COMMENTS: 119
Going to College & Grad School Looks Like a Disaster
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With the job market tanking, have you been thinking that now is the perfect time to go to school, or go back to school, to shore up those job skills and make sure you have an edge in the market?
Think again.
The economic crisis has hit higher education with a triple whammy. Students and their families will need more help paying for school just as colleges struck by financial crises begin charging higher tuition and have less means to provide financial aid.
Already, 37 lenders have stopped making private loans and 168 have stopped offering federally guaranteed loans. Though money is still available -- only 25 of the top 100 lenders, although responsible for 91.5 percent of loans, have dropped out -- increasingly there are conditions attached. Lenders are pulling back from the community college and trade school markets -- where there are higher default rates, lower graduation rates and lower job placement -- at the same time, community colleges are seeing an increasing number of applicants seeking an affordable education option.
"These days the financial aid office is the busiest on campus," says Patricia Hurley, the financial aid director at Glendale Community College in California. "We're working nights and weekends just trying to get all the applications processed."
Though Hurley says the fallout of the financial crisis is only beginning to be reflected on campus, she has seen an increase in students who, due to layoffs and foreclosures, are filing for appeals to reevaluate student loans based on family income from the prior year. Some major lenders have exited the industry entirely or have stopped lending to community colleges, but the number remains small enough that remaining lenders can pick up the slack.
For Hurley, and for financial aid officers in public institutions across the country, the real challenge will be balancing increased demand with major budget cuts. California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger recently proposed a midyear budget cut of $65.5 million for the University of California system, in addition to the $48 million cut already factored into the budget.
"We're having to cut classes and professors," says Hurley. "Tuition will go up. And our outreach efforts to high schools and into the community are being hampered because we no longer have the financial resources. All this is happening at a time when it's critical to get the word out that college is still affordable."
Colleges across the board are hurting. At least 20 states have handed down budget cuts or face tuition increases in their higher-education systems. The University of Florida has already eliminated 430 faculty and staff positions and plans to increase in-state tuition by 15 percent. The University of Massachusetts system has cut $24.6 million for the current fiscal year. And with more students likely to apply to lower-cost public universities, admission will grow even more competitive.
Both private and public universities have watched their endowments plummet. The University of Washington has seen a $400 million drop in assets due chiefly to the faltering stock market. Harvard, Columbia and Duke are all reportedly looking to unload private-equity holdings in an effort to shore up cash. Schools are reporting hiring freezes and postponement of new-construction plans. Even more alarming are the murmurings of midyear tuition hikes and of smaller colleges, with limited endowments and relatively low graduation rates, being forced to close their doors.
As any recent graduate can confirm, college wasn't cheap to begin with. A 2008 College Board report, based on numbers drawn before the credit crunch, revealed tuition hikes of 6.4 percent for public in-state tuitions and 5.9 percent for private colleges in the 2008-2009 academic year. The average in-state tuition and fees at four-year public colleges are $6,585, up $394 from last year. At private universities, published tuition and fees average $25,143, a $1,398 increase over last year.
With mounting financial pressures, students now worry they may have to withdraw from school because their parents can no longer afford the tuition and student loan money will be harder and harder to find. Already, private loans have become difficult to secure, with some major lenders exiting the student loan arena entirely and others, like industry giant Sallie Mae, requiring higher credit scores and more stringent qualifications for cosigners. Student Lending Analytics, an independent research firm, estimates that $5.8 billion to $7.1 billion of private loan capacity has left the market, 31 to 37 percent of available funding. In the past, parents may have counted on taking out home-equity loans to help finance their children's educations, but the mortgage crisis has all but dried up that source of cash, too.
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Comments are closed-
Posted by: thinkverybig on Dec 2, 2008 12:22 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just got out of bed at 1:47am
Tuesday, December 2, 2008
Not able to sleep – too many thoughts roaming my mind
How will I survive? What will I eat?
Rent is due by the 5th
And I don’t have the money yet
I’m holding out hope that I can pull it off of my credit card again
Been living this way for 2 months now
And things are very tight
I haven’t closed on a deal in over 3 months
My very own brother utilized another agent to buy a house
Instead of me
Knowing I could have used the money
His excuse, “I got a good deal”
That really hurts but hey, that’s my brother
I keep most things to myself
All bottled up on the inside with fleeting thoughts of suicide
But no need to worry, I won’t do that!
I’m too chicken
I just wished I had a job, a sense of purpose
All of my bills paid off
Have my daughter proud of her Dad
Get her all of the necessary things she needs
And as for job hunting
I’m finally getting the energy to surf the net
In the past, I’ve been too depressed
But with the recent call from my daughter, asking for financial help
I knew I had to do something
I have to be there for her if not me
So, I choose to live.
Written by: David J. Hudson
© December 2, 2008
www.thinkverybig.com
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» the same past will look rosy in future-so do nto despair man!
Posted by: avatar_singh
» RE: Poem "I Choose To Live"
Posted by: lenox
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 2, 2008 1:15 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» I concur
Posted by: pdxjoe
Comments are closed-
Posted by: gunboat diplomat on Dec 2, 2008 5:01 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Second, the endowments were more and more being used to invest in shady drug ventures and the like - academic greed is the same as any other kind. Drug patents, public-private partnerships - who has time for students when your negotiating your percentage off Monsanto's bovine growth hormone sales (15 cents per dose goes to the University of California).
Why whould we bother educating U.S. students at all? Everything is being outsourced - even the newspapers are going to be run from India - the Indians will just look at the feed from all the Homeland Security surveillance cameras, write their articles, and submit them to Dean Singleton's Media News Gorp, for $5 a pop.
Likewise, all the manufacturing will be done in Mexico and China, and even the R&D divisions are moving (it's best to have R&D next to manufacturing, after all).
This will lead to a wonderful new Third World-style "ownership society" in the U.S., with a handful of wealthy plutocrats controlling what limited wealth exists, serviced by an army of private guards and other lackeys, with a large population of permanently underemployed serfs to pick the servants from.
Sounds great, huh?
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» RE: the corporate-academic-government complex in action
Posted by: Cybershaman
» RE: the corporate-academic-government complex in action
Posted by: Sushi
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Posted by: NoPCZone on Dec 2, 2008 5:07 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
BTW- If there is truly a free market in higher ed, prices should drop. Don't hold your breath waiting for fees and tuition to drop.
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» Oh the 80's
Posted by: Inlander
Comments are closed-
Posted by: functionaladdict on Dec 2, 2008 5:11 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: redbird30328
» I'm sorry, but...
Posted by: gigantor21
» RE: i've been poor
Posted by: swamiji
» RE: i've been poor
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: i've been poor
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: i've been poor
Posted by: dmaciewski
» Wait a minute!
Posted by: BreeMass
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» Since when does Poor = Asshole?
Posted by: 6399
» RE: Since when does Poor = Asshole?
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE:Missing the point of education
Posted by: Sushi
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: gonzoyak
» And by the way
Posted by: gonzoyak
» A. not everyone can be a chemist B. talk to me when...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: A. not everyone can be a chemist B. talk to me when...
Posted by: functionaladdict
» as for your first point, if i can be a chemist, anyone can.
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: as for your first point, if i can be a chemist, anyone can.
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: as for your first point, if i can be a chemist, anyone can.
Posted by: NoKidding
» RE: as for your first point, if i can be a chemist, anyone can.
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: Grandma Crabby
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: BreeMass
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: functionaladdict
» It just goes to show...
Posted by: maddy
» RE: It just goes to show...
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: It just goes to show...
Posted by: BreeMass
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: sre
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: functionaladdict
» Just more sputtering...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: The real problem...
Posted by: Cybershaman
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: fleurette
» Functioning Aspberger's is more like it...
Posted by: NoKidding
» RE: Functioning Aspberger's is more like it...
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Functioning Aspberger's is more like it...
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Functioning Aspberger's is more like it...
Posted by: Pissed Off Woman
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: buzzsaw
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Too bad science funding is so weak.
Posted by: kungfoofighterx
» Why should I hire you?
Posted by: Deep
» RE: Why should I hire you?
Posted by: functionaladdict
Comments are closed-
Posted by: DrGeneNelson on Dec 2, 2008 5:36 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Data are "cherry picked" to support the false claim that "an investment in higher education pays." In almost all cases, this is true only if you are already a member of the economic elite. Careful study of a more oomplete data set shows that the economic value of a Ph.D. is typically negative.
Leaders from industry and academia colluded with the National Science Foundation in the late 1980s to massively increase immigration to hold down U.S. wages in science and engineering fields. Eric Weinstein Paper See, in particular the section, "The NSF's Real Shortage Study."
To reform this dangerous situation, please use the citizen activism tools at NumbersUSA.com
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» RE: A Giant Ponzi Scheme
Posted by: gazey
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Posted by: gigantor21 on Dec 2, 2008 6:57 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pretty much.
That's especially true if he goes somewhere out of the way, since there's nothing better to do. Sex, drinking parties, and drugs. *sigh*
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» RE: College
Posted by: Shehova
» RE: College
Posted by: kabac
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Posted by: gazey on Dec 2, 2008 6:36 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Try being out of work for 15 months!
Posted by: thinkverybig
» RE: Try being out of work for 15 months!
Posted by: gazey
» RE: Try being out of work for 15 months!
Posted by: Fat Man at the Buffet Line
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Posted by: veggiegrrrl on Dec 2, 2008 7:02 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
perhaps it's time for universities to specialize
in save-the-planet degrees?
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» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: Dboy
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: djnoll
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: Dboy
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: dyz64
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: Dboy
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: anonymous black writer
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: anonymous black writer
» Great idea...but these institutions already kind-of exist
Posted by: Physiocrat
» Here's a good eco-college for you...
Posted by: Physiocrat
» RE: Here's a good eco-college for you...
Posted by: Dboy
Comments are closed-
Posted by: elidude420 on Dec 2, 2008 7:52 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Yep
Posted by: BreeMass
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Posted by: eeezzz on Dec 2, 2008 7:55 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Seriously - FED jobs are the way to go. You can retire on a special plan made just for Feds in only 20 years! It's worth the hassle to get in because the job security is built in, pretty much no matter what you do.
Don't get a state job - they don't have any money right now - but the Feds can just print up whatever they need to pay Fed salaries and bennies! And don't buy into the BS about how they have outsourced all of the Fed jobs - not true - that is just another of the Fed worker's offensive tactics aganist losing any of the huge budget dollars that make these places like modern day mini-kingdoms! In no time, as a Fed, you will be wielding power you never knew you had- and denying it!
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» RE: Feds are hiring MA's like crazy
Posted by: tjg1984
» RE: Feds are hiring MA's like crazy
Posted by: gazey
» RE: Feds are hiring MA's like crazy
Posted by: Dboy
Comments are closed-
Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals on Dec 2, 2008 8:35 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
-maybe not everyone is "college" material
-myself it took years after high school for me to really find something that I'm passionate in and there will be a JOB in
-that new football stadium or
-that hot shot new faculty from the Ivy's
-really what the F is your university spending money on? If I was going to get paid for doing something for just doing it, why should I be "price competitive?"
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Posted by: jooljetkmae on Dec 2, 2008 9:16 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We're already there. We don't have a public education system anymore. There are no more tuition free community colleges and tuition free public universities. No civilized country would call turning people in debt peons with high college tuition rates a "public" education system.
I would say for about 9 out of 10 people that it wouldn't be worth it to go to college, either as a undergraduate or graduate, if you can't find a way to earn some money along the way and limit your debt load.
There is a term to describe heavily indebted poor Third World countries, or HIPC's, "Heavily Indebted Poor Country. Here in the U.S. we turn out "Heavily Indebted Poor Graduates", or HIPG's, out of our "public" universities. Avoid becoming one of those by buying in the scam that so called "public higher education" has become.
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Posted by: carlosinhp on Dec 2, 2008 9:19 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This report joins several other reports they've released looking at unions and the positive impacts they have on other groups of working people like latina/os, african-americans, and young workers in the U.S.
Not saying that folks shouldn't go to college or get an advanced degree, just pointing out that for folks that arent able to do that for whatever reason there are other ways to make sure we are getting good jobs.
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Posted by: maddy on Dec 2, 2008 9:29 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First, we must understand that the financial crippling of colleges and universities
1. begun well before this crisis of lending institutions and
2. that that beginning is all about ideology--free market values and a rejection of any kind of social contract.
Let me begin with the point about ideology. If you look back to the Reagan admininistration, they shifted the public discourse about what it means to go to college AS they gutted pell grants. They consciously replaced the notion that "the public supports college students because all of society benefits from their education" to "YOU should PAY for your education because your education only benefits YOU." Thus, as grants were replaced with loans, we were "sold" this as another example of the triumph of "individual freedom," "consumer choice," and the "free market."
This ideological shift also led to a crunch in higher ed institutions--not just because of increasingly tightened sources of public money that were dealt with via tuition hikes--but with a growing and shameful contempt toward non-lucrative degrees. The Socratic tenet of a liberal education--"an unexamined life is not worth living"--was replaced with vocational training--get a degree that will earn money. With college kids facing higher tuition and less public support, such a choice became not only unavoidable, but common sense.
And one more change we have to address here. Again because of this triumph of free market ideology and public gutting, colleges and universities have "re-thought" the professoriate as a cheap pool of readily available labor. Because there is such a need for graduate students--especially at universities and especially in meeting freshman composition requirements--there are far more PhDs (especially humanities) than there are tenure track positions. The result, because of our worship of the bottom line...
As tenure track professors retire, they are being replaced with adjuncts, lecturers, part-timers, and visiting professors. This pool of cheap labor works at poverty level wages (no, I'm not exaggerating), has no job security, and often no health coverage.
So, this story doesn't begin with dried up lenders. It extends back to the Reagan administration and the rise of free market ideology as the dominant philosophy of the past 30 years--it has failed because it INTENDS--please understand this--it INTENDS to GUT all public institutions and to spin that gutting as "individual freedom" and "consumer choice." (Sources: See Naomi Klein and Thomas Frank)
To put it simply: it's Frankenstein meets Horatio Alger.
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Posted by: willymack on Dec 2, 2008 10:20 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: yurbud on Dec 2, 2008 10:26 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Most hire mostly part time instructors and don't offer benefits or job security to them. Consequently, I had to pay out of pocket for the doctor and meds I need to take every day for eight years before any of my employers offered me health insurance.
Because my class load and even whether I had classes at a given school varied from semester to semester, and I had gaps in income, I got deferments and forebearances as often as possible and didn't start paying back my loans on a regular basis until just recently.
That means my original $50,000 nut more than doubled to $100,000, and my payment is more than my rent. It makes planning a family difficult, and was a factor in the end of at least one relationship (with another academic).
This system of loans seems like yet another way to erode the middle class, so that even if you get a good education, you are still a slave to the same banks that sucker everyone else with credit cards and subprime mortgages.
Our society talks a good game about valuing educators, then it underfunds schools, micromanages K-12 teachers to death, punishes most college instructors economically for daring to teach kids how to think critically so they can see through the demagoguery of talk radio and the bland platitudes and weaseling of our end of the political spectrum.
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» RE: Went to grad school, teach college now, and STILL screwed
Posted by: CatDad
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Posted by: gunboat diplomat on Dec 2, 2008 10:32 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They allowed research generated with public taxpayer support to be patented by the university, but in reality those patents end up controlled by giant corporations (like Monsanto).
This is the heart of the modern academic-corporate complex - Bayh-Dole. If those laws are repealed, the entire corporate-academic apparatus will come crashing down. Large corporations will be forced to reinvest in their own R&D departments if they want to own the patents, for example. Professors won't be spending all their time in corporate board room meetings, and so on.
This is the last thing that the administrations of today's public universities want to see happen - most of the them have close ties to Big Pharma or other tech corporations, and they've spent the past 30 years loading up the academic ranks with their greedy and dishonest supporters.
Not only that, academia has avoided being subject to any of the conflict-of-interest regulations that Wall Street and other areas are subject to - because of their "intellectual purity."
What a joke. The modern academic research facility is full of greed, backstabbing competition, and all manner of conflicts - professors on corporate boards trying to make a buck off their own research, you name it. What's even sadder is that the real academic scholars are mostly afraid to talk about it, for fear of being fired.
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» RE: The solution? Repeal Reagan's Bayh-Dole laws of 1982
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: The solution? Repeal Reagan's Bayh-Dole laws of 1982
Posted by: gunboat diplomat
» RE: The solution? Repeal Reagan's Bayh-Dole laws of 1982
Posted by: bluepilgrim
Comments are closed-
Posted by: functionaladdict on Dec 2, 2008 11:11 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
no, i haven't gone on about how much i love my subject. but i do. i would not be doing this to myself if i didn't. i think biophysics and quantum biology are making exciting inroads into how life works (a very complicated problem indeed), and i want to be a part of those discoveries.
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» yikes!
Posted by: maddy
» RE: yikes!
Posted by: functionaladdict
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Posted by: zooeyhall on Dec 2, 2008 1:16 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm not talking the ultra-techo type of education that gives you an MBA or a Degree in Information Technology. It is the "learning of asking questions" that COUNTS in this world. And I am referring to the degrees in the Liberal Arts--the ones that teach people to think critically about the world and ask that very dangerous question: "WHY?"
Just look at the totalitarian regimes of the world, past and present. They did not arrest the chemists, the engineers, the computer geeks. No! The first people that are carted-off in the middle of the night by the secret police are the philosphers, the authors, the social scientists. Because they are the truly dangerous ones to a tyrannical society.
Remember the great tv series "The Prisoner"? There was an episode called "The General" about a super computer that could instantly and en masse teach all kinds of facts to students. The Prisoner blew it up by typing into it one question to answer: W * H* Y* ?
So just remember all you Liberal Arts grads--you may not think so but there are people who are VERY AFRAID of you!
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» Liberal arts grads are dangerous!?
Posted by: Ayla87
» RE: A GOOD college education makes you DANGEROUS!
Posted by: rickiey
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Posted by: penobscotdziekuje@yahoo.com on Dec 2, 2008 3:13 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's nice that the federal government and others have stepped in to make financial aid more affordable (and accessible), but if students can't get the money and have to work, this means obtaining a degree will take a lot longer, preventing businesses with the necessary labor to promote growth and capital; and in the worst case scenario, education will be for the ones who can afford an Ivy League type education. We will have a multitiered strata of educated and the undereducated. Will we be a nation of Joe the Plumber types or one of Bill Gates and the techies, for argument's sake?
Each one has a societal need. We have clogged drains and need someone to build our technical devices like Blackberries and iPods, PS3's and the like. But then again, having a degree doesn't ward off a layoff but it could help getting a decent job after college. That's the purpose of higher education; but now with all the depressing news we feel betrayed by the tenets of college. School's out. Show me the money and you'll get in!
Some will have a degree, while others are forced into the junior college/technical school route where there is little promise of a job and future anxiety. Adding to this will be the massive debt if you go to a school like Pennsylvania or Vanderbilt-two great schools-that must be paid off.
If revenue dries up, schools can't hire professors or fund other programs for interpersonal development; cuts will be made to the music, journalism, athletics, liberal arts departments, etc. That will not attract students. There will not be any scholarships available for one particular discipline.
Let's hope the new president and those who care about education can reverse some of the disturbing trends occuring on our campuses. If not, colleges will have to cut back on cutting back close to the marrow in the bone.
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Posted by: Physiocrat on Dec 2, 2008 3:16 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm definitely not defending or condoning his murderous terrorism, but intellectually he was clearly on to something; read for yourself if you have some extra time: see what he had to say in "Industrial Society And Its Future"
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» RE: Ah...Teddy...you were ahead of your time...
Posted by: Cybershaman
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Posted by: left_libertarian on Dec 2, 2008 6:41 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: If You Can, Work With Your Hands: Be A Car Mechanic
Posted by: Noor
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Posted by: waynep on Dec 2, 2008 9:41 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I know plenty of business and science majors who are white rich kids of limited ability who drink excessively and fornicate randomly. I also know many liberal arts majors who were bright, poor, and not into the drinking or drug scene at all. I happen to be one of them. Fornication on the other hand...hopefully, occasionally at least, and selectively .
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Posted by: leTerrassier on Dec 3, 2008 12:59 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: Juven on Dec 3, 2008 6:37 PM
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Posted by: waynep on Dec 2, 2008 9:32 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In the meantime, do encourage your children early on to value education, and to understand that ultimately, their future is in their hands. My youngest son was well aware that his single artist father who was in poor health was NOT going to be a likely source of money for college. He would get all of the love, encouragement, and emotional support that I could poor into him, but financially, it was on his shoulders. Graduating as valedictorian of his class, he received a full ride scholarship as an undergrad. He worked in the summer to provide extra income. He did very well as an undergrad, and has now been awarded a full fellowship at a major (Big Ten) college to do his MFA. In addition to the full scholarship, the fellowship pays him a decent salary simply to be a successful student. Needless to say, I am very proud of my son. He will graduate without any debt. My reason for going here is to encourage you to tell your child not to be discouraged by the current situation. If they want it badly enough, it is there for the taking. The value of doing well in school still pays off handsomely.
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Posted by: Noor on Dec 3, 2008 8:46 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yet somehow my girls managed to hold down low level employment whilst in the first years of university and now are finishing up their degrees on scholarships. When they both were reaching burn-out and genuine fear of their accruing student debt loads, the miracle of scholarships appeared, offered because of their attitudes and hard work.
One will have her Ph.D. in Computers and Medical Applications, the other equally scientific.
They are grateful for the opportunities that have been theirs unlike this snooty childe. They have meaningful work to walk into when they are done and are proud to be pioneering females in a heretofore male dominated field.
Meanwhile. This is the THIRD post I have found this morning in AlterNet that has been derailed to the attitudes of a writer, whom I consider to be a TROLL, who ends up garnering the indignation and attention of other readers. Who loses? The original topic under discussion!
I propose readers just accept these attitudes, acknowledge they exist, and get on with the real meat and potatoes instead of being diverted by such childish ploys.
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Posted by: Deep on Dec 3, 2008 1:40 PM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
However in my first year, at a private university in Boston, I found chemistry to be frustrating and biology boring. I wanted to explore other majors, but my parents didn't want to spend $25,000 for me to "explore". So, I transfered to the state university. Given that was the
Dotcom boom, I jumped on the computer science bandwagon. I even took an internship at a dotcom company-that is now defunct. Only to find out, that I hate programming. The only way to pass the class I found was to cheat off my classmates, and that's no way to take class. With my GPA so low, that I was put on academic probation, I had to pick another major. Given that I took a geography class, received an A in it, and liked a lot, I decided to major in geography.
As a geography major, I actually enjoyed learning. I enjoyed studying, and talking to classmates. Because geography was not a very popular major at my alma mater, the department was small and I got to know my professors. I went from academic probation to the dean's list. I rediscovered the true meaning of what it means to be in college. And you know what:I FOUND A JOB WITH MY GEOGRAPHY DEGREE.
If you want to know what a real degree is, it is one where you are happy with, one where it enable what you want to do. To me a computer science degree is as real as a geography degree is to others.
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» RE: What is a "real" degree?
Posted by: anonymous black writer
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Posted by: doctorsquared on Dec 4, 2008 1:05 PM
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Posted by: CA NOW on Dec 4, 2008 11:04 PM
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Posted by: ender on Dec 5, 2008 7:02 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There used to be a value-added tax that prevented this kind of situation and protected workers in both countries. We need this NOW.
Here's how it works:
Let's say a shirt is made in the USA and the labor cost per shirt is $1.00. When a shirt made in China with a labor cost of $0.05 is imported, then a $0.95 tax must be paid on those sneakers. In this way, there is no financial incentive to move productions overseas or to abuse workers in either country. The race to the bottom is eliminated because labor costs are equalized.
Of course, we could just get rid of the corporations that got us into this mess in the first place. Corporations own everything, have enslaved humanity, are destroying the planet, and have become more powerful than most sovereign countries...
(They are now engaging in warfare, or have you never heard of Halliburton and Blackwater?)
Sure they don't have heads to guillotine off, but they do have nice, juicy assets that we can feast on that - let's face it - we've already paid for in triple.
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Posted by: Raymond Emerson on Dec 6, 2008 10:44 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I reccomend you do as much community college as you can. I suggest you shop for price. You don't really need a name brand degree until after you finish a PhD. When you finish the PhD go start applying for post-doctorate money. Its out there. Then go get all of the snob appeal you feel you need.
By this time the economy should be marching just fine. You will have used your time profitably. Its your life. Don't go wasting it.
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» Besides if you do your post-doc in the right place you will actually
Posted by: Raymond Emerson
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Posted by: cori on Dec 7, 2008 11:25 PM
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Posted by: thinkverybig on Dec 2, 2008 12:22 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Just got out of bed at 1:47am
Tuesday, December 2, 2008
Not able to sleep – too many thoughts roaming my mind
How will I survive? What will I eat?
Rent is due by the 5th
And I don’t have the money yet
I’m holding out hope that I can pull it off of my credit card again
Been living this way for 2 months now
And things are very tight
I haven’t closed on a deal in over 3 months
My very own brother utilized another agent to buy a house
Instead of me
Knowing I could have used the money
His excuse, “I got a good deal”
That really hurts but hey, that’s my brother
I keep most things to myself
All bottled up on the inside with fleeting thoughts of suicide
But no need to worry, I won’t do that!
I’m too chicken
I just wished I had a job, a sense of purpose
All of my bills paid off
Have my daughter proud of her Dad
Get her all of the necessary things she needs
And as for job hunting
I’m finally getting the energy to surf the net
In the past, I’ve been too depressed
But with the recent call from my daughter, asking for financial help
I knew I had to do something
I have to be there for her if not me
So, I choose to live.
Written by: David J. Hudson
© December 2, 2008
www.thinkverybig.com
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» the same past will look rosy in future-so do nto despair man!
Posted by: avatar_singh
» RE: Poem "I Choose To Live"
Posted by: lenox
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Posted by: maxpayne on Dec 2, 2008 1:15 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» I concur
Posted by: pdxjoe
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Posted by: gunboat diplomat on Dec 2, 2008 5:01 AM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Second, the endowments were more and more being used to invest in shady drug ventures and the like - academic greed is the same as any other kind. Drug patents, public-private partnerships - who has time for students when your negotiating your percentage off Monsanto's bovine growth hormone sales (15 cents per dose goes to the University of California).
Why whould we bother educating U.S. students at all? Everything is being outsourced - even the newspapers are going to be run from India - the Indians will just look at the feed from all the Homeland Security surveillance cameras, write their articles, and submit them to Dean Singleton's Media News Gorp, for $5 a pop.
Likewise, all the manufacturing will be done in Mexico and China, and even the R&D divisions are moving (it's best to have R&D next to manufacturing, after all).
This will lead to a wonderful new Third World-style "ownership society" in the U.S., with a handful of wealthy plutocrats controlling what limited wealth exists, serviced by an army of private guards and other lackeys, with a large population of permanently underemployed serfs to pick the servants from.
Sounds great, huh?
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» RE: the corporate-academic-government complex in action
Posted by: Cybershaman
» RE: the corporate-academic-government complex in action
Posted by: Sushi
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Posted by: NoPCZone on Dec 2, 2008 5:07 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
BTW- If there is truly a free market in higher ed, prices should drop. Don't hold your breath waiting for fees and tuition to drop.
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» Oh the 80's
Posted by: Inlander
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Posted by: functionaladdict on Dec 2, 2008 5:11 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: redbird30328
» I'm sorry, but...
Posted by: gigantor21
» RE: i've been poor
Posted by: swamiji
» RE: i've been poor
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: i've been poor
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: i've been poor
Posted by: dmaciewski
» Wait a minute!
Posted by: BreeMass
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Wait a minute!
Posted by: bluepilgrim
» Since when does Poor = Asshole?
Posted by: 6399
» RE: Since when does Poor = Asshole?
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE:Missing the point of education
Posted by: Sushi
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: gonzoyak
» And by the way
Posted by: gonzoyak
» A. not everyone can be a chemist B. talk to me when...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: A. not everyone can be a chemist B. talk to me when...
Posted by: functionaladdict
» as for your first point, if i can be a chemist, anyone can.
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: as for your first point, if i can be a chemist, anyone can.
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: as for your first point, if i can be a chemist, anyone can.
Posted by: NoKidding
» RE: as for your first point, if i can be a chemist, anyone can.
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: Grandma Crabby
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: BreeMass
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: functionaladdict
» It just goes to show...
Posted by: maddy
» RE: It just goes to show...
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: It just goes to show...
Posted by: BreeMass
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: sre
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: functionaladdict
» Just more sputtering...
Posted by: JoshuaLudd
» RE: The real problem...
Posted by: Cybershaman
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: fleurette
» Functioning Aspberger's is more like it...
Posted by: NoKidding
» RE: Functioning Aspberger's is more like it...
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Functioning Aspberger's is more like it...
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Functioning Aspberger's is more like it...
Posted by: Pissed Off Woman
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: buzzsaw
» RE: i'm just graduating from graduate school
Posted by: functionaladdict
» RE: Too bad science funding is so weak.
Posted by: kungfoofighterx
» Why should I hire you?
Posted by: Deep
» RE: Why should I hire you?
Posted by: functionaladdict
Comments are closed-
Posted by: DrGeneNelson on Dec 2, 2008 5:36 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Data are "cherry picked" to support the false claim that "an investment in higher education pays." In almost all cases, this is true only if you are already a member of the economic elite. Careful study of a more oomplete data set shows that the economic value of a Ph.D. is typically negative.
Leaders from industry and academia colluded with the National Science Foundation in the late 1980s to massively increase immigration to hold down U.S. wages in science and engineering fields. Eric Weinstein Paper See, in particular the section, "The NSF's Real Shortage Study."
To reform this dangerous situation, please use the citizen activism tools at NumbersUSA.com
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» RE: A Giant Ponzi Scheme
Posted by: gazey
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Posted by: gigantor21 on Dec 2, 2008 6:57 AM
Current rating: 3 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pretty much.
That's especially true if he goes somewhere out of the way, since there's nothing better to do. Sex, drinking parties, and drugs. *sigh*
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» RE: College
Posted by: Shehova
» RE: College
Posted by: kabac
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Posted by: gazey on Dec 2, 2008 6:36 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Try being out of work for 15 months!
Posted by: thinkverybig
» RE: Try being out of work for 15 months!
Posted by: gazey
» RE: Try being out of work for 15 months!
Posted by: Fat Man at the Buffet Line
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Posted by: veggiegrrrl on Dec 2, 2008 7:02 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
perhaps it's time for universities to specialize
in save-the-planet degrees?
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» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: Dboy
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: djnoll
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: Dboy
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: dyz64
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: Dboy
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: anonymous black writer
» RE: eco universities?
Posted by: anonymous black writer
» Great idea...but these institutions already kind-of exist
Posted by: Physiocrat
» Here's a good eco-college for you...
Posted by: Physiocrat
» RE: Here's a good eco-college for you...
Posted by: Dboy
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Posted by: elidude420 on Dec 2, 2008 7:52 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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» Yep
Posted by: BreeMass
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Posted by: eeezzz on Dec 2, 2008 7:55 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Seriously - FED jobs are the way to go. You can retire on a special plan made just for Feds in only 20 years! It's worth the hassle to get in because the job security is built in, pretty much no matter what you do.
Don't get a state job - they don't have any money right now - but the Feds can just print up whatever they need to pay Fed salaries and bennies! And don't buy into the BS about how they have outsourced all of the Fed jobs - not true - that is just another of the Fed worker's offensive tactics aganist losing any of the huge budget dollars that make these places like modern day mini-kingdoms! In no time, as a Fed, you will be wielding power you never knew you had- and denying it!
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» RE: Feds are hiring MA's like crazy
Posted by: tjg1984
» RE: Feds are hiring MA's like crazy
Posted by: gazey
» RE: Feds are hiring MA's like crazy
Posted by: Dboy
Comments are closed-
Posted by: theVRWCwhodatesLiberals on Dec 2, 2008 8:35 AM
Current rating: 1 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
-maybe not everyone is "college" material
-myself it took years after high school for me to really find something that I'm passionate in and there will be a JOB in
-that new football stadium or
-that hot shot new faculty from the Ivy's
-really what the F is your university spending money on? If I was going to get paid for doing something for just doing it, why should I be "price competitive?"
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Posted by: jooljetkmae on Dec 2, 2008 9:16 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We're already there. We don't have a public education system anymore. There are no more tuition free community colleges and tuition free public universities. No civilized country would call turning people in debt peons with high college tuition rates a "public" education system.
I would say for about 9 out of 10 people that it wouldn't be worth it to go to college, either as a undergraduate or graduate, if you can't find a way to earn some money along the way and limit your debt load.
There is a term to describe heavily indebted poor Third World countries, or HIPC's, "Heavily Indebted Poor Country. Here in the U.S. we turn out "Heavily Indebted Poor Graduates", or HIPG's, out of our "public" universities. Avoid becoming one of those by buying in the scam that so called "public higher education" has become.
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Posted by: carlosinhp on Dec 2, 2008 9:19 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This report joins several other reports they've released looking at unions and the positive impacts they have on other groups of working people like latina/os, african-americans, and young workers in the U.S.
Not saying that folks shouldn't go to college or get an advanced degree, just pointing out that for folks that arent able to do that for whatever reason there are other ways to make sure we are getting good jobs.
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Posted by: maddy on Dec 2, 2008 9:29 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First, we must understand that the financial crippling of colleges and universities
1. begun well before this crisis of lending institutions and
2. that that beginning is all about ideology--free market values and a rejection of any kind of social contract.
Let me begin with the point about ideology. If you look back to the Reagan admininistration, they shifted the public discourse about what it means to go to college AS they gutted pell grants. They consciously replaced the notion that "the public supports college students because all of society benefits from their education" to "YOU should PAY for your education because your education only benefits YOU." Thus, as grants were replaced with loans, we were "sold" this as another example of the triumph of "individual freedom," "consumer choice," and the "free market."
This ideological shift also led to a crunch in higher ed institutions--not just because of increasingly tightened sources of public money that were dealt with via tuition hikes--but with a growing and shameful contempt toward non-lucrative degrees. The Socratic tenet of a liberal education--"an unexamined life is not worth living"--was replaced with vocational training--get a degree that will earn money. With college kids facing higher tuition and less public support, such a choice became not only unavoidable, but common sense.
And one more change we have to address here. Again because of this triumph of free market ideology and public gutting, colleges and universities have "re-thought" the professoriate as a cheap pool of readily available labor. Because there is such a need for graduate students--especially at universities and especially in meeting freshman composition requirements--there are far more PhDs (especially humanities) than there are tenure track positions. The result, because of our worship of the bottom line...
As tenure track professors retire, they are being replaced with adjuncts, lecturers, part-timers, and visiting professors. This pool of cheap labor works at poverty level wages (no, I'm not exaggerating), has no job security, and often no health coverage.
So, this story doesn't begin with dried up lenders. It extends back to the Reagan administration and the rise of free market ideology as the dominant philosophy of the past 30 years--it has failed because it INTENDS--please understand this--it INTENDS to GUT all public institutions and to spin that gutting as "individual freedom" and "consumer choice." (Sources: See Naomi Klein and Thomas Frank)
To put it simply: it's Frankenstein meets Horatio Alger.
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Posted by: willymack on Dec 2, 2008 10:20 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
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Posted by: yurbud on Dec 2, 2008 10:26 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Most hire mostly part time instructors and don't offer benefits or job security to them. Consequently, I had to pay out of pocket for the doctor and meds I need to take every day for eight years before any of my employers offered me health insurance.
Because my class load and even whether I had classes at a given school varied from semester to semester, and I had gaps in income, I got deferments and forebearances as often as possible and didn't start paying back my loans on a regular basis until just recently.
That means my original $50,000 nut more than doubled to $100,000, and my payment is more than my rent. It makes planning a family difficult, and was a factor in the end of at least one relationship (with another academic).
This system of loans seems like yet another way to erode the middle class, so that even if you get a good education, you are still a slave to the same banks that sucker everyone else with credit cards and subprime mortgages.
Our society talks a good game about valuing educators, then it underfunds schools, micromanages K-12 teachers to death, punishes most college instructors economically for daring to teach kids how to think critically so they can see through the demagoguery of talk radio and the bland platitudes and weaseling of our end of the political spectrum.
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» RE: Went to grad school, teach college now, and STILL screwed
Posted by: CatDad
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Posted by: gunboat diplomat on Dec 2, 2008 10:32 AM
Current rating: 5 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
They allowed research generated with public taxpayer support to be patented by the university, but in reality those patents end up controlled by giant corporations (like Monsanto).
This is the heart of the modern academic-corporate complex - Bayh-Dole. If those laws are repealed, the entire corporate-academic apparatus will come crashing down. Large corporations will be forced to reinvest in their own R&D departments if they want to own the patents, for example. Professors won't be spending all their time in corporate board room meetings, and so on.
This is the last thing that the administrations of today's public universities want to see happen - most of the them have close ties to Big Pharma or other tech corporations, and they've spent the past 30 years loading up the academic ranks with their greedy and dishonest supporters.
Not only that, academia has avoided being subject to any of the conflict-of-interest regulations that Wall Street and other areas are subject to - because of their "intellectual purity."
What a joke. The modern academic research facility is full of greed, backstabbing competition, and all manner of conflicts - professors on corporate boards trying to make a buck off their own research, you name it. What's even sadder is that the real academic scholars are mostly afraid to talk about it, for fear of being fired.
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» RE: The solution? Repeal Reagan's Bayh-Dole laws of 1982
Posted by: EncinoM
» RE: The solution? Repeal Reagan's Bayh-Dole laws of 1982
Posted by: gunboat diplomat
» RE: The solution? Repeal Reagan's Bayh-Dole laws of 1982
Posted by: bluepilgrim
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Posted by: functionaladdict on Dec 2, 2008 11:11 AM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
no, i haven't gone on about how much i love my subject. but i do. i would not be doing this to myself if i didn't. i think biophysics and quantum biology are making exciting inroads into how life works (a very complicated problem indeed), and i want to be a part of those discoveries.
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» yikes!
Posted by: maddy
» RE: yikes!
Posted by: functionaladdict
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Posted by: zooeyhall on Dec 2, 2008 1:16 PM
Current rating: 4 [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm not talking the ultra-techo type of education that gives you an MBA or a Degree in Information Technology. It is the "learning of asking questions" that COUNTS in this world. And I am referring to the degrees in the Liberal Arts--the ones that teach people to think critically about the world and ask that very dangerous question: "WHY?"
Just look at the totalitarian regimes of the world, past and present. They did not arrest the chemists, the engineers, the computer geeks. No! The first people that are carted-off in the middle of the night by the secret police are the philosphers, the authors, the social scientists. Because they are the truly dangerous ones to a tyrannical society.
Remember the great tv series "The Prisoner"? There was an episode called "The General" about a super computer that could instantly and en masse teach all kinds of facts to students. The Prisoner blew it up by typing into it one question to answer: W * H* Y* ?
So just remember all you Liberal Arts grads--you may not think so but there are people who are VERY AFRAID of you!
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» Liberal arts grads are dangerous!?
Posted by: Ayla87
» RE: A GOOD college education makes you DANGEROUS!
Posted by: rickiey
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Posted by: penobscotdziekuje@yahoo.com on Dec 2, 2008 3:13 PM
Current rating: Not yet rated [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's nice that the federal government and others have stepped in to make financial aid more affordable (and accessible), but if students can't get the money and have to work, this means obtaining a degree will take a lot longer, preventing businesses with the necessary labor to promote growth and capital; and in the worst case scenario, education will be for the ones who can afford an Ivy League type education. We will have a multitiered strata of educated and the undereducated. Will we be a nation of Joe the Plumber types or one of Bill Gates and the techies, for argument's sake?
Each one has a societal need. We have clogged drains and need someone to build our technical devices like Blackberries and iPods, PS3's and the like. But then again, having a degree doesn't ward off a layoff but it could help getting a decent job after college. That's the purpose of higher education; but now with all the depressing news we feel betrayed by the tenets of college. School's out. Show me the money and you'll get in!
Some will have a degree, while others are forced into the junior college/technical school route where there is little promise of a job and future anxiety. Adding to this will be the massive debt if you go to a school like Pennsylvania or Vanderbilt-two great schools-that must be paid off.
If revenue dries up, schools can't hire professors or fund other programs for interpersonal development; cuts will be made to the music, journalism, athletics, liberal arts departments, etc. That will not attract students. There will not be any scholarships available for one particular discipline.
Let's hope the new president and those who care about education can reverse some of the disturbing trends occuring on our campuses. If not, colleges will have to cut back on cutting back close to the marrow in the bone.
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Posted by: Physiocrat on Dec 2, 2008 3:16 PM
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I'm definitely not defending or condoning his murderous terrorism, but intellectually he was clearly on to something; read for yourself if you have some extra time: see what he had to say in "Industrial Society And Its Future"
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» RE: Ah...Teddy...you were ahead of your time...
Posted by: Cybershaman
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Posted by: left_libertarian on Dec 2, 2008 6:41 PM
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» RE: If You Can, Work With Your Hands: Be A Car Mechanic
Posted by: Noor
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Posted by: waynep on Dec 2, 2008 9:41 PM
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I know plenty of business and science majors who are white rich kids of limited ability who drink excessively and fornicate randomly. I also know many liberal arts majors who were bright, poor, and not into the drinking or drug scene at all. I happen to be one of them. Fornication on the other hand...hopefully, occasionally at least, and selectively .
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Posted by: leTerrassier on Dec 3, 2008 12:59 AM
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Posted by: Juven on Dec 3, 2008 6:37 PM
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Posted by: waynep on Dec 2, 2008 9:32 PM
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In the meantime, do encourage your children early on to value education, and to understand that ultimately, their future is in their hands. My youngest son was well aware that his single artist father who was in poor health was NOT going to be a likely source of money for college. He would get all of the love, encouragement, and emotional support that I could poor into him, but financially, it was on his shoulders. Graduating as valedictorian of his class, he received a full ride scholarship as an undergrad. He worked in the summer to provide extra income. He did very well as an undergrad, and has now been awarded a full fellowship at a major (Big Ten) college to do his MFA. In addition to the full scholarship, the fellowship pays him a decent salary simply to be a successful student. Needless to say, I am very proud of my son. He will graduate without any debt. My reason for going here is to encourage you to tell your child not to be discouraged by the current situation. If they want it badly enough, it is there for the taking. The value of doing well in school still pays off handsomely.
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Posted by: Noor on Dec 3, 2008 8:46 AM
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Yet somehow my girls managed to hold down low level employment whilst in the first years of university and now are finishing up their degrees on scholarships. When they both were reaching burn-out and genuine fear of their accruing student debt loads, the miracle of scholarships appeared, offered because of their attitudes and hard work.
One will have her Ph.D. in Computers and Medical Applications, the other equally scientific.
They are grateful for the opportunities that have been theirs unlike this snooty childe. They have meaningful work to walk into when they are done and are proud to be pioneering females in a heretofore male dominated field.
Meanwhile. This is the THIRD post I have found this morning in AlterNet that has been derailed to the attitudes of a writer, whom I consider to be a TROLL, who ends up garnering the indignation and attention of other readers. Who loses? The original topic under discussion!
I propose readers just accept these attitudes, acknowledge they exist, and get on with the real meat and potatoes instead of being diverted by such childish ploys.
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Posted by: Deep on Dec 3, 2008 1:40 PM
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However in my first year, at a private university in Boston, I found chemistry to be frustrating and biology boring. I wanted to explore other majors, but my parents didn't want to spend $25,000 for me to "explore". So, I transfered to the state university. Given that was the
Dotcom boom, I jumped on the computer science bandwagon. I even took an internship at a dotcom company-that is now defunct. Only to find out, that I hate programming. The only way to pass the class I found was to cheat off my classmates, and that's no way to take class. With my GPA so low, that I was put on academic probation, I had to pick another major. Given that I took a geography class, received an A in it, and liked a lot, I decided to major in geography.
As a geography major, I actually enjoyed learning. I enjoyed studying, and talking to classmates. Because geography was not a very popular major at my alma mater, the department was small and I got to know my professors. I went from academic probation to the dean's list. I rediscovered the true meaning of what it means to be in college. And you know what:I FOUND A JOB WITH MY GEOGRAPHY DEGREE.
If you want to know what a real degree is, it is one where you are happy with, one where it enable what you want to do. To me a computer science degree is as real as a geography degree is to others.
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» RE: What is a "real" degree?
Posted by: anonymous black writer
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Posted by: doctorsquared on Dec 4, 2008 1:05 PM
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Posted by: CA NOW on Dec 4, 2008 11:04 PM
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Posted by: ender on Dec 5, 2008 7:02 PM
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There used to be a value-added tax that prevented this kind of situation and protected workers in both countries. We need this NOW.
Here's how it works:
Let's say a shirt is made in the USA and the labor cost per shirt is $1.00. When a shirt made in China with a labor cost of $0.05 is imported, then a $0.95 tax must be paid on those sneakers. In this way, there is no financial incentive to move productions overseas or to abuse workers in either country. The race to the bottom is eliminated because labor costs are equalized.
Of course, we could just get rid of the corporations that got us into this mess in the first place. Corporations own everything, have enslaved humanity, are destroying the planet, and have become more powerful than most sovereign countries...
(They are now engaging in warfare, or have you never heard of Halliburton and Blackwater?)
Sure they don't have heads to guillotine off, but they do have nice, juicy assets that we can feast on that - let's face it - we've already paid for in triple.
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Posted by: Raymond Emerson on Dec 6, 2008 10:44 PM
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I reccomend you do as much community college as you can. I suggest you shop for price. You don't really need a name brand degree until after you finish a PhD. When you finish the PhD go start applying for post-doctorate money. Its out there. Then go get all of the snob appeal you feel you need.
By this time the economy should be marching just fine. You will have used your time profitably. Its your life. Don't go wasting it.
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» Besides if you do your post-doc in the right place you will actually
Posted by: Raymond Emerson
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Posted by: cori on Dec 7, 2008 11:25 PM
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Tax the Corporations and the Rich or Take Draconian Cuts -- the Decision Is Ours
Home Underwater? Walk Away from Geithner's Perverse 'Homeowner Relief' Plan
Fury at Wall St. Banks Fuels Public Action for Move Your Money Campaign




