments have handled their own bailouts relatively transparently, the U.S. government has doled out close to $10 trillion in bailouts, loan guarantees and fiscal stimulus -- if there were a million-dollar bill, that would be a stack of 10 million of them -- with a stunning lack of oversight or accountability.
Even the congressional commission charged with overseeing key parts of the banking bailout can't get answers to basic questions like "who's getting what?"
Americans are rightfully angry about that state of affairs, but with a few small exceptions, quietly so. Why? It depends on whom you ask.
In a 2006 interview with Harper's, Barack Obama shared a subtle, but rather fundamental observation about America's political culture: "Since the founding," he said, "the American political tradition has been reformist, not revolutionary." If there is to be positive change, Obama has argued, it must be gradual; "brick by brick," as he put it in one of his final campaign speeches.
Mark Ames, author of Going Postal: Rage, Murder, and Rebellion -- From Reagan's Workplaces to Clinton's Columbine and Beyond, argues that Americans have been beaten down to a degree that they're now a pacified population, largely willing to accept any economic outrage its elites impose on them.
In a 2005 interview with AlterNet, Ames said the "slave mentality" is stronger in the U.S. than elsewhere, "in part because no other country on earth has so successfully crushed every internal rebellion."
Slaves in the Caribbean for example rebelled a lot more because their oppressors weren't as good at oppressing as Americans were. America has put down every rebellion, brutally, from the Whiskey Rebellion to the Confederate rebellion to the proletarian rebellions, Black Panthers, white militias ... you name it. This creates a powerful slave mentality, a sense that it's pointless to rebel.
Anyone who has witnessed the brutal police riots that have become so common since the infamous "Battle in Seattle" protests against the World Trade Organization in 1999 can tell you there's some merit to the argument.
It's also the case that European societies tend to be more homogenous than the mishmash of tribes we call the United States. Whereas Americans are divided by religion, region, ethnicity, urban-rural tensions and all the other trappings of the "culture wars," the primary split in most European countries is class.
Thomas Frank argued eloquently in What's the Matter With Kansas that those wedge social issues that the American right nurtures with such care obscure the fundamental differences between the rich and poor, the powerful and the disenfranchised.
Indeed, any hint of discussion of economic inequality in the U.S. is shot down with cries of "class warfare" -- exactly what is playing out in the streets of much of the world today.
As the crisis deepens, as virtually every analyst predicts it will, that may well change. As The Nation's Bill Greider told Democracy Now's Amy Goodman, "you can't do this to people year after year -- that is, upturn their lives, take away what they thought they had earned, and so forth and so on, without provoking rather intense political reactions. ... We're just, just beginning to see a few bubbles like that around this country. I don't say we're going to have riots, but I think ... people, out of their own distress and anger, will organize their own politics, and they will make themselves seen and heard around this country."
Stay tuned.
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Comments are closed-
Posted by: Spot on Feb 3, 2009 12:38 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
all the reforms democrats will dare to push through congress still won't fix this shell of an economy. consumers are indebted to their eyeballs in the face of a collapsing job market, we have no manufacturing, our banks have no capital, and our government is effectively bankrupt.
it's only a matter of time until we're robbing each other to feed the kids.
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» Our Problem is as he says, basically "We refuse to see the elephant in the living room".
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Our Problem is as he says, basically "We refuse to see the elephant in the living room".
Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: Our Problem is as he says, basically "We refuse to see the elephant in the living room".
Posted by: racetoinfinity
» The real elephant in the room . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» You still miss the elephant..... its intentional..... what you say...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: "We refuse to see what's before our eyes." Didn't people just take to the streets?
Posted by: Beck
» Beck, to "see the elephant in the living room" you have to open your eyes.
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: "We refuse to see what's before our eyes." Didn't people just take to the streets?
Posted by: lenioui
» "Israelis" - Why on earth would they do that?
Posted by: truthlover
» Its a long story and off topic,,, so I will address it later when ...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: We never had a choice in the primaries...... the media controlled who our ...
Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: We never had a choice in the primaries...... the media controlled who our ...
Posted by: kogwonton
» Boy, I remember that very well, Kerry asked us to send money....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Boy, I remember that very well, Kerry asked us to send money....
Posted by: kogwonton
» True, and I would never advocate prosecuting for such either...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Kill the banks with credit card rebellion
Posted by: innerlogik
» No safety net here
Posted by: penstamen
» RE: No safety net here
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: No safety net here
Posted by: anneliese-nyc
» RE: fear not WE WILL BE MORE LIKE THEM ONCE FOLKS SEE THE MANIA OF THE NEOCONS
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» I agree, it is and was the neocons... right now that is who fills....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: I agree, it is and was the neocons, repukians, democrats, liberals, idiots...
Posted by: greenPuker
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Posted by: MJ Fields on Feb 3, 2009 12:42 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our way of life and sense of security haven't been so disrupted yet that we're cold, hungry, desperate, and angry enough to take to the streets.
Yet...
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» Really??? I don't know where you shop for food, but my place...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: eally??? I don't know where you shop for food, but my place...
Posted by: richholland
» Thank you, some sanity is appreciated ..... LOL
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: eally??? I don't know where you shop for food, but my place...
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» RE: Still Business As Usual - THE GREAT RECESSION HASN'T HIT ENOUGH PEOPLE HARD ENOUGH YET..IT WILL!
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» Rather than attack those who screwed us,
Posted by: mcartri
» I think we are beyond taking it to the streets, that just plays into their strength...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Hans B on Feb 3, 2009 12:46 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Unions.
Posted by: JSquercia
» RE: Unions.
Posted by: KDelphi5950
Comments are closed-
Posted by: and_abottleofrum on Feb 3, 2009 1:17 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Notice that we're last among wealthy nations when it comes to provisioning members of our society with a safety net, while the French are among the best.
Maybe the slow approach isn't working. Maybe it's too weak. Just maybe calls for patience in pursuing change are a delay tactic meant to calm people down until they lose interest in promoting equality and economic security.
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» While the author did say that, he placed more emphasis on the ....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: While the author did say that, he placed more emphasis on the ....
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» RE: While the author did say that, he placed more emphasis on the ....
Posted by: WingedGryphon
» Denial + Anger + Fear =
Posted by: greentime
» See what I mean??? You talk as if the system is working....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: I found Obama's quote on the need for gradual chance intriguing.
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» Good points!
Posted by: badkitty68
» Well then keep these quotes in mind as you submit to your masters...... do you have children?
Posted by: Prophit
» WE HASTEN TOO SLOWLY...SPEED IT UP
Posted by: americansheep
» That's an important observation. The rhetoric is always about put-upon people hoping their kids can
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» Also, when parents hold their anger in check and pour their hopes into their children,
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» RE: That's an important observation. The rhetoric is always about put-upon people hoping their kids can
Posted by: JSquercia
» RE: I found Obama's quote on the need for gradual chance intriguing.
Posted by: kogwonton
Comments are closed-
Posted by: and_abottleofrum on Feb 3, 2009 1:22 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Notice that we're last among wealthy nations when it comes to provisioning members of our society with a safety net, while the French are among the best.
Maybe the slow approach isn't working. Maybe it's too weak. Just maybe calls for patience in pursuing change are a delay tactic meant to calm people down until they lose interest in promoting equality and economic security.
In some cases, and in the long term, a revolutionary history may be better than a reformist one.
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» Didn't meant to post it twice
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Mister_PsyOps on Feb 3, 2009 2:27 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Venues like Alternet pretend to be an "alternative" to the endless blood money falsity and (of course) hardly do more than peddle retread establishment deceit only slightly less outrageous than that of the corporate monopoly MSM.
Meanwhile real facts and discussion are kept off the table. For the most part, we only hear the usual status quo LIES on genocide sham war and the economics of FASCISM that are recycled in serial reductio ad absurdum so all is masked to make Washington a bastion of "democracy" and "free markets" around the globe.
All of it run though travesty orgs such as the private Ponzi farce "Federal Reserve" Corp that was never federal and has minus nothing at all for reserves.
But the LIES and silencing of the truth don't even begin to conform to the reality of a world run by extortion for extortionists.
Even now, where the planet flies to pieces as a result of one serial scam after the hundreds before all built on the master fraud of false economy run by and for a parasite criminal ruling class, this Alternet writer only talks about the symptoms and NEVER even hints at the root cause of the dysfunction at stake.
Sorry but the stuff of real social revolutions must be based on frank exchange of valid information not on emotional decoy fluff that only reinforces an established ruling class order literally based on global thievery and genocide.
“Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of the truth.”
“The minority, the ruling class at present, has the schools and press, usually the Church as well, under its thumb. This enables it to organize and sway the emotions of the masses, and make its tool of them.”
Doctor Albert Einstein (in a letter to Sigmund Freud 7/30/1932. 1879-1955)
“The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the larger centers has owned the government of the U.S. ever since the days of Andrew Jackson.”
President FDR (on de facto Fascist rule in a letter to corporate monopoly charlatan “Colonel” Edward M. House, co-founder of the Council on Foreign Relations and political fixer for the ruling class. House also handled President Wilson. 11/21/ l933 – from the book "F.D.R.: His Personal Letters" - New York: Duell, Sloan and Pearce 1950)
“When the truth is replaced by silence, the silence is a lie.”
Yevgeny Yevtushenko (Soviet dissident, poet and filmmaker. Yevtushenko was the first Russian to publicly speak out against police state Stalinism (1933-).
“The truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the state."
Joseph Goebbels (minister of propaganda Nazi Germany, 1933-1945)
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» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: PointMan
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: dover23
» You're too stupid to live
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Double wink on that one GuitarBill........
Posted by: Prophit
» True but it starts very young
Posted by: kegbot1
» "They also more or less suck up what the Organized Corporate Criminal media tells them"
Posted by: WhatNow?
» RE: "They also more or less suck up what the Organized Corporate Criminal media tells them"
Posted by: WingedGryphon
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: ron heringhauser
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: praedor
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: dover23
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: kogwonton
» Remember what happened to Michael Ruppert . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» Ruppert is CIA.
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Oh my Gawd, your kidding???? I did not know that... do you have a link..
Posted by: Prophit
» As per your request.
Posted by: GuitarBill
» It doesn't show on there who the author is.....
Posted by: Prophit
» Here's your answer
Posted by: GuitarBill
» That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» Dave McGowan exposes Mike Ruppert
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Dave McGowan?
Posted by: dustdevil
» Catherine Austin Fitts is a "former" Bushit minion.
Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: Catherine Austin Fitts is a "former" Bushit minion.
Posted by: dustdevil
» Catherine Austin Fitts is a limited hangout artist
Posted by: GuitarBill
» geetarbill, I think you are getting lazy . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» No, you're not paying attention
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Okay, tell me . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» Eliot Spitzer
Posted by: GuitarBill
» I want to thank both you and Dust devil for this exchange...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: P.S.
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: P.S.
Posted by: dustdevil
» I finally saw the section of the video you were referring to . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» Yeah, me too!!!
Posted by: Prophit
» I remember all that..... its when the tried to run him off the road...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: You are so right, someone who does see the "Elephant in the Living Room"...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» MISTER PSY OPS HITS ANOTHER HOMER
Posted by: HANGTRAITORS
» RE: MISTER PSY OPS HITS ANOTHER HOMER
Posted by: EncinoM
» WHAT CAN YOU SAY THAT DISPROVES HIS POSITION?
Posted by: HANGTRAITORS
» EncinoMuck for LIES & LIARS at a DC-MSM POLICE STATE
Posted by: PointMan
» SO FUCKING TRUE!...pardon my french!
Posted by: donl51
Comments are closed-
Posted by: michael1972 on Feb 3, 2009 2:36 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Most Americans don't even understand our current financial state and what it means for their future and how bad things really are. Most Americans are too busy focusing on the Super Bowl and investing several hours of their day with useless chater about touchdowns and slam dunks (idiots).
Most Americans don't understand the Federal reserve (including myself although I have little knowledge of it), Banks, Inflation and budgets. Most Americans are so dumb that they truly believe that none of this stuff will effect their jobs or their way of life until it happens (deer in headlight syndrome).
There will be no riots until people go broke or the economy collapses that the sheep will begin to wake up and realize that there is good chance we wont recover from what could be potentially the greatest meltdown in modern history.
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» RE: American Idiot
Posted by: Sushi
» RE: American Idiot
Posted by: michael1972
» RE: There is no Obama magic, and calling people sheep and idiots is just wrong.
Posted by: michael1972
» Its not wrong if its true...... "The Truth Shall Set you Free".
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: American Idiot...ya hit the nail on the head!
Posted by: donl51
Comments are closed-
Posted by: richholland on Feb 3, 2009 2:42 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
people in the USA sometimes are put in jail 250 years....(probably the judge was senile and doesnt know the average age of human is about 80 years)
The killer who murdered our popular politicianPIM only got 8 years.
childmolesters are put in hospitals ..
So there is a whole world of difference.
In meantime scientists found out that surpression and state violence creates crimes but since it is so PROFITABLE your system will continue..
The strangething is that since OBAMA rightwing politicians seems to be relieved. Is mr.Obama really changing things or does the Mainstreet have to repair all the mistakes of Wallstreet???
Drugusers are considered as patients and never put in jail...
Professor Herz explained that in a depression helping Rich people doesnt linder the problems.
She said give the money to the people who really need it...
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» RE: jails for the brave and the free
Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: jails for the brave and the free
Posted by: magoogle
Comments are closed-
Posted by: -matti on Feb 3, 2009 2:51 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They do this in conditions of severe Social Isolation -from their Families, from Neighbors, from fellow Citizens, and even from History itself.
The Author's question is the wrong one.
We should be asking not "Why aren't 'Americans' responding as Sentient Humans?", but rather "Why is anyone surpised by this failure to respond, and why don't we ever talk about the obvious causes of this failure?"
The Author's unconscious invocation of TV-Reality in his final line -"Stay tuned."- would seem to demostrate how deep this Alienation from the Actual World has become.
Of course, there is also a long answer. But why bother with it here? I'm sure I have already exceeded the Internets norm for content and depth as it is.
-matti.
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» many are socially isolated, some by TV, some by their own choice. YOU need to talk to
Posted by: Beck
» RE:"..Democrats are the cause of every damned problem.."
Posted by: Sushi
» RE: Short Answer? TV and Social Isolation.
Posted by: clvngodess
» Your so right, in fact it was the TV and the milllions put into his TV campaign...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Advertising Age's Brand of the year Obama
Posted by: Scottk
» A revolution might cause me to miss American Idol
Posted by: zooeyhall
» RE: A revolution might cause me to miss American Idol
Posted by: anneliese-nyc
Comments are closed-
» RE: A little defensive there...
Posted by: Scottk
» Great comment GUY FOX - reminded me of Ezra Pound's powerfully satiric radio broadcasts
Posted by: FREE SPEECH
Comments are closed-
Posted by: ~Fiona~ on Feb 3, 2009 3:08 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In the second stage of the experiment, one side of the cage was electrified and naturally, the dog would leap to the other side to escape. This stage lasted until it was clear the dog had learned to "Escape" the painful stimuli and would immediately jump to the side that wasn't electrified.
In stage three of the experiment, the partition was closed so the dog could no longer escape, however so long as the dog continued its frantic behavior, the electricity stayed on. Eventually the dog's natural instinct to escape was in scientific terms "Extinguished" and the dog would lay there in the electrified part of the cage without even trying to escape. Even when the partition was removed, the dog no longer tried to escape.
The scientists conducting this torture called this phase of the ordeal, "Learned Helplessness"...
THAT is why we are Not Rioting...
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» RE: "The Whole World is Rioting... Why aren't We???"
Posted by: ellie
» RE: The media wouldn't cover it, so it wouldn't exist
Posted by: Sushi
» Guess what?
Posted by: badkitty68
» "THAT is why we are Not Rioting"...
Posted by: dustdevil
» True, but we can do hidden work.... leaderless resistance is...
Posted by: Prophit
» It is not 1770 . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» We are almost past that ability.....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: "The Whole World is Rioting... Why aren't We???"
Posted by: pawheel
» I voted for Cynthia... she was by far the best candidate with the most...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: weathered on Feb 3, 2009 3:56 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pull the plug on all MSM/PBS/NPR and flourish or stay stuck in the dark, draconian hole some call home.
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» Please.
Posted by: Beck
» Your right, in fact, throw the TV out of the house... it will change...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: daniel1982 on Feb 3, 2009 4:28 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No it isn't. What are you talking about?
What's with hyperbole?
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» Well that is funny, Iceland is rioting and they have never, in their history....
Posted by: Prophit
» define riot
Posted by: jon B
» RE: errr.
Posted by: beijaflor
Comments are closed-
Posted by: cosborn72 on Feb 3, 2009 4:34 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Most of these protestors are showing anger at their governments, or the US, or big corporations for their role in the meltdown, as well as their response to it.
Americans can't protest over the cause of the meltdown.
Why.
1.) We elected the Bush administration twice, elected congressional representatives that rubber stamped the administrations deregulation and blind-eye to corporate greed. Remember, this country and this government belongs to the people. We are responsible for what has happened over the last 8 (or is it 30?) years.
2.) In some parts of the country, house prices forced homeowners to overextend their ability to pay back a loan, but in my part, tens of thousands of homeowners overextended just to have a McMansion in the 'burbs. While the mortgage companies are to be blamed, so are these homeowners.
3.) The American people accepted NAFTA, shopped at Walmart, and generally sold America's ability to produce real products, allow the shadow financial economy to form.
4.) The American people ran up their credit card debt and spent their savings in an attempt to "Keep up with the Jones".
So, while the American people should be pushing the government to enact swift changes, there is no ground for us to lay blame on anyone other than ourselves. We enabled the corperate greed that got the world to this point, so it doesn't really suit us to be angry at anyone.
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» Putting it Differently,
Posted by: ProgressiveManiac
» Agreed, but
Posted by: badkitty68
» Agreed!
Posted by: ProgressiveManiac
» STOP RIGHT THERE!!!!
Posted by: wireup
» RE: STOP RIGHT THERE!!!!
Posted by: cosborn72
» RE: Responsibility
Posted by: greenknight
Comments are closed-
Posted by: shikejian on Feb 3, 2009 4:50 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The coup has happened and it's happened silently and with tacit approval.
jimsecor
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» RE: Why?
Posted by: magoogle
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Posted by: Purple Girl on Feb 3, 2009 5:00 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why has no one Called these traitors out on their UnAmerican Activities and Ideology? Lockheeds CEO dared say he could get 9 Mexicans for the price of 1 American- what did he think he was doing Bidding on Slave labor? Does he dare propose American Workers be treated like 3rd World Labor? Talk about an UNPATRIOTIC SOB!! he admitted he could give a Shit about American Values and the American Dream for his fellow citizens. He and the Repugs have Delsuions (and schemes) to bring the Feudalistic Caste System to Our Free market Democracy. Why is it the 'Talent' on wall street has every right to work the market to gain the best price possible, but line workers must settle for what ever the Corps feel like paying them. These Wall street 'Talents' have proven they are not only lazy, but Utterly Incompetent and Criminal. They weren't just stealing Staplers, they were stealing the Capitol which kept the entire Comapny (industry) Afloat! Why is it most American Workers 'bonuses' are dependent on profitablity, and yet the CEO's are not? If my company has a shitty year, my bonus is effected,If not totally non existent! Exxons profits from last year was 45.2 BILLION, Was the aerage workers 'Bonus' Increased, what about their wages or bennies? What was the Top brass'? Certianly Exxon did not pass this on to it's customers- $4.00 a gallon, no wonder they had a Historical Record breaking year- for any industry!
Frankly I don't want riots, and realize Strikes effect the workers bottom line more profoundly. What I want is Mass Prosecutions and Executions for those who have committed Economic Treason Against The United States! Get out your Recycled paper plates, heads will start rolling! (What silver platters have not been hocked are far to good for these Traitors!). Actually scratch that, the Guillotine is far to humane, Hang 'em Low & Slow- so we can watch them struggle, as we have for the last 3 decades!
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» Not just strike, but shut down the entire economy for a week...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Not just strike, but shut down the entire economy for a week...
Posted by: EncinoM
» Good idea. Which of you movers and shakers will start?
Posted by: Beck
» We already have, Beck.... our county council just voted to fund....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Simultaneous Strikes- Union and Non Union
Posted by: magoogle
» Well its worth continuing the discussion on the possibility of it...
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: Jasonix on Feb 3, 2009 5:23 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The government has gotten good at spinning data so the final results make things look a lot better than they are. There's a site, called ShadowStatistics.com or something like that, that shows what the unemployment numbers would be if we calculated them the way we used to back in the 1980s. In the 1990s, we changed the way we calculate unemployment, inflation, and other indexes so that the most damaging data is left out.
As a result, people think that we're in the beginning stages of a recession, hovering above an abyss, and that things might still turn around. The truth is that we're falling headlong into that abyss already.
But let's be careful that we don't get what we wish for. Rioting is pointless if people are just destroying shit out of anger. We have to have real solutions to fight for. If Americans rioted, it'd be to get more big houses, SUVs, and credit cards. That stuff isn't worth rioting for.
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» RE: LOL
Posted by: clvngodess
» While I agree with you, I think it will take more.....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: Farasien on Feb 3, 2009 5:41 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
God (or whoever) save us all.
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» Already, those who are in the condition you describe, they are not...
Posted by: Prophit
» the author is overblowing the case...
Posted by: jon B
» RE: the author is overblowing the case...
Posted by: greenknight
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Posted by: MyLeftFoot on Feb 3, 2009 5:41 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
from a region that had 2 world wars, hundreds of millions killed...
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» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» Your comment is true, but we all learn from history....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: Philor on Feb 3, 2009 5:41 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You can make them work, work, work,
Deny them health care, decent retirement and paid vacation (not mandatory as in the rest of the industrialized world) and they still don't bulge.
What does it take for Americans to get angry?
Numbed by junk food, sports, the American wet dream and what else? Pitiful!
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» RE: a nation of sheep
Posted by: clvngodess
» RE: a nation of sheep
Posted by: helenahanbasquet
» One large group just got angry, was not paralyzed, and won.
Posted by: Beck
» Yes, you picked their selection..... now what do you think... you had a choice???
Posted by: Prophit
» Why do I try, Beck??? Because of what JFK said and its true...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: a nation of angry sheep
Posted by: americansheep
» Kevin Bacon, in Animal House, said it best:
Posted by: mcartri
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Posted by: snowhound on Feb 3, 2009 5:53 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: We're No. 1; that's a big AND a small attitude here. We don't riot because we despise each other
Posted by: Beck
» So take action..... first throw out your TV, IPOD, and cell phone.
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: So take action..... first throw out your TV, IPOD, and cell phone.
Posted by: snowhound
» Oh, you are so right, I haven't even begun on the vaccines....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: So take action..... Never had a cell phone or Ipod, but TV is no worse than blind ideology
Posted by: Beck
» Beck, your the last person on earth I expect to give up her tv...
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: kegbot1 on Feb 3, 2009 5:57 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So on this topic consider:
The FBI could have arrested David Koresh any time he went to town but chose instead, to instigate the destruction of the Waco compound where men, women and children died. Why? Remember the coverage? Message to the American people sent - your government has no compunctions to slaughter you if you resist.
More recently, the completely unnecessary police brutality not only at the WTO protests in Seattle and Miami but the recent detentions and arrests made at the GOP convention in the Twin Cities. These are police state tactics but most Americans shrug - they hear about the arrests but never about the eventual acquittals. Message sent.
And then, who needs an arrest record, even though it may have been completely bogus and unconstitutional? You're boss won't care - you'll be fired anyway and then your family can learn about your inalienable right to live in a shelter. Message sent.
And finally, isn't it interesting how "60 Minutes" and other media showcased the nifty new concentrated microwave torture machines to be field tested in Iraq, but really meant for deployment against future riots amongst the hungry in the USA. You remember - these devices make you feel like your skin is on fire the closer you get. Coming soon to an urban area near you.
Golly those things can HURT!
Message sent.
And still. . . and still. . . people want so badly to believe that they will still wave the flag on national holidays, stand up proudly for the pledge, believe that their country is essentially good and still hate the French.
What is to be done with such a people?
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» RE: People got the message
Posted by: Zimbly
» My question is will you give Obama his chance up until he ....
Posted by: Prophit
» We'll give him more than 2 weeks.
Posted by: Beck
» excellent additions
Posted by: kegbot1
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Posted by: cmaukonen on Feb 3, 2009 6:16 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Chris
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» RE: Oh Man.....
Posted by: michael1972
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Posted by: Ramcharan on Feb 3, 2009 6:30 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
2) many people in America - I've read estimates as high as 30% - are on tranquilizers, anti-depressants, and mood stabilizers. Some reports say these substances have gotten into the water supplies, so that almost everyone is exposed to them. It's like a mass biochemistry experiment. Wanna control an entire population? Drug 'em!
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» RE: But we marched at convenient times, for short periods, then stopped
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: prozac nation
Posted by: Apolitical Blues
» In England, some 50% of the population is on antidepressants
Posted by: olderworker
» Absolutely correct..... mass brainwashing.....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Absolutely correct..... mass brainwashing.....
Posted by: gandolfshep
» Unfortunately it won't happen, its all part of the on going social...
Posted by: Prophit
» Remember though, it was part of Bush's mass forced mental health...
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: rickiey on Feb 3, 2009 6:43 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How's that worked out for them? Has it improved ANYTHING?
I would be willing to riot, if I could see how it would help.
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» Civil disobedience is not just rioting.
Posted by: waterflaws
» What should we call Iraq's patriots?
Posted by: billwald
» RE: How, exactly, can rioting help?
Posted by: michael1972
» RE: How, exactly, can rioting help?
Posted by: rickiey
» Well, one of the headlines of the British papers read ....
Posted by: Prophit
» EXACTLY! Civilized white people don't riot
Posted by: billwald
» RE: XACTLY! Civilized white people don't riot
Posted by: Quannah
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Posted by: open-minded on Feb 3, 2009 6:47 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the millions of the planet will take over their corrupt governments and refuse any longer to be the pawns in this deadening system.
please, let's not turn our anger against our comrades. we have to stick together. the machine is counting on us all losing our minds over what is happening, but we will not give them the gratification of this.
organize in droves. do it everyday. keep the faith in spite of seemingly insurmountable odds. i'm ready and able, who will join me and take the anger and frustration that thousands of us are experiencing and not turn it inward -but to the fearful power-brokers who are barely hanging on.
breathe, and come to realize that WE HAVE THE POWER - they do not(it's all an illusion and dream that we have been a part of)
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» Oh, yes, "Rah, rah, rah, our team won" Yippee, does anyone want....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: mrcentrist on Feb 3, 2009 6:57 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: QuestionAuthority on Feb 3, 2009 7:05 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Republicans are playing a very dangerous game with our future by opposing everything that the incoming Administration tries to do. They could end up setting off a second civil war if no stimulus package is enacted or one that is emasculated is enacted that doesn't work. I don't think that they have picked up on the true zeitgeist that sent Obama into office - and this failure may be fatal.
The time for partisan maneuvering is over. The Republicans can either listen to the people that elected the Democrats and work with them to solve this crisis, or they risk irrelevance or worse.
Let's hope there are enough cool heads on all sides to get this country moving again.
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» This is a tough time to be part of a zeitgeist, because it worked, yet is despised
Posted by: Beck
» you're right
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: you're right
Posted by: Beck
» RE: you're right
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: I don't agree...
Posted by: gwaring
» I think your right about the waiting, but after his first 17 days...
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: MeyravLevine on Feb 3, 2009 7:12 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
1. Red scare persecutions, internment of Japanese-Americans, effectively put the fear of fascist government.
2. State sponsored terrorism and persecution against Civil Rights activists and anti-war protestors during the 50s, 60s, and 70s crippled desire to protest against the state and the ruling elites.
3. Anti-Union propaganda since the 80s have led people to believe that we ought to feel lucky for the little crumbs that we get from the ruling elites.
The message: worry about your individual needs, work your ass off, keep your head down, and don't complain.
America is the land that can be found in Kafka's books. Most of us are simply ignorant of the reality.
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» RE: We have been beaten into submission by the state
Posted by: Apolitical Blues
» This is true about the Fluoride... we provided evidence of what you ....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: harpy on Feb 3, 2009 8:33 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: jgilb on Feb 3, 2009 9:54 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You signed a contact with the credit company and if you actually read all the fine print, you would have realized that you are allowing them to change the rate anytime they wish. Read it - it's all there.
They didn't hide anything. I'm so sick of this "they screwed us over" attitude. You screwed yourself when you signed the contract.
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Posted by: Karina on Feb 3, 2009 7:17 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Who's to say it won't be Kent State or worse, Tiananmen Square? We like to think that wouldn't happen here but do we know? If a million of us actually stormed the capitol, who is not complacent enough to risk the worst scenario?
I marched with 100,000 of my closest friends on Jan 27, 2007 and it meant NOTHING. I marched with far fewer in September and watched as Iraq war veterans were arrested while attempting to ascend the steps of "our" capitol.
Rioting won't help until we can as a bipartisan people storm the proverbial bastille.
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» I marched, too, on Oct. 27th, 2007 against the War
Posted by: olderworker
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Posted by: henkle110936 on Feb 3, 2009 7:17 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: jeaninemolloff on Feb 3, 2009 7:18 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» You just don't know any, do you? And are you willing to protest to such a degree? Jail, for YOU?
Posted by: Beck
» Your husband must be "proud" of Obamabots such as yourself and btw I kicked a couple of them during
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Your husband must be "proud" of Obamabots such as yourself and btw I kicked a couple of them dur
Posted by: Beck
» RE: Good point.
Posted by: oregoncharles
» Nice idea, it probably won't work
Posted by: kegbot1
» I forgot to mention, this is a perfect opportunity because my....
Posted by: Prophit
» I have done exactly that.... when you first talk to them....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: waterflaws on Feb 3, 2009 7:21 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Why Aren't We?
Posted by: Apolitical Blues
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Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield on Feb 3, 2009 7:33 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Simple, Americans hate and scapegoat each other
Posted by: Beck
» RE: Simple, Americans hate and scapegoat each other
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Simple, Americans hate and scapegoat each other
Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: Simple, America is SOAKED with RAMPANT CONSUMERISM !!
Posted by: Beck
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Posted by: Apolitical Blues on Feb 3, 2009 7:37 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This "crisis" has all the markings of a planned event. We shouldn't be surprised that the victims are taking to the streets. I'm surprised we haven't seen a few heads lopped off.
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Posted by: Blueprelude on Feb 3, 2009 7:43 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Americans Are Afraid of Their Government
Posted by: Apolitical Blues
» RE: Americans Are Afraid of Their Government
Posted by: Zimbly
» RE: Americans Are Afraid of Each Other
Posted by: Beck
» RE: Americans Are Afraid of Each Other
Posted by: cmaciain
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Posted by: tony_opmoc on Feb 3, 2009 8:07 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
» RE: This is how the Kids are Having a Riot in the UK today
Posted by: sirios
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Posted by: Sojourner on Feb 3, 2009 8:17 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I no longer dare to protest because my “priors” put me in jeopardy, and I am too old to go to jail again. The last time we had riots was in the early 90s. Our neighborhoods still show the scars. But it is just a matter of time.
We have deliberately created a new proletariat by forcing large numbers of people into poverty, and unless we put them to work at a livable wage, we will have our share of rebellion. I do not wish that on anyone. Nor do I see the absence of organized violence as a fault. Only someone who has never been close to a riot could see social conflict as desirable.
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Posted by: PaulK on Feb 3, 2009 8:22 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The U.S. just elected a former community organizer as President. We're never 100% sure that nonviolent demonstrations "work", but right now we're so happy that we just got rid of Bushie and the Republican Congress!
It's the disenfranchised groups that riot. In America, the blacks have been rioting since the 1920s. Right now they're not feeling quite as disenfranchised. So hold off on the riots.
In general the U.S. has more of an ethic of following the nonviolent practices of first talking, then demonstrating to build public support, then throwing elections. It's true that both parties are corrupt, but Americans (except for fundamentalist bozoes over 60) split tickets if there's anyone worth voting for.
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» If George Washington were alive today...
Posted by: zooeyhall
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Posted by: harpy on Feb 3, 2009 8:22 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"I have your letter of September 29 asking for further documentation regarding a statement made in my book, The Truth About Water Fluoridation, to the effect that the idea of water fluoridation was brought to England from Russia by the Russian Communist Kreminoff. "In the 1930's, Hitler and the German Nazi's envisioned a world to be dominated and controlled by a Nazi philosophy of pan-Germanism. The German chemists worked out a very ingenious and far-reaching plan of mass-control which was submitted to and adopted by the German General Staff. This plan was to control the population in any given area through mass medication of drinking water supplies. By this method they could control the population in whole areas, reduce population by water medication that would produce sterility in women, and so on. In this scheme of mass-control, sodium fluoride occupied a prominent place. ...
"Repeated doses of infinitesimal amounts of fluoride will in time reduce an individual's power to resist domination, by slowly poisoning and narcotizing a certain area of the brain, thus making him submissive to the will of those who wish to govern him. [A convenient light lobotomy]
"The real reason behind water fluoridation is not to benefit children's teeth. If this were the real reason there are many ways in which it could be done that are much easier, cheaper, and far more effective. The real purpose behind water fluoridation is to reduce the resistance of the masses to domination and control and loss of liberty.
"When the Nazis under Hitler decided to go into Poland, both the German General Staff and the Russian General Staff exchanged scientific and military ideas, plans, and personnel, and the scheme of mass control through water medication was seized upon by the Russian Communists because it fitted ideally into their plan to communize the world. ...
"I was told of this entire scheme by a German chemist who was an official of the great IG Farben chemical industries and was also prominent in the Nazi movement at the time. I say this with all the earnestness and sincerity of a scientist who has spent nearly 20 years' research into the chemistry, biochemistry, physiology and pathology of fluorine--any person who drinks artificially fluorinated water for a period of one year or more will never again be the same person mentally or physically."
CHARLES E. PERKINS, Chemist, 2 October 1954. The article, one of many, is posted at http://www.infonews.co.nz/news.cfm?l=1&t=0&id=17791
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» We gave proof of what you just said to our water district back in 2005...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Nazis used to put Flouride in the water to suppress
Posted by: bcgirl125
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Posted by: Quasar on Feb 3, 2009 9:00 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
1) We are soft in the head. Mindless entertainment and diversion through drugs and technology keep us too preoccupied to care. We're addicted to fun and do not care about the world that beats us down. We cannot fight what we do not understand. We are pacified and greedy and so, compliant.
2)Education is about conformity not freethinking. And higher education is either for those that can afford it (i.e. their parents paid for it) or for those who are willing to go into debt to get it. Another form of slavery. Again, many of these folks simply cannot afford to fight for fear of losing their jobs, which they need to pay off their debt. Their job and their debt keep them in line even though they do understand the beast.
3)Although Washington has quelled many a revolution, it has also learned along the way that so long as a significant portion of Americans are uneducated, poor, drugged and well armed they will kill themselves and keep everyone else in a perpetual state of disgust and fear. The solution then, is of course, Washington, the cops, the military and the American Way.
3) Obama's election was one of the greatest acts of democracy this country or the world has seen in a long while. But he is not the answer: he is the outcome. If we forget that now, he will be ineffective and our revolution will be obsolete before we've begun.
You can already sense the push back coming from the indiscreet machinations behind McCain, McConnell, Palin and Steele et al.
At this point, I think we all need to revise what we know to be safe and free. The question is: are we willing to get in the trenches to get it done.
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» RE: ebel without a Clue GREAT POST, EXCELLENT RESPONSE, GREAT POST!!!
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» RE: ebel without a Clue
Posted by: magoogle
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Posted by: zooeyhall on Feb 3, 2009 9:09 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My dad was a farmer in the 1930s. Farmers got together en masse to stop farm foreclosures. Including stringing-up a judge in LeMars Iowa. They didn't have the near the material things we have in our "modern" day, but they sure as shootin' had alot more GUTS then the average person today!
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» Thank you zooeyhall. I needed someone to confirm this.
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» There is only one thing growing in my small town...
Posted by: zooeyhall
» That's so sad. In my younger years in rural MO, the atmosphere was always
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: That's so sad. In my younger years in rural MO, the atmosphere was always
Posted by: zooeyhall
» RE: That's so sad. In my younger years in rural MO, the atmosphere was always
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» And in the 50's
Posted by: Karina
» RE: our grandparents were tougher in the 1930's
Posted by: Basenjis
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Posted by: MindyB on Feb 3, 2009 9:31 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is funny that in a country where we tout "Freedom" as the corenerstone of our society, we are less free than most other developed and developing countries. People are even scared to complain to their elected representatives for fear of being singled out as "un-American". For this country to just lay there and take all the abuses from the Bush administration, it shows that we are trully a country with a slave mentality.
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» The antidote to fear is "anger", its the first step in healing....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: adampec on Feb 3, 2009 9:32 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That's all folks, no balls.
No further comments.
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Posted by: EncinoM on Feb 3, 2009 9:37 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
With Bush out of the White House and the republicans out of power, instead of embracing the possibility on reform and a new direction, they have only amended their conspiracy theories to allow for a new president.
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» RE: What is wrong with Alternet
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: What is wrong with Alternet
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: What is wrong with Alternet
Posted by: cmaciain
» RE: What is wrong with Alternet
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: What is wrong with Alternet
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: What is wrong with Alternet
Posted by: GuitarBill
» If you have a moron on one hand and a genius on the other, but...
Posted by: Prophit
» The stimulus package is status quo?!
Posted by: brunowe
» Compare it to Raygun's and Dubya's and see for yourself !
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» Dubya and Reagan had a plan that was almost...
Posted by: brunowe
» Ok, but on taxes and spending.
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» RE: Ok, but on taxes and spending.
Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Ok, but on taxes and spending.
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Ok, but on taxes and spending.
Posted by: brunowe
» Hey Jen?
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: Hey Jen?
Posted by: Jennifer Bedingfield
» I'll be voting but by means other than a ballot box....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: What is wrong with Alternet
Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: What is wrong with Alternet
Posted by: EncinoM
» No conspiracy necessary
Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: No conspiracy necessary
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: No conspiracy necessary
Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: No conspiracy necessary
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: No conspiracy necessary
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Typo
Posted by: GuitarBill
Comments are closed-
Posted by: owlsliveintrees on Feb 3, 2009 9:40 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If they do they will, if they don't they won't. Coming up with theories as to why they haven't done so is just making it abundantly obviously that your worldview is too heavily rooted in structuralism.
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Posted by: La Hedonista on Feb 3, 2009 9:54 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Then again . . . fluoride and antidepressants in the water? Or . . . Just give it some time?
(case in point: California halting welfare payments, will the state be on fire in a week? Or will we just see a mass exodus toward the Mexico border?)
Here's my take: Jumping around, sloganeering and smashing in shop windows fixes nothing and just fulfills statist police-state wet dreams anyway. The violent protesters at Monticello a year or so ago were outed as agent provacateurs, and other provacateurs - undercover cops or military or intel types - have been outed in the recent Greece riots. It justified the heavyhanded police response.
So-called "socialist revolutons" - staged and financed at VERY high levels - are part-and-parcel of central bank takedowns (which we are in the middle of, consequently Wash DC is toast) and I hope by now that We The People can see right through the one that's possibly being cooked up for us. Expect "the Government" to fix everything and make it "right" for us? What a joke. We can see what a bangup job they've done so far! What a bunch of thieves! But since we turned our wallets over without a whimper we have no one to blame but ourselves. So now we're supposed to take to the streets and demand the government to take over even MORE aspects of our lives?
Anyway, I'm HOPING Americans are too obstinate to fall for any calls to riot and demand the government "take care of us." Why would we want that crap here in the US? How does breaking shop windows and shouting at government buildings and their powerless minions fix anything? Shopkeepers are not at fault, our politicians are paid off/extorted nincompoops, and state/federal employees are just doing their jobs. The ones who deserve to be lynched are sunning themselves in Belize and we don't even know their names, let alone where to find them. So . . . Phht!
The way to "fight" corruption and authoritarian rule is not to rail pointlessly against it. Starve the Beast instead! Go on strike but skip the theatrics. Smart people render authority as useless as tits on a bull when they bypass the control grid, creating fodder for new "Hogans Heroes" and "Monkey Wrench Gang" sitcoms.
Americans can start by turning off their TVs, snapping their wallets shut, bartering useful goods and helping their neighbors.
Vive la resistance . . .
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» RE: Because we're NOT FRENCH?
Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: Because we're NOT FRENCH?
Posted by: magoogle
» Amen and hallelujah....... Viva La Resistance....
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com on Feb 3, 2009 9:58 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hence the quotes in the article of "burn the shit down" and stories of the destruction of private property.
How does burning up some hapless bystander's car or store solve the economic problems of a nation?
Our economy thrives on consumption by its people. 2/3 of the GDP is consumption by the citizenry.
No amount of tinkering with the economy can easily get the nation's citizens to start buying more stuff again. Getting whipped into a frenzy and destroying private property will not solve our economic problems.
Eventually we will reach a point where damn near no one is employed and automation will take over large segments of production and the service industry. We will need to come up with a new economic model to ensure the unemployed humans still get basic necessities.
That is far easier said than done though and rioting is not building a new economic model.
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» RE: No, Rioting is about political pressure.
Posted by: oregoncharles
» RE: No, Rioting is about political pressure.
Posted by: rfrancis@godisdead.com
Comments are closed-
Posted by: oregoncharles on Feb 3, 2009 9:58 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Actually, precisely BECAUSE the Greens have no responsibility for the collapse and offer a genuinely new approach. Both "centrist" parties, including the SD, are implicated in the neoliberal policies that led to collapse (does this sound familiar?)
Joshua, are you actually saying that we should be rioting in the streets? This is a whole new tack for Alternet, although there was that article about revolution following political disappointment. We have seen riots in response to police killings: they seem to be the only way to get even a pretense of justice in those cases. The latest example is Oakland. But since Seattle, there hasn't been anything like that in response to political abuses.
One reason is that Democratic Party campaigns soak up the energy of rebellion. That's been most obvious in the peace movement. The recent wars are so closely identified with Bush and the Republicans that even Democratic candidates that SUPPORT the wars (Kerry) can deflect and diffuse the movement. I don't think it's accidental.
At the moment, the same is true of our economic problems. However lame and Republican Obama's economic initiatives, we still have HOPE(tm). It isn't until that hope dissipates that you'll see serious efforts to change things. What does "serious" mean? We'll see.
Returning to Iceland: it's a small country. The Icelanders get it: they've been shafted by the "center", and they're swinging hard to the Left. Now it's our turn.
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» The US isn't Iceland
Posted by: brunowe
» RE: The US isn't Iceland
Posted by: oregoncharles
» RE: The US isn't Iceland
Posted by: brunowe
» RE: Actually,
Posted by: oregoncharles
» RE: Actually,
Posted by: brunowe
» RE: The US isn't Iceland
Posted by: lenioui
» RE: "The far ends of the ideological spectrum appear to be gaining currency"
Posted by: Joshua Holland
» street heat?
Posted by: jon B
» Josh's statement assumes the politicians and the system still works....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: edgar_michel on Feb 3, 2009 10:10 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: 911 was the Coup that Started the Flow of Trillions
Posted by: edgar_michel
» RE: The US Defense Industry has long been irrelevant to stimulating the US economy.
Posted by: Menopausal Mick
» I think 9-11 was a shock to many and they just couldn't believe ...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Menopausal Mick on Feb 3, 2009 10:19 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Spent my time getting my head busted in the sixties.
Spent the last fifteen years tree hugging and sitting in front of bulldozers and trying in vain to stop the rape that is urban sprawl.
I've been threatened both above the board and below.
Lost the last two homesteads due to Eminent Domain. Yes...two in a row.
I won't be doing any more marching or protesting. I'm too old to go to jail.
However, I have firmly decided that the next time the government attempts to take my home that it will be over my very dead body. I find that this decision is very freeing. Is that a form of protest?
We have an entire generation now that has never experienced civil disobedience. Will they ever have the balls to face a billy club or worse? Don't know... I do know that they will face it without me. My days of fighting the good fight are over. These days, I make sure my family will survive in a place that is hopefully far enough away from the masses.
I have found peace. I intend to hold onto it. Selfish? Probably. But unless you've spent time on the lines that doesn't include sitting safely at your computer and typing away...then you can BITE ME.
Menopausal Mick
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» you won't get it from me
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: you won't get it from me
Posted by: samd11
» As Patton said, "Don't die for your country, make the "bankers" die for their greed"...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Why don't we? Because I learned
Posted by: magoogle
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Perry Logan on Feb 3, 2009 10:20 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I get the impression no one here really feels like rioting either, but just sort of thought someone should be. If y'all feel like rioting, be my guest.
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Posted by: freelyb on Feb 3, 2009 10:23 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: marie83 on Feb 3, 2009 10:24 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: It's Ridiculous --WAKE UP,IT HAS NEVER BEEN THIS BAD!
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» RE: It's Ridiculous --WAKE UP,IT HAS NEVER BEEN THIS BAD!
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: WAKE UP, YOU need to. friend
Posted by: Caleb Darkstar
» I know what time you were talking about and it wasn't 1972,...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: I know what time you were talking ... it was much later than that, aabout and it wasn't 1972,...
Posted by: Caleb Darkstar
» Now this is why we are in so much trouble.... look at her effective....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: stopthemaddness2 on Feb 3, 2009 10:46 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It hasn't hit enough people hard enough yet, but it will!!!! If you were smart, you'd get prepared cause it is coming to a town near YOU!
Stay tuned!!!
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Posted by: stopthemaddness2 on Feb 3, 2009 10:49 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If the Neocons & their filthy rich supporters have their way, it will. But everyday, you hear about massive lay offs, have you ever thought about this... what if all those who are presently unemployed, received absolutely no more money? Do you think we'd still have a status quo? Hell NO!!!
It hasn't hit enough people hard enough yet, but it will!!!! If you were smart, you'd get prepared cause it is coming to a town near YOU!
Stay tuned!!!
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Posted by: stopthemaddness2 on Feb 3, 2009 11:13 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yet!
Floride
A overall dumbing down of Americans
Debt Slavery
Strategic Poverty, Drug Addiction
Television Addiction to avoid Reality
Learned Apathy
Acceptance
Non Thinkers
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Posted by: willymack on Feb 3, 2009 11:20 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We're stupid
We're ignorant
We're lazy
We're gutless
Before long, we'll be slaves in everything but name, and will resemble czarist Russia more than the country most of us think we are. If that's OK with you, the good news is that you don't have to do anything; just keep on being the stupid, ignorant, lazy, and gutless slobs you've always been.
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Posted by: stopthemaddness2 on Feb 3, 2009 11:22 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yet!
Floride
A overall dumbing down of Americans
Debt Slavery
Strategic Poverty, Drug Addiction
Television Addiction to avoid Reality
Learned Apathy
Acceptance of Mass Media Spin Machines
Non Thinkers
Denial
FEAR
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» RE: GOD HELP US ALL!
Posted by: EncinoM
» Aliens, the CIA, anti-castro cubans...
Posted by: frantic1971
» RE: Aliens, the CIA, anti-castro cubans...
Posted by: EncinoM
» So, you think this is fantasy????
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: 6399 on Feb 3, 2009 11:28 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
And those who are already out of work are being fed a crock of shit about shovel ready jobs and green/infrastructure pie in the sky. Hope springs eternal in this country, especially when propogated by a masterful con man whose $600 million PR machine brainwashed an entire nation.
Don't count on anyone ever rising up--even if they could. We were so passive during the Bush years that a security apparatus was gradually assembled which will either keep Americans submissive or see them imprisoned in KBR internment camps. I mean honestly, we allowed the government to construct internment camps in every state of the nation and few questioned the rational. We've allowed phones to be tapped and torture was mainstreamed. This country is FUCKED! Get out while you can because there will be no recovery, only a slow, painful deterioration.
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Posted by: abprosper on Feb 3, 2009 12:24 PM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
why we don't have them
#1 We at least think just had a transformative election.
#2 Its no where near bad enough most places
#2 The new guys are trying to fix the problem, well sort of.
#3 The county doesn't have a youth or labor movement to speak of. Yet
#4 We are very effectively manipulated by our media and its fear the police shows
#5 We are very well policed
#6 Riots really aren't going to work in this environment anyway. Our government would ignore them and they'd only destroy "our" stuff .
#7 We don't have a collective set of things to demand. For every Regular Joe who wants Social Democracy I can bring you another who wants a Theocracy. Divide and Rule.
#8 No one in the US hates the rich . We all want to be them not bring them down.
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» You have two Number Two's but otherwise
Posted by: kegbot1
» I also agree about #7 & #8
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: tsakovs on Feb 3, 2009 12:42 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We are not stupid Americans nor are we powerless. We are slaves to the bankers and corporations.
What is truly needed, and what we as a people really need to make happen through our democratic process, is to enact the laws which separate corporations and state completely and utterly.
As proof that this would work well is the fact that we already have as part of our first amendment a separation of church and state - which "expressly prohibits the United States Congress from making laws respecting an establishment of religion or that prohibit the free exercise of religion." It has worked extremely well for our forefathers, for us and for our future generations.
Why not do the same for keeping corporations and state separate?
As a beginning to this process of separation we should do the following:
- Enact a law that specifically states that corporations can no longer be viewed as persons by the law - also known as corporate personhood.
- Another law to eliminate lobbyists from and corporate or private establishment. Let our politicians seek out the truth rather than having the evil-doers constantly in the ears of our representatives.
- A law against campaign contributions by any public or privately held corp and cap the contribution of individuals by a specific amount - Say maybe $1000.
- A law against multinational corporations from moving ANY jobs out of the country.
There are many more that can be created to stop this garbage from happening but we need to do it peacefully and through our un-corrupted representatives - and if your representative doesn't want to do whats right then DON'T re-elect them!
Regards - True Blue American
Tony S.
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» RE: Separation of Corporations and State
Posted by: magoogle
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Posted by: Gravitas on Feb 3, 2009 12:55 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But while living in California, I also witnessed the phenomena of cults. I witnessed people joining against their wishes with a few threats and lots of B.S. But I always thought it was really a secret government experiment in thought control. Perhaps they tapped into the electrical frequency that turns us into Steford wives. Or maybe it is all that Prozac in the water supply.
Whatever it is it is scary. Because nothing seems to be able to wake us up!
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Posted by: rickyvern on Feb 3, 2009 12:57 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Don't forget to protect your precious bodily fluids.
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Yup, that is what Hitler used in the camps.....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: AngryWhiteFemale on Feb 3, 2009 1:17 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My cousin in Orlando, whose husband has been out of work 21 months, says, "there's going to be riots in Orlando."
Read my post on your article about America and "Hordes of Suicides".
Debra
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» RE: Josh- the riots are coming: just watch
Posted by: kegbot1
» No that won't happen, Obama is going to follow the law... and right now...
Posted by: Prophit
» It was a pathetic attempt at sarcasm..... LOL
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: theone23ord on Feb 3, 2009 1:45 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
wakeupfromyourslumber.com
whatreallyhappened.com
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Posted by: yellow on Feb 3, 2009 2:00 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here's the problem. When the last thirty year long wave of expansion ran out of steam (1945 to 1975) the US economy was highly concentrated. Prices reflected monopoly capital's dominance of the economy. Prices are not set by the market but by a fixed cost plus formula which reflects a given amount of profit expected to make investment worthwhile in the first place. Overcapacity is built into the system at the outset of a boom ahead of demand and sales in order to anticipate fluctuations in demand and allow cutbacks in capacity utilization during a downturn. Downturns don't bring price reductions and "market corrections" from which comes reequilibrium and full employment. This is a myth. What happens is that capacity utilization and investment not prices are cut in order to defend profit margins. This reenforces the downturn as unemployment grows, effective demand shrinks and stagnation worsens. Monopoly capital's position is strengthened as the economy concentrates further. An exogenous stimulus is needed, usually a war or public investment, because mature capitalism doesn't reach equilibrium, even in the long term, using its former production capacity, employment or material resources at former levels.
Mature capitalism involves shorter and shallower upturns, usually with delayed and weak labor market recovery, longer and deeper downturns with higher average rates of unemployment, and overall long term periods of stagnation. The reason is obvious. Effective demand, which is the real factor driving capitalism, decreases more and more because of the worsening distribution of income and wealth due to monopoly capitalism's increasing concentration of the economy. Thus, a strong link between monopolization, growing profit share in the economy, falling output and chronic stagnation can be seen in late capitalism. As the profit share in the economy rises with monopolization and concentration, output falls due to falling net new investment (because profit share in the economy can increase without a rise in profit levels) leading to unemployment and stagnation. A skewed distribution of income leads to slack demand maintains this condition in the overall economy.
The policy prescription is to redistribute wealth and allow workers to generate effective demand with rising incomes so that growth can resume. The free market solution will just allow greater concentration of wealth as the rich buy up assets at fire sale prices. As investment shifts from production to buying up other firms and concentrating industrial capacity, output declines and profit share soars as capacity is then streamlined to expand profit margins still further. The persistance of overcapacity lowers investment as an inverse relationship between output and profits developes. Income skewes upward toward the rich. Stagnation and recession deepens even further. The increased repression of wages through continued recession will only worsen demand leading to more financialization to spur the economy. This is a prescription for more not less stagnation. The fear of recovery reflects capital's fear of real wage growth and a fall in profit share in the economy. Yet, this must occur for a recovery to happen. Obama would not be the first US president to save capitalism from itself.
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» Excellent points but also remember
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: xcellent points but also remember
Posted by: dover23
» Dover23, what we now face is market, not government, failure. Our market has been freer than ever!!
Posted by: yellow
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Posted by: Earthian on Feb 3, 2009 2:36 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"'Since the founding,' he said, 'the American political tradition has been reformist, not revolutionary.'"
There are obvious counterexamples:
The founding itself was BY revolution. It started in 1774 with the Articles of Association and was done by war with Britain.
Shay's rebellion preceded the second and current Constitution's adoption. It was adopted in an obviously illegal manner, violating the amending article of the then-current Articles of Confederation which the "founders" called "the Constitution." It was motivated, in part, by fears of more revolutionary violence.
That change was revolutionary.
Ah, what else what not reformist? Oh, how 'bout the Civil War over the "reforms" of the practice of selling and owning human beings?
That change was revolutionary.
The violent protests of the 1960s scared US politicians and may have contributed to the end of the US invasion and attacks against Vietnam
That change was revolutionary.
The expelling of the Indians from East of the Mississippi, was revolutionary in that it wasn't reformist. It was genocide. Particularly the Indian Removal Act in about 1828.
That change was revolutionary, on the part of the US government.
US-induced political change *in other countries* has been revolutionary. William Blum documents that over 33 coups have been done by the US against other nations since WWII. The latest was Somalia via US support for Ethopia's illegal invasion.
Those changes were revolutionary.
In short, Obama is wrong.
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» RE: Obama's quote about change is easy to refute and it is wrong . . .
Posted by: Earthian
» Your own arguments oversimply US history
Posted by: brunowe
» Obama's handlers are afraid of that word..... revolution.....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: JohnGorenfeld on Feb 3, 2009 3:46 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Until you check Quantcast and notice that AlterNet's traffic is down 10 percent from last month.
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» Not true. Your comment is deceptive
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Good catch, Billl...... don't you just love how these guys trolll.....
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
» RE: Good question: why aren't more Americans taking to the streets with their economic frustration?
Posted by: dover23
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Thudd on Feb 3, 2009 6:20 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's not their fault they are neurotic, they are trained from birth to be that way, how else would the banksters and the arms manufacturers, the military and the politicians be able to keep up the insane death machine that dominates life in Deathland?
How else could these agencies continue their 100+ years of continuous bloodshed, save by creating a neurotic populace, and ruling it with gangster viciousness.
The US has long been a brutal,gangster state. Its prisons are notorious, its military behaves like thugs abroad, and its police, like thugs at home.
Americas answer to the world recession that American Jews perpetrated on the world will be to engage in more and bigger wars.abroad whilst viciously putting down any murmurings of dissent abroad.
I meet Americans who believe in a standard, false and typically American scenario. Born of Hollywood and junk religion, they conceive of a time when they will oppose the forces of evil from their (inevitably flimsy- American-style wooden!!-not granite or concrete) homes. Armed with hunting rifles or even an automatic assault weapon, and defend their family.
What will happen is that the first thing they know about the government 'round-up' is when a US army tank shell bursts into their house in the early morning, followed by several more, followed by a few incendiary shells on top of the rubble. Or it is rocketed by an F-16- or apache helicopter a 'predator' drone. Or when they are snatched on the street on their way to/ from work. Or their house is surrounded by 'anti terrorist' militia, any planning they might do will be compromised all along by planted tiny listening/ surveillance devices in their home and car, or via their land-line, PC, cell phone or TV.
The Americans who go for this doomsday scenario tend to forget that the people who will destroy them are experienced professionals, with all the firepower and technology at their command, and with vast experience killing Arabs in Israel, or Iraqis, Afghans, Lebanese Serbs, East Germans and Russian people.
Compared to all of these the isolated American rebels will be like kittens in a bucket- a push-over.
There is only one way out for American patriots- to form a political resistance movement and ALL dig deep in their pockets, get data on all their enemies but most importantly- get data- contact and persuade members of their US military to support them and fight to get America back from the Zio-gangster cabal that now dominates her.
http://www.alternet.org/workplace/124836?page=3
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» RE: What did you do to free Your America?
Posted by: magoogle
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Posted by: ender on Feb 3, 2009 6:20 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: EricSommer on Feb 3, 2009 6:42 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
by Eric Sommer
The time has come for a nationwide U.S. "March on Wall Street'. This march should be organized on a nation-wide basis inside the U.S. by the broadest possible coalition of progressive political organizations, trade unions, anti-poverty, anti-racist, anti-foreclosure, and environmental groups.. It should bring people from throughout the U.S. to culminate in a gigantic rally in Wall Street in New York.
The march can be organized around seven or so simple and clear points, such as:
1. Nationalize the Banking system and ban the use of exotic financial instruments such as derivatives.
2. Use nationalization to create Banking 'of, by, and for the people'
3. Use nationalization to ramp up the economy towards full employment.
4. Use nationalization to end all foreclosures.
5. Use nationalization to support financing of clean energy and ecologically sustainable products and services.
6. Use nationalization to end all give-away's of working peoples taxes to banks and finance companies.
7. Use nationalization to end the power of corrupt finance capital.
By 'nationalization of banking and finance' we do not mean partial or temporary nationalization, with a view to handing back control to the same finance capital system which has brought the world economy to its knees. Nor do we mean a 'bad bank' which will absorb the worthless mortgages and derivatives of the current system at tax payers expense. What we mean is permanent nationalization which places banks and finance under public and democratic control.
With this measure, the American people would get something of value for their tax money - real working banks and finance systems - and not just worthless non-performing mortgages and derivatives.
With this measure, democratic control of finance by the people and their representatives would, at least in principal, be established.
With this measure, the social, and not just the 'for-profit,' aspect of finance could take hold.
When it comes to life-and-death matters , like blood flow in a human being or finance in a market economy, stability is more important than innovation.
Ideally, the March on Wall Street would form one part of a coordinated "Global March on Banks' day, with marches in each country where private banks and finance companies have corrupted and partially or wholly broken the economy.
In Britain, for example, the march could target the area of London known as 'The City' where the majority of Britain's', and much of the worlds', financial control is vested. As with the March on Wall Street, the key demand for each march can be creating democratic control of finance through nationalization of banks and financial systems.
With unemployment, housing foreclosures, and world-wide economic chaos increasing by the day, it is essential to take the power and initiative out of their hands. This can only be achieved by mass organizing.
It's time for groups organizing around unemployment issues, anti-poverty issues, anti-foreclosure issues, environmental issues, and trade union issues to come together under a new banner: March on Wall Street to Nationalize the Banks.
Organizations or individuals interested in working for the March On Wall Street can sign-up for an online discussion group at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MarchOnWallStreet/
Note: Additional background for this approach can be found in my previous article 'Time for a social movement to nationalize U.S. banks' at:
http://www.globalresearch.ca
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Posted by: theoldman on Feb 3, 2009 7:53 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It is quite plain that most people have no idea just how bad the US economic system is in, or else they are much like the proverbial ostrich with their heads stuck in the sand.
Never mind how dire the circumstances presently are for over 40% of the working poor who have not seen any real future for years now and their fears of years ago are being comfirmed daily.
What were those words of Moses', "The middle class can be off work for 3 to 6 months and have no financial worry while the working poor cannot live without next weeks paycheck."
In actual numbers we have over 25% unemployment today with another 25% living on barely enough to get by.
Two years ago over 55% of paychecks came from one form or another of civil government and that percent has continues increase by almost a percent with every new announcemnt of 250,000 layoffs monthly; this includes educational as well as all forms of military services.
No one alive today has lived in as bad a financial meltdown as we are facing today; and yes this includes the depression years.
No one has lived within a time when the federal govenments payroll and its payrolls to Defense Industry and overseas commitments of aid to foreign nations consume so much of US productivity of the private sector.
Unlike the Depression years there were multiple streams of income producing industrial and manufacturing balanced out against a consumer demand and a somewhat stable small banking and and 8 major banking concerns who couod still invest in the necessary sa=mall bisnes infrastrucrturewe to being abotu an upswing in buisness and financial institutions profitability.
We did not have a one party system of government that is as regressive in policys towards domestic interest in favor of overseas partnerships of interest.
We did not have an acceptance to a continually growing police state with a combined military civl police force and a goverment that is instituting a militarized and regimented society.
Never did we have such a range from the have to the have nots held in so few hands and those few hands having so much control of the common treasury.
There is an elephant in he room but like the old tale of the blind men attempting to describe it never having seen one they knew not the danger they were in until they were stepped on.
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» RE: Becuz
Posted by: magoogle
» RE: Becuz
Posted by: xbj
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Posted by: Tom Tele on Feb 3, 2009 8:16 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: kattfish on Feb 3, 2009 8:42 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Peace
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Posted by: Kimmer on Feb 3, 2009 8:49 PM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
fluoride in the drinking water
tranquilizers in the drinking water
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Posted by: bdevil on Feb 3, 2009 8:55 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: You first
Posted by: Animal
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Posted by: lorenbliss on Feb 4, 2009 1:11 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Think it won't happen here?
Ever hear of a place called Kent State?
Or Jackson State?
Constitution? What Constitution? (That was overthrown on November 22, 1963.) Civil rights? (What civil rights? Ask the veterans of the Battle of Seattle.) Change we can believe in? (Don't make me laugh.)
Think it's a coincidence U.S. soldiers wear Nazi-looking helmets?
Most U.S. citizens already behave as if they were concentration camp inmates: they just bow their heads and trudge on into the sweatshops.
The few who stood up in Seattle are a tiny minority.
Try to organize anything like that today and your neighbors will rat you out quicker than you can say Karl Marx.
Welcome to Moron Nation, where -- thanks to public schools (education for ignorance) and mass media (big lies and disinformation), not to mention a 24/7 police state -- the ruling class has created the perfect slave, the modern counterpart of the Tsarist Russian Mujik, with today's version the ultimate product of capitalist conditioning, superlatively servile in every possible sense: the most violently theocratic, pridefully stupid, viciously conformist, savagely anti-intellectual (and thus self-oppressing) "human capital" in our dismal planet's wretched history.
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» RE: Terrified Slaves Never Ever Protest
Posted by: sterlingdave54
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Posted by: Cybershaman on Feb 4, 2009 8:28 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: xbj on Feb 4, 2009 8:43 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Oh, those golden slippers, oh, them golden slippers
Golden slippers I'm going to wear
Because they look so neat.
Oh, those golden slippers
Oh, those golden slippers
Golden slippers I'm going to wear
To walk the golden street."
(With apologies to Stephen Foster because George Soros' Obamanet finds the original minstrel dialect of the classic lyrics offensive)
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Posted by: dmgood on Feb 4, 2009 10:43 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
One of its major side effects - passivity.
European criticism that Americans have such good teeth is more than just envy, its an underhanded commentary on our vacuousness upstairs!
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Posted by: EddieCran on Feb 4, 2009 10:42 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am not rioting because I really don't care. It's just that simple. None of the worlds' economic woes will have an impact on me... until, and if, I lose my house.
Not that I own my house... The bank owns it until I pay them back. I signed the contract of my own free will... It's called a mortgage.
I have food, tools, weapons, ammo and the wit to survive. Not that I'm a wacked-out gun-nut living on an entrenched compound.
I'm not rioting because I understand that I am the only person in control of my life. Nobody is ruining my life. The quality of my life is my responsibility... Not the government or any one else.
I'm not rioting because I don't extend my version of what is right and wrong into any one elses life. I mind my own business and care not one bit what you are doing... unless it takes from what I am doing. Not that I wouldn't give you anything you wanted if you asked nicely. Otherwise, that's what the weapons are for...
I'm an average joe. I am simultainiously the guy that works everyday, gardens and does minor home repair and ,if need be, the guy who is armed and adept at living by his wits and has no second thoughts about killing anyone who threatens the freedoms I have... even the Government. That used to be the definition of American.
Most of the commentary in this forum is from the fringe element under the outer parts of the Bell Curve. It's my opinion that the bulk of the non-rioting Americans are where I am... on another page entirely. If you guys want to blame everybody else for your problems... go right ahead. It's none of my business.
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» RE: Why I am not rioting.
Posted by: dmgood
» RE: Why I am not rioting.
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Why I am not rioting.
Posted by: EddieCran
» As Yoda would say "Oh, you will, you will"..... hehehe
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Why I am not rioting.
Posted by: beijaflor
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Posted by: jaworsza on Feb 4, 2009 12:06 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We MUST open our eyes. These are the final days of a dying mentality, we must unite to end the exploitation, the corruption, the greed, the wildly disproportional distribution of wealth. It is our DUTY and RESPONSIBILITY.
REVOLT, TAKE BACK WHATS YOURS
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Posted by: chasd00 on Feb 4, 2009 1:46 PM
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» gee, not in TENNESSEE
Posted by: BlueBerry PickN
» I was just going to say that.... even if we had riots, the press....
Posted by: Prophit
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Posted by: lefty dave on Feb 5, 2009 6:31 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Greetings!
One might consider that most Americans are chemically altered with the addition of FLUORIDE in their drinking water....
Used as a sedative for 100 years...cattle pens operators have used it to sedate cattle....Stalin is said to have used it in the gulags to quell unrest...
Hitler used it in concentration camps to the thousands he interned...
and when the nazi scientists were brought to this country...we learned from them how well fluoride works to deaden the thinking and response processes of the brain....
We can see that it works pretty well....your representatives have just pillaged your future....and we all just stood there....
Is this scenario possible? Think about it....do your homework...
Blessings
Lefty Dave
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» RE: FLUORIDE...So bottled water could lead to
Posted by: Caleb Darkstar
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Posted by: BlueBerry PickN on Feb 5, 2009 12:43 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Americans aren't having fits, because THEY'RE STILL BETTER OFF THAN THEIR INTERNATIONAL VICTIMS.
The Poor Americans are TERRIFIED of the 'pain compliance toys' they paid their MUNICIPAL COPS TO BUY...
& they're NOT NEARLY AS SCREWED AS THE PEOPLES OF NATIONS WHO BELIEVED THE US had EVEN A MODICUM OF GOOD FAITH BUSINESS PRACTICES.
where is the money?
GO LOOK AT THE AMERICANS WHO GOT RICH SELLING OFF BAD PAPER TO NON-AMERICANS.
use your heads. That 'bail out money' is COVERING THE FRAUD your gov't allowed to fester & rob the Peoples of the Globe.
We're mad.
wake up.
WE KNOW THIS IS *THE SECOND TIME IN UNDER A CENTURY* THAT YOU'VE ROBBED US BLIND.
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Posted by: jeffrey7 on Feb 5, 2009 5:26 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Strikebreakers 1908
Berkeley Free Speech Rally 1960
Watts 1965 and 1971
Chicago 1968
Kent State 1970
Waco 1990's
All of the Bush years 2000-2008
The police and the military exist for the protection of the greedy and the intimidation of the poor. Until they use their guns to protect us from corrupted politics, this is the bucket of shit we're stuck with.
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» violence ONLY JUSTIFIES THEM HAULING OUT THE 'PAIN COMPLIANCE TOYS' you PAID FOR...
Posted by: BlueBerry PickN
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Posted by: james_allen on Feb 6, 2009 1:21 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Proof of how cowed Americans are is the abundance of commentaries (even right here in this blog) blaming ordinary Americans for this credit crisis. That's like a restaurant with a salmonella outbreak blaming its own customers for ordering the fish! One might blame a citizen for falling prey to a Nigerian scamster, but to blame the consumer when all the banks, commentators and even the federal government were encouraging these easy mortgages??? --- Only in America!!
This is yet another example of a pervasive American cognitive disorder: Bragging about "purple finger" democracy (in a country where many citizens would happily erase the recent past and return to the Saddam era; from a country afraid to actually count its own votes). Bragging about "freedom" while protest is stifled, etc. etc.
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Posted by: noalternative on Feb 6, 2009 9:00 AM
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Posted by: Caleb Darkstar on Feb 6, 2009 10:41 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All rioting accomplishes is the widening of whatever chasm that exists.
Whats there to riot about? a bad economy, a huge national deficit? we are currently experiencing the end result of decades of bad decisions and failures.
If you want to make a difference then make one in your own life and leave violence to the animals and assholes that don't have the capacity to engage in civil change.
I wager you this, If you go out and turn over a few hotdog carts, knock out a few windows, and torch your neighbors car. In the morning you will have the same problems as the previous day plus a busted window, a pissed off neighbor and no hot dog.
Life is only that thing that happens, while we are trying to control it.
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Posted by: Gary Rumor on Feb 6, 2009 11:33 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When anyone forms a group and tries to do anything to change the material conditions of the country and the distribution of power, the police are right there. I should know I have experienced it myself most recently in the protests against the war in Iraq.
The NSA has been surveying us all as we have been told by the most recent exposes on MSNBC. Organized resistance is futile. On the other hand spontaneous rebellion is still an option.
Americans are no more immune to righteous indignation than any other people and we are a hell of a lot better armed than most. Unfortunately most Americans have taken their failure to make it in the American dream as a sign of personal lack of ability and for the most part the intelligentsia that would be a source of leadership is incorporated in the private sector or the in some form of social busy work.
But when people here have had enough brain washing and when the army refuses to shoot their own and the police refuse to club the protestors any more, then perhaps we will have a chance. Until then one part of the working class will be employed to keep the other part in its place and the lumpen will continue to take their lumps.
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Posted by: Annapurna1 on Feb 6, 2009 8:15 PM
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» RE: 20% unemployment in spain...
Posted by: richholland
» if thats so..then why should anyone be complaining??...
Posted by: Annapurna1
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Posted by: groupw on Feb 7, 2009 3:16 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: ctuck622 on Feb 7, 2009 10:11 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
And for those who live in states like Florida, whose "public servants" care only for their own political ambitions, their own "cash stash," their own healthcare, their own welfare, and their own rights.
Florida's governor Charlie Crist, or "Uncle Chuckie" as I'm so fond of referring to him (and new wife, "Bridezilla") are only concerned about getting out of Florida as politically unscathed as possible, and heading north to embrace the social life of DC (yuck, I personally cannot think of anything more revolting, boring, & phony in this life, but Republicans seem to positively LIVE for such "scenes").
To make matters worse, media outlets in FL are as corrupt as they come, finding all manner of lame excuses to keep me from exposing the truth about FL (thank you AlterNet for being more open-minded).
So America, please help me bang some pots & pans & sign this petition:
http:www.thepetitionsite.com/1/equaljusticeforall
Thank you.
Carol Tucker, MA
Pensacola, FL
a/k/a "Redneck Riviera"
Court Reform-NOW
http://courtreformnow.ning.com
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Posted by: wildbill on Feb 7, 2009 2:41 PM
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Posted by: susanai56 on Feb 7, 2009 5:57 PM
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Posted by: mnstra on Feb 8, 2009 12:24 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Clearly that kind of protest is against the law here in America.And we must write our congressmen to not give any more TARP funds to banks instead
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Posted by: Marina in Paris on Feb 24, 2009 11:23 AM
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» RE: It's the couch-potato phenomenon
Posted by: Marina in Paris
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Posted by: Spot on Feb 3, 2009 12:38 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
all the reforms democrats will dare to push through congress still won't fix this shell of an economy. consumers are indebted to their eyeballs in the face of a collapsing job market, we have no manufacturing, our banks have no capital, and our government is effectively bankrupt.
it's only a matter of time until we're robbing each other to feed the kids.
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» Our Problem is as he says, basically "We refuse to see the elephant in the living room".
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Our Problem is as he says, basically "We refuse to see the elephant in the living room".
Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: Our Problem is as he says, basically "We refuse to see the elephant in the living room".
Posted by: racetoinfinity
» The real elephant in the room . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» You still miss the elephant..... its intentional..... what you say...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: "We refuse to see what's before our eyes." Didn't people just take to the streets?
Posted by: Beck
» Beck, to "see the elephant in the living room" you have to open your eyes.
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: "We refuse to see what's before our eyes." Didn't people just take to the streets?
Posted by: lenioui
» "Israelis" - Why on earth would they do that?
Posted by: truthlover
» Its a long story and off topic,,, so I will address it later when ...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: We never had a choice in the primaries...... the media controlled who our ...
Posted by: Basenjis
» RE: We never had a choice in the primaries...... the media controlled who our ...
Posted by: kogwonton
» Boy, I remember that very well, Kerry asked us to send money....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Boy, I remember that very well, Kerry asked us to send money....
Posted by: kogwonton
» True, and I would never advocate prosecuting for such either...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Kill the banks with credit card rebellion
Posted by: innerlogik
» No safety net here
Posted by: penstamen
» RE: No safety net here
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: No safety net here
Posted by: anneliese-nyc
» RE: fear not WE WILL BE MORE LIKE THEM ONCE FOLKS SEE THE MANIA OF THE NEOCONS
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» I agree, it is and was the neocons... right now that is who fills....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: I agree, it is and was the neocons, repukians, democrats, liberals, idiots...
Posted by: greenPuker
Comments are closed-
Posted by: MJ Fields on Feb 3, 2009 12:42 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our way of life and sense of security haven't been so disrupted yet that we're cold, hungry, desperate, and angry enough to take to the streets.
Yet...
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» Really??? I don't know where you shop for food, but my place...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: eally??? I don't know where you shop for food, but my place...
Posted by: richholland
» Thank you, some sanity is appreciated ..... LOL
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: eally??? I don't know where you shop for food, but my place...
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» RE: Still Business As Usual - THE GREAT RECESSION HASN'T HIT ENOUGH PEOPLE HARD ENOUGH YET..IT WILL!
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» Rather than attack those who screwed us,
Posted by: mcartri
» I think we are beyond taking it to the streets, that just plays into their strength...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Hans B on Feb 3, 2009 12:46 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: Unions.
Posted by: JSquercia
» RE: Unions.
Posted by: KDelphi5950
Comments are closed-
Posted by: and_abottleofrum on Feb 3, 2009 1:17 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Notice that we're last among wealthy nations when it comes to provisioning members of our society with a safety net, while the French are among the best.
Maybe the slow approach isn't working. Maybe it's too weak. Just maybe calls for patience in pursuing change are a delay tactic meant to calm people down until they lose interest in promoting equality and economic security.
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» While the author did say that, he placed more emphasis on the ....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: While the author did say that, he placed more emphasis on the ....
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» RE: While the author did say that, he placed more emphasis on the ....
Posted by: WingedGryphon
» Denial + Anger + Fear =
Posted by: greentime
» See what I mean??? You talk as if the system is working....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: I found Obama's quote on the need for gradual chance intriguing.
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» Good points!
Posted by: badkitty68
» Well then keep these quotes in mind as you submit to your masters...... do you have children?
Posted by: Prophit
» WE HASTEN TOO SLOWLY...SPEED IT UP
Posted by: americansheep
» That's an important observation. The rhetoric is always about put-upon people hoping their kids can
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» Also, when parents hold their anger in check and pour their hopes into their children,
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» RE: That's an important observation. The rhetoric is always about put-upon people hoping their kids can
Posted by: JSquercia
» RE: I found Obama's quote on the need for gradual chance intriguing.
Posted by: kogwonton
Comments are closed-
Posted by: and_abottleofrum on Feb 3, 2009 1:22 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Notice that we're last among wealthy nations when it comes to provisioning members of our society with a safety net, while the French are among the best.
Maybe the slow approach isn't working. Maybe it's too weak. Just maybe calls for patience in pursuing change are a delay tactic meant to calm people down until they lose interest in promoting equality and economic security.
In some cases, and in the long term, a revolutionary history may be better than a reformist one.
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» Didn't meant to post it twice
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
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Posted by: Mister_PsyOps on Feb 3, 2009 2:27 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Venues like Alternet pretend to be an "alternative" to the endless blood money falsity and (of course) hardly do more than peddle retread establishment deceit only slightly less outrageous than that of the corporate monopoly MSM.
Meanwhile real facts and discussion are kept off the table. For the most part, we only hear the usual status quo LIES on genocide sham war and the economics of FASCISM that are recycled in serial reductio ad absurdum so all is masked to make Washington a bastion of "democracy" and "free markets" around the globe.
All of it run though travesty orgs such as the private Ponzi farce "Federal Reserve" Corp that was never federal and has minus nothing at all for reserves.
But the LIES and silencing of the truth don't even begin to conform to the reality of a world run by extortion for extortionists.
Even now, where the planet flies to pieces as a result of one serial scam after the hundreds before all built on the master fraud of false economy run by and for a parasite criminal ruling class, this Alternet writer only talks about the symptoms and NEVER even hints at the root cause of the dysfunction at stake.
Sorry but the stuff of real social revolutions must be based on frank exchange of valid information not on emotional decoy fluff that only reinforces an established ruling class order literally based on global thievery and genocide.
“Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of the truth.”
“The minority, the ruling class at present, has the schools and press, usually the Church as well, under its thumb. This enables it to organize and sway the emotions of the masses, and make its tool of them.”
Doctor Albert Einstein (in a letter to Sigmund Freud 7/30/1932. 1879-1955)
“The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the larger centers has owned the government of the U.S. ever since the days of Andrew Jackson.”
President FDR (on de facto Fascist rule in a letter to corporate monopoly charlatan “Colonel” Edward M. House, co-founder of the Council on Foreign Relations and political fixer for the ruling class. House also handled President Wilson. 11/21/ l933 – from the book "F.D.R.: His Personal Letters" - New York: Duell, Sloan and Pearce 1950)
“When the truth is replaced by silence, the silence is a lie.”
Yevgeny Yevtushenko (Soviet dissident, poet and filmmaker. Yevtushenko was the first Russian to publicly speak out against police state Stalinism (1933-).
“The truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the state."
Joseph Goebbels (minister of propaganda Nazi Germany, 1933-1945)
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» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: PointMan
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: dover23
» You're too stupid to live
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Double wink on that one GuitarBill........
Posted by: Prophit
» True but it starts very young
Posted by: kegbot1
» "They also more or less suck up what the Organized Corporate Criminal media tells them"
Posted by: WhatNow?
» RE: "They also more or less suck up what the Organized Corporate Criminal media tells them"
Posted by: WingedGryphon
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: ron heringhauser
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: praedor
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: dover23
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: kogwonton
» Remember what happened to Michael Ruppert . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» Ruppert is CIA.
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Oh my Gawd, your kidding???? I did not know that... do you have a link..
Posted by: Prophit
» As per your request.
Posted by: GuitarBill
» It doesn't show on there who the author is.....
Posted by: Prophit
» Here's your answer
Posted by: GuitarBill
» That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» Dave McGowan exposes Mike Ruppert
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Dave McGowan?
Posted by: dustdevil
» Catherine Austin Fitts is a "former" Bushit minion.
Posted by: GuitarBill
» RE: Catherine Austin Fitts is a "former" Bushit minion.
Posted by: dustdevil
» Catherine Austin Fitts is a limited hangout artist
Posted by: GuitarBill
» geetarbill, I think you are getting lazy . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» No, you're not paying attention
Posted by: GuitarBill
» Okay, tell me . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» Eliot Spitzer
Posted by: GuitarBill
» I want to thank both you and Dust devil for this exchange...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» RE: That does not make sense . . .
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: P.S.
Posted by: kogwonton
» RE: P.S.
Posted by: dustdevil
» I finally saw the section of the video you were referring to . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» Yeah, me too!!!
Posted by: Prophit
» I remember all that..... its when the tried to run him off the road...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: You are so right, someone who does see the "Elephant in the Living Room"...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: Why Aren't Americans "Rioting"? Because they're BRAINWASHED
Posted by: stopthemaddness2
» MISTER PSY OPS HITS ANOTHER HOMER
Posted by: HANGTRAITORS
» RE: MISTER PSY OPS HITS ANOTHER HOMER
Posted by: EncinoM
» WHAT CAN YOU SAY THAT DISPROVES HIS POSITION?
Posted by: HANGTRAITORS
» EncinoMuck for LIES & LIARS at a DC-MSM POLICE STATE
Posted by: PointMan
» SO FUCKING TRUE!...pardon my french!
Posted by: donl51
Comments are closed-
Posted by: michael1972 on Feb 3, 2009 2:36 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Most Americans don't even understand our current financial state and what it means for their future and how bad things really are. Most Americans are too busy focusing on the Super Bowl and investing several hours of their day with useless chater about touchdowns and slam dunks (idiots).
Most Americans don't understand the Federal reserve (including myself although I have little knowledge of it), Banks, Inflation and budgets. Most Americans are so dumb that they truly believe that none of this stuff will effect their jobs or their way of life until it happens (deer in headlight syndrome).
There will be no riots until people go broke or the economy collapses that the sheep will begin to wake up and realize that there is good chance we wont recover from what could be potentially the greatest meltdown in modern history.
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» RE: American Idiot
Posted by: Sushi
» RE: American Idiot
Posted by: michael1972
» RE: There is no Obama magic, and calling people sheep and idiots is just wrong.
Posted by: michael1972
» Its not wrong if its true...... "The Truth Shall Set you Free".
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: American Idiot...ya hit the nail on the head!
Posted by: donl51
Comments are closed-
Posted by: richholland on Feb 3, 2009 2:42 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
people in the USA sometimes are put in jail 250 years....(probably the judge was senile and doesnt know the average age of human is about 80 years)
The killer who murdered our popular politicianPIM only got 8 years.
childmolesters are put in hospitals ..
So there is a whole world of difference.
In meantime scientists found out that surpression and state violence creates crimes but since it is so PROFITABLE your system will continue..
The strangething is that since OBAMA rightwing politicians seems to be relieved. Is mr.Obama really changing things or does the Mainstreet have to repair all the mistakes of Wallstreet???
Drugusers are considered as patients and never put in jail...
Professor Herz explained that in a depression helping Rich people doesnt linder the problems.
She said give the money to the people who really need it...
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» RE: jails for the brave and the free
Posted by: racetoinfinity
» RE: jails for the brave and the free
Posted by: magoogle
Comments are closed-
Posted by: -matti on Feb 3, 2009 2:51 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They do this in conditions of severe Social Isolation -from their Families, from Neighbors, from fellow Citizens, and even from History itself.
The Author's question is the wrong one.
We should be asking not "Why aren't 'Americans' responding as Sentient Humans?", but rather "Why is anyone surpised by this failure to respond, and why don't we ever talk about the obvious causes of this failure?"
The Author's unconscious invocation of TV-Reality in his final line -"Stay tuned."- would seem to demostrate how deep this Alienation from the Actual World has become.
Of course, there is also a long answer. But why bother with it here? I'm sure I have already exceeded the Internets norm for content and depth as it is.
-matti.
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» many are socially isolated, some by TV, some by their own choice. YOU need to talk to
Posted by: Beck
» RE:"..Democrats are the cause of every damned problem.."
Posted by: Sushi
» RE: Short Answer? TV and Social Isolation.
Posted by: clvngodess
» Your so right, in fact it was the TV and the milllions put into his TV campaign...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Advertising Age's Brand of the year Obama
Posted by: Scottk
» A revolution might cause me to miss American Idol
Posted by: zooeyhall
» RE: A revolution might cause me to miss American Idol
Posted by: anneliese-nyc
Comments are closed-
» RE: A little defensive there...
Posted by: Scottk
» Great comment GUY FOX - reminded me of Ezra Pound's powerfully satiric radio broadcasts
Posted by: FREE SPEECH
Comments are closed-
Posted by: ~Fiona~ on Feb 3, 2009 3:08 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In the second stage of the experiment, one side of the cage was electrified and naturally, the dog would leap to the other side to escape. This stage lasted until it was clear the dog had learned to "Escape" the painful stimuli and would immediately jump to the side that wasn't electrified.
In stage three of the experiment, the partition was closed so the dog could no longer escape, however so long as the dog continued its frantic behavior, the electricity stayed on. Eventually the dog's natural instinct to escape was in scientific terms "Extinguished" and the dog would lay there in the electrified part of the cage without even trying to escape. Even when the partition was removed, the dog no longer tried to escape.
The scientists conducting this torture called this phase of the ordeal, "Learned Helplessness"...
THAT is why we are Not Rioting...
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» RE: "The Whole World is Rioting... Why aren't We???"
Posted by: ellie
» RE: The media wouldn't cover it, so it wouldn't exist
Posted by: Sushi
» Guess what?
Posted by: badkitty68
» "THAT is why we are Not Rioting"...
Posted by: dustdevil
» True, but we can do hidden work.... leaderless resistance is...
Posted by: Prophit
» It is not 1770 . . .
Posted by: dustdevil
» We are almost past that ability.....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: "The Whole World is Rioting... Why aren't We???"
Posted by: pawheel
» I voted for Cynthia... she was by far the best candidate with the most...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: weathered on Feb 3, 2009 3:56 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pull the plug on all MSM/PBS/NPR and flourish or stay stuck in the dark, draconian hole some call home.
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» Please.
Posted by: Beck
» Your right, in fact, throw the TV out of the house... it will change...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: daniel1982 on Feb 3, 2009 4:28 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No it isn't. What are you talking about?
What's with hyperbole?
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» Well that is funny, Iceland is rioting and they have never, in their history....
Posted by: Prophit
» define riot
Posted by: jon B
» RE: errr.
Posted by: beijaflor
Comments are closed-
Posted by: cosborn72 on Feb 3, 2009 4:34 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Most of these protestors are showing anger at their governments, or the US, or big corporations for their role in the meltdown, as well as their response to it.
Americans can't protest over the cause of the meltdown.
Why.
1.) We elected the Bush administration twice, elected congressional representatives that rubber stamped the administrations deregulation and blind-eye to corporate greed. Remember, this country and this government belongs to the people. We are responsible for what has happened over the last 8 (or is it 30?) years.
2.) In some parts of the country, house prices forced homeowners to overextend their ability to pay back a loan, but in my part, tens of thousands of homeowners overextended just to have a McMansion in the 'burbs. While the mortgage companies are to be blamed, so are these homeowners.
3.) The American people accepted NAFTA, shopped at Walmart, and generally sold America's ability to produce real products, allow the shadow financial economy to form.
4.) The American people ran up their credit card debt and spent their savings in an attempt to "Keep up with the Jones".
So, while the American people should be pushing the government to enact swift changes, there is no ground for us to lay blame on anyone other than ourselves. We enabled the corperate greed that got the world to this point, so it doesn't really suit us to be angry at anyone.
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» Putting it Differently,
Posted by: ProgressiveManiac
» Agreed, but
Posted by: badkitty68
» Agreed!
Posted by: ProgressiveManiac
» STOP RIGHT THERE!!!!
Posted by: wireup
» RE: STOP RIGHT THERE!!!!
Posted by: cosborn72
» RE: Responsibility
Posted by: greenknight
Comments are closed-
Posted by: shikejian on Feb 3, 2009 4:50 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The coup has happened and it's happened silently and with tacit approval.
jimsecor
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» RE: Why?
Posted by: magoogle
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Purple Girl on Feb 3, 2009 5:00 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why has no one Called these traitors out on their UnAmerican Activities and Ideology? Lockheeds CEO dared say he could get 9 Mexicans for the price of 1 American- what did he think he was doing Bidding on Slave labor? Does he dare propose American Workers be treated like 3rd World Labor? Talk about an UNPATRIOTIC SOB!! he admitted he could give a Shit about American Values and the American Dream for his fellow citizens. He and the Repugs have Delsuions (and schemes) to bring the Feudalistic Caste System to Our Free market Democracy. Why is it the 'Talent' on wall street has every right to work the market to gain the best price possible, but line workers must settle for what ever the Corps feel like paying them. These Wall street 'Talents' have proven they are not only lazy, but Utterly Incompetent and Criminal. They weren't just stealing Staplers, they were stealing the Capitol which kept the entire Comapny (industry) Afloat! Why is it most American Workers 'bonuses' are dependent on profitablity, and yet the CEO's are not? If my company has a shitty year, my bonus is effected,If not totally non existent! Exxons profits from last year was 45.2 BILLION, Was the aerage workers 'Bonus' Increased, what about their wages or bennies? What was the Top brass'? Certianly Exxon did not pass this on to it's customers- $4.00 a gallon, no wonder they had a Historical Record breaking year- for any industry!
Frankly I don't want riots, and realize Strikes effect the workers bottom line more profoundly. What I want is Mass Prosecutions and Executions for those who have committed Economic Treason Against The United States! Get out your Recycled paper plates, heads will start rolling! (What silver platters have not been hocked are far to good for these Traitors!). Actually scratch that, the Guillotine is far to humane, Hang 'em Low & Slow- so we can watch them struggle, as we have for the last 3 decades!
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» Not just strike, but shut down the entire economy for a week...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Not just strike, but shut down the entire economy for a week...
Posted by: EncinoM
» Good idea. Which of you movers and shakers will start?
Posted by: Beck
» We already have, Beck.... our county council just voted to fund....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Simultaneous Strikes- Union and Non Union
Posted by: magoogle
» Well its worth continuing the discussion on the possibility of it...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Jasonix on Feb 3, 2009 5:23 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The government has gotten good at spinning data so the final results make things look a lot better than they are. There's a site, called ShadowStatistics.com or something like that, that shows what the unemployment numbers would be if we calculated them the way we used to back in the 1980s. In the 1990s, we changed the way we calculate unemployment, inflation, and other indexes so that the most damaging data is left out.
As a result, people think that we're in the beginning stages of a recession, hovering above an abyss, and that things might still turn around. The truth is that we're falling headlong into that abyss already.
But let's be careful that we don't get what we wish for. Rioting is pointless if people are just destroying shit out of anger. We have to have real solutions to fight for. If Americans rioted, it'd be to get more big houses, SUVs, and credit cards. That stuff isn't worth rioting for.
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Comments are closed-
» RE: LOL
Posted by: clvngodess
» While I agree with you, I think it will take more.....
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Farasien on Feb 3, 2009 5:41 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
God (or whoever) save us all.
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» Already, those who are in the condition you describe, they are not...
Posted by: Prophit
» the author is overblowing the case...
Posted by: jon B
» RE: the author is overblowing the case...
Posted by: greenknight
Comments are closed-
Posted by: MyLeftFoot on Feb 3, 2009 5:41 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
from a region that had 2 world wars, hundreds of millions killed...
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» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: and_abottleofrum
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: Quannah
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: the First Paragraph threw me...
Posted by: MyLeftFoot
» Your comment is true, but we all learn from history....
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Philor on Feb 3, 2009 5:41 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
You can make them work, work, work,
Deny them health care, decent retirement and paid vacation (not mandatory as in the rest of the industrialized world) and they still don't bulge.
What does it take for Americans to get angry?
Numbed by junk food, sports, the American wet dream and what else? Pitiful!
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» RE: a nation of sheep
Posted by: clvngodess
» RE: a nation of sheep
Posted by: helenahanbasquet
» One large group just got angry, was not paralyzed, and won.
Posted by: Beck
» Yes, you picked their selection..... now what do you think... you had a choice???
Posted by: Prophit
» Why do I try, Beck??? Because of what JFK said and its true...
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: a nation of angry sheep
Posted by: americansheep
» Kevin Bacon, in Animal House, said it best:
Posted by: mcartri
Comments are closed-
Posted by: snowhound on Feb 3, 2009 5:53 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: We're No. 1; that's a big AND a small attitude here. We don't riot because we despise each other
Posted by: Beck
» So take action..... first throw out your TV, IPOD, and cell phone.
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: So take action..... first throw out your TV, IPOD, and cell phone.
Posted by: snowhound
» Oh, you are so right, I haven't even begun on the vaccines....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: So take action..... Never had a cell phone or Ipod, but TV is no worse than blind ideology
Posted by: Beck
» Beck, your the last person on earth I expect to give up her tv...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: kegbot1 on Feb 3, 2009 5:57 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So on this topic consider:
The FBI could have arrested David Koresh any time he went to town but chose instead, to instigate the destruction of the Waco compound where men, women and children died. Why? Remember the coverage? Message to the American people sent - your government has no compunctions to slaughter you if you resist.
More recently, the completely unnecessary police brutality not only at the WTO protests in Seattle and Miami but the recent detentions and arrests made at the GOP convention in the Twin Cities. These are police state tactics but most Americans shrug - they hear about the arrests but never about the eventual acquittals. Message sent.
And then, who needs an arrest record, even though it may have been completely bogus and unconstitutional? You're boss won't care - you'll be fired anyway and then your family can learn about your inalienable right to live in a shelter. Message sent.
And finally, isn't it interesting how "60 Minutes" and other media showcased the nifty new concentrated microwave torture machines to be field tested in Iraq, but really meant for deployment against future riots amongst the hungry in the USA. You remember - these devices make you feel like your skin is on fire the closer you get. Coming soon to an urban area near you.
Golly those things can HURT!
Message sent.
And still. . . and still. . . people want so badly to believe that they will still wave the flag on national holidays, stand up proudly for the pledge, believe that their country is essentially good and still hate the French.
What is to be done with such a people?
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» RE: People got the message
Posted by: Zimbly
» My question is will you give Obama his chance up until he ....
Posted by: Prophit
» We'll give him more than 2 weeks.
Posted by: Beck
» excellent additions
Posted by: kegbot1
Comments are closed-
Posted by: cmaukonen on Feb 3, 2009 6:16 AM
Current rating: 2 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Chris
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» RE: Oh Man.....
Posted by: michael1972
Comments are closed-
Posted by: Ramcharan on Feb 3, 2009 6:30 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
2) many people in America - I've read estimates as high as 30% - are on tranquilizers, anti-depressants, and mood stabilizers. Some reports say these substances have gotten into the water supplies, so that almost everyone is exposed to them. It's like a mass biochemistry experiment. Wanna control an entire population? Drug 'em!
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» RE: But we marched at convenient times, for short periods, then stopped
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: prozac nation
Posted by: Apolitical Blues
» In England, some 50% of the population is on antidepressants
Posted by: olderworker
» Absolutely correct..... mass brainwashing.....
Posted by: Prophit
» RE: Absolutely correct..... mass brainwashing.....
Posted by: gandolfshep
» Unfortunately it won't happen, its all part of the on going social...
Posted by: Prophit
» Remember though, it was part of Bush's mass forced mental health...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: rickiey on Feb 3, 2009 6:43 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How's that worked out for them? Has it improved ANYTHING?
I would be willing to riot, if I could see how it would help.
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» Civil disobedience is not just rioting.
Posted by: waterflaws
» What should we call Iraq's patriots?
Posted by: billwald
» RE: How, exactly, can rioting help?
Posted by: michael1972
» RE: How, exactly, can rioting help?
Posted by: rickiey
» Well, one of the headlines of the British papers read ....
Posted by: Prophit
» EXACTLY! Civilized white people don't riot
Posted by: billwald
» RE: XACTLY! Civilized white people don't riot
Posted by: Quannah
Comments are closed-
Posted by: open-minded on Feb 3, 2009 6:47 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the millions of the planet will take over their corrupt governments and refuse any longer to be the pawns in this deadening system.
please, let's not turn our anger against our comrades. we have to stick together. the machine is counting on us all losing our minds over what is happening, but we will not give them the gratification of this.
organize in droves. do it everyday. keep the faith in spite of seemingly insurmountable odds. i'm ready and able, who will join me and take the anger and frustration that thousands of us are experiencing and not turn it inward -but to the fearful power-brokers who are barely hanging on.
breathe, and come to realize that WE HAVE THE POWER - they do not(it's all an illusion and dream that we have been a part of)
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» Oh, yes, "Rah, rah, rah, our team won" Yippee, does anyone want....
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
Posted by: mrcentrist on Feb 3, 2009 6:57 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: QuestionAuthority on Feb 3, 2009 7:05 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Republicans are playing a very dangerous game with our future by opposing everything that the incoming Administration tries to do. They could end up setting off a second civil war if no stimulus package is enacted or one that is emasculated is enacted that doesn't work. I don't think that they have picked up on the true zeitgeist that sent Obama into office - and this failure may be fatal.
The time for partisan maneuvering is over. The Republicans can either listen to the people that elected the Democrats and work with them to solve this crisis, or they risk irrelevance or worse.
Let's hope there are enough cool heads on all sides to get this country moving again.
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» This is a tough time to be part of a zeitgeist, because it worked, yet is despised
Posted by: Beck
» you're right
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: you're right
Posted by: Beck
» RE: you're right
Posted by: kegbot1
» RE: I don't agree...
Posted by: gwaring
» I think your right about the waiting, but after his first 17 days...
Posted by: Prophit
Comments are closed-
