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The Financial Crisis Just Might Lead to Legal Pot

The recession is spotlighting the rationale for decriminalizing marijuana.
March 13, 2009  |  
 
 
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NEW YORK -- In 1977, President Jimmy Carter asked Congress to decriminalize marijuana possession (it never did). The next year, the Ladies Home Journal described a summer jazz festival on the White House's South Lawn where "a haze of marijuana smoke hung heavy under the low-bending branches of a magnolia tree."

The late 1970's may have been the high-water mark for permissiveness regarding marijuana. But advocates of decriminalized pot believe a confluence of factors, especially the country's economic malaise, are leading to another countrywide reappraisal of the drug.

"There is momentum of the sort I haven't seen since I've been involved in this," says Ethan Nadelmann, executive director of the New York-based Drug Policy Alliance, which supports easing marijuana laws.

He says incidents like then-candidate Barack Obama's early admission of pot use or the flap over Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps's bong-smoking may lead to initial public hand-wringing, but in the end they tend to legitimize pot use. So does the growing recognition of medical marijuana.

But, he adds, "the economic crisis is the single most important factor" in this new shift in perceptions.

That's because the ailing economy is triggering a scramble for new government savings or sources of revenue. Nadelmann compares today's marijuana laws to alcohol prohibition, approved during prosperous times in 1920 only to become unpopular during the Great Depression. Prohibition was finally repealed in 1933, in part due to the cost of reining in illegal booze and the need to recoup lost tax revenue in tough economic times.

As he signed a law easing prohibition, President Franklin Roosevelt reportedly quipped, "I think this would be a good time for a beer."

Is our recession-plagued present a good time for a joint? Legalizing, taxing and regulating marijuana, would pull the rug out from under pot dealers in urban America, and create a crisis for them, but it would likely prove a boon for state budgets. In an oft-cited 2006 report on U.S. marijuana production, expert Jon Gettman used "conservative price estimates" to peg the value of the annual crop at $36 billion--more valuable than corn and wheat combined.

Three national polls this year showed a surprising number of Americans think marijuana should be legal. Zogby, CBS News and Rasmussen all recorded support for legalization hovering at around 40 percent. Nadelmann of the DPA believes support would have been higher if the question was whether or not marijuana should be taxed and regulated.

California Assemblyman Tom Ammiano has proposed a bill to tax and regulate legal marijuana, which he says would generate $1 billion in revenue for the Golden State's anemic budget. Ammiano, who represents areas of San Francisco, says his proposal, unveiled last month, is "simply common sense," considering the unprecedented economic emergency. The measure would also save California an estimated $150 million in enforcement costs.

Rising support for decriminalization has also come from drug war-ravaged Latin America. Former presidents of Colombia, Mexico and Brazil headed the 17-person Latin American Commission on Drugs, which included intellectuals and statesmen. It issued a report last month calling the drug war failed. It called, among other changes, for the personal use of marijuana to be decriminalized.

Currently, marijuana is already decriminalized in some form in 13 U.S. states, including California and New York, according to the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws (NORML). Typically in these states, marijuana possession in small amounts is reduced to a minor offense punishable by a low fine. Alaska has a particularly liberal law, allowing possession of up to an ounce of pot at home without penalty.

Some eight additional state legislatures are currently considering decriminalization, or the expansion of already existing allowances, according to NORML.

No other state has gone as far as the sweeping "tax and regulate" plan Ammiano proposed for California, but all this talk of legalizing pot has Eric Voth, M.D., deeply worried. Voth, chairman of the Institute on Global Drug Policy, believes advocates of legal marijuana are exploiting the country's economic insecurities to advance their agenda, despite evident risks.

Pointing to alcohol and tobacco, which are taxed, he argues the resulting revenue hardly compensates for the social and public health damage wreaked by both substances, including spillover use among youth. In the 1970s, when marijuana use was at its peak, some 11 percent of high school seniors used marijuana daily, whereas today only between two and three percent do so. If marijuana were legal, more kids would smoke it and face health, addiction and learning problems, says Voth, who advised the White House under Republican and Democratic administrations. "I'm not a prohibitionist, I'm a physician and I've seen those problems face-to-face in the trenches."

But, as Voth himself admits, the lobby to decriminalize marijuana is increasingly organized, with a strong presence in state capitols and Washington, D.C. When Ammiano announced his California plan, he enlisted the DPA and the Marijuana Policy Project to back him up. "High Times," the popular pot enthusiasts' magazine, has spearheaded its own "420 campaign" for marijuana legalization. Libertarian organizations, like the Cato Institute, tend to be skeptical of pot prohibition, too.

But there are legal questions over states' efforts to decriminalize. Lenient state laws (not to mention Ammiano's legalization plan) clash with separate federal laws on marijuana, which are strict, calling for up to a year imprisonment and a $1,000 fine for possession of any amount, even if it's a first offense.

Last year, U.S. Rep. Barney Frank (D-Mass.), sponsored legislation to decriminalize marijuana federally, earning a handful of co-sponsors, but the bill quickly stalled in committee.

Ammiano says his plan isn't radical, since pot would simply be taxed just as tobacco and alcohol are now. But for his opponents that comparison sets off alarm bells.

Both industries have a bad record of facing up to the adverse health effects of their products and its availability to underage users. A legally sanctioned marijuana industry, opponents say, would open the door to another powerful, cynical, corporate dispenser of legal drugs.

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Ending the Drug War is a NATIONAL SECURITY ISSUE
Posted by: aahpat on Mar 13, 2009 11:36 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As long as pot and other intoxicant drugs remain illegal the profits from them support international cartels and terrorist organizations.

Rep. Loretta Sanchez of California this week proposed allowing California to run a legalization pilot program. She did so as chair of the Committee on Homeland Security, Subcommittee on Border, Maritime and Global Counterterrorism.

As long as the government prohibits responsible regulation of the distribution of drugs the profits from drugs will help to fund criminal and terrorist anarchy.

The war on drugs is a national security debacle. Pot profits are a major support of the cartels that are in league with terrorist groups around the world. I have written a letter to Rep. Sanchez about the national security atrocity that is the war on drugs. The letter is online here: http://mysite.verizon.net/aahpat/aandc/sanchez.htm

If you agree with the letter then please copy it, co-sign it and FAX it to the Homeland Security Committee and Rep. Sanchez. Both FAX numbers are posted on the letter.

(By FAXING your correspondence to your representatives your missives do not get lost in the blizzard of email they receive. By FAXING them rather than sending hard copy mail your missives get into their office TODAY rather than sitting in a Postal Service security bin for months waiting to be tested for anthrax.)

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Hemp is to marijuana as water is to gin
Posted by: P.E.A.C.E. on Mar 13, 2009 1:48 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Law enforcement's supposed inability to tell the difference between 'marijuana' and "industrial hemp" is all that stands between America and environmental, economic and social recovery.

Prohibition of all strains will end as soon as the true value of industrial hemp is widely appreciated for its critical importance to mitigating climate change and addressing food insecurity & malnutrition. Cannabis is as essential to sustainable human existence on Earth as water is.

Consider the tragic absurdity if an equivalent excuse was used during alcohol prohibition. Water would have been "prohibited" because of law enforcement's inability to differentiate between water & gin.

Both water AND Cannabis are unique and essential natural resources. The availability of both determines either abundance & health, or scarcity & illness. If you don't know the true value of Cannabis, then you cannot possibly decide whether it is legal or not. Our government refuses to acknowledge the true value of the world's most useful, potentially abundant, nutritious agricultural resource, but it doesn't mean that "We the People" have to go along with the erroneous valuation of a corrupt government.

Cannabis hemp seed is the only common seed with three essential fatty acids. Because it is both unique and essential, hemp has never been within the rightful jurisdiction of any court.

Drugs don't make seeds. Herbs do. Every "god" that's ever been worshipped agrees that every one of us has been given "every herb bearing seed...and every green herb" as stated in Genesis 1:29, on the first page of the Bible.

That means essentially that the freedom to farm "every herb bearing seed" is the first test of religious freedom. End of argument. The world's oldest global culture doesn't require permission from a corrupt and dysfunctional bureaucracy to exist.

Cannabis agriculture is the best available proportionate response to global warming and global broiling, by increasing UV-B radiation. If people don't wake up to the fact that Cannabis is the world's most valuable and nutritious agricultural resource, then our species won't see the end of this century.

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Decriminalization vs. Legalization, Pt I
Posted by: atheistcable on Mar 13, 2009 10:04 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article could have been better written. What annoys me most is the casual interchanging of "decriminalize" and "legalize."

Decriminalize, as the article states, is: "a minor offense punishable by a low fine."

I am opposed to decriminalizing drugs. I favor only legalization.

A decriminalized drug cannot be sold in a commercial establishment. It cannot be taxed. It cannot be withheld from people under the age of 18 (or 21, if a state so chooses). If decriminalized, enforcement becomes low-priority, so the drug continues to be sold, untaxed, in residential neighborhoods which breeds turf wars. Disputes cannot be bloodlessly settled in a court of law. Only legalized drugs can.

Unregulated drugs means that the buyer may or may not get what is claimed by the corner dealer. As in the case of heroin, one most likely will not know the strength of the drug--and is more likely to overdose.

In short: Decriminalization is bad policy.

Legalized drugs can be sold in a store, merchants can ask for ID, underage people can be excluded. If underage people are caught with Schedule One drugs, police can find out how they got the drug and go after adults who gave or sold it to them.

As is the case with legal cigarettes and alcohol, drug dealing will not take place in residential neighborhoods.

Then let's take a statement made by Eric Voth, M.D. "Pointing to alcohol and tobacco, which are taxed, he argues the resulting revenue hardly compensates for the social and public health damage wreaked by both substances, including spillover use among youth."

What do we mean by "youth"? If a 21-year-old is "youth" then let's be clear and specific. No jurisdiction is required to sell drugs to people under 21. I don't see why a state could not raise the age limit for Schedule One drugs to 28, for example.
(continued)

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Decriminalization vs. Legalization, Pt II
Posted by: atheistcable on Mar 13, 2009 10:19 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When Dr. Voth expresses opposition to legalization out of concern for health damage, he is assuming that the drug war is working.

No it is not! I live in an area of North Minneapolis that is notorious for drug dealing. I know that the law is utterly irrelevant to those who want to sell, buy and use drugs. I am quite unconvinced that legalization will make any difference on how many people will buy drugs, and if they will be buying more drugs than before. Removing the "Forbidden Fruit Effect" could actually reduce purchase and consumption of Schedule One drugs. As a society, we need to experiment. Legalize everything nationwide for a 5 year period and observe. This is called the Scientific Method.

The other problem with "health damage" concerns is purity of drugs. Legalization will guarantee purity of what is being advertised. Additionally, when we talk about regulation, we could make a law stating that all Schedule One drugs must be sold in a box. Inside the box would be literature--truthful, scientific and without exaggerations--about what the drug will do. On the literature will be URLs directing the consumer to get more information from an official website. This will help to prevent much health damage.

Example: in the 60s when LSD was the rage, I was tempted to experiment. But before I did, I went out of my way to find information that would explain the upside of LSD--and the downside. Well, there was enough downside (psychological ramifications) that I decided not to take LSD or any other hallucinogen. Finding this information was not easy.

Likewise with alcohol. When I learned, in 1968, that excessive drinking could destroy more brain cells in a day than what normally takes place, I stopped drinking alcohol on the spot.

People need scientific information. When they get it, it can do wonders in controlling drug use: from tobacco, alcohol, to all other drugs. All the police do is eat up tax dollars, terrorize and negate our Constitutional rights.

More on "health damage." No one ever mentioned the biggest health hazard to illegal drugs: Turf wars. You know, bullets flying here and there. Maybe if we coated bullets with Vitamin C, they might be healthier. I don't know. But today's bullets kill. Dr. Voth: is this "health damage"?

If we legalized (not decriminalized) all drugs, guns and bullets would suddenly have no place even in economically-depressed areas like I live in. This is another reason why all drugs--not just marijuana--must be legalized. Every year, the majority of the thousands of homicides in this country, are drug-related.

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Many uses for hemp and pot - this aint one of 'em.
Posted by: drugs on Mar 14, 2009 12:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
both the medical pot movement and the "use pot to stimulate the economy" movement are bad for pot and pot users. the reason that pot should be legalized is this:

because pot should be legalized. thats it. no stupid reasons. no stupid excuses. it (cannabis and hemp) should be used as a:

1) recreational drug
2) a recreational drug with medicinal purposes
3) a drug
4) a medicine
5) an herbal remedy
6) an industrial material
7) a way to make paper without the use of sulfer
8) through 5,875,324,536).....
fuck you.

we dont need a reason. just DO IT. are you a correctional officer? border patrol agent? just a workin stiff? just doin your job? 401k? question. question. question. time to put your ass on the line. time to ask yourself: what the fuck am I doing?

goin for that sheriffs job? good. when you see abuse at your local correctional facility, county jail, state prison, municipal lockup, do something. blow that whistle . put your ass on the line. you could get shanked tomorrow. better blow the whistle today and save your soul. wanna get more piss thrown at you? didnt think so. blow the frickin whistle. you have the power. you have it. why is the nonviolent prisoner getting figuratively butt-raped by the convicted murderer? make it stop. you don't deserve this! you are a human being.

Legalize it. Lost souls are missing and want to come home.

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GOOD TIMING FOR A NATIONAL BONE BLAST
Posted by: HANGTRAITORS on Mar 14, 2009 3:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
MAKE US STUPID, CALLOUS AND INDIFFERENT WHILE THEY FORCE FUCK US WITH BANKER OWNED COMMUNISM

LETS GROW INDUSTRIAL HEMP AND DESTROY THESE POISONOUS PETROCHEMICAL NAZI MONOPOLIES

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We, The Stoners
Posted by: Revolutionary (Direct) Democracy on Mar 14, 2009 3:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
FREE AMERICA

PLANT YOUR SEEDS

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Not in our lifetime
Posted by: mizipi on Mar 14, 2009 4:04 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The number one reason reefer will not be legalized is this: Anyone with a bucket of dirt or a garden with sunshine and water can throw some seeds into the dirt, wait a few months and then it is ready to harvest. No way to tax that. I grew-up kind of poor, yet we never lacked for food, because we grew corn, beans, melons, tomatoes, peppers, etc. We did have to prepare the soil and use fertilizers, but our family of six had more than we could eat and gave away a lot of the excess. No where in this world today is reefer legal. It is a form of government control and governments never give-up any power.

On the subject of revenue for the government. If our government gave us freedom, liberty and justice and the right to the pursuit of happiness, then they would not have to waste time trying to control the economy and create jobs. I never remember studying American history and learning that the founders of this nation ever said a word about the economy or jobs.

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» RE: Not in our lifetime Posted by: bloggeddowninMKE
» RE: Not in our lifetime Posted by: Joni50
» RE: Not in our lifetime Posted by: WillieD
» RE: Not true Posted by: stellabloo
» Ummmm.... Posted by: Fencerider
» RE: Why Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: Ummmm.... Posted by: bizeeb
» RE: Ummmm.... Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: Not in our lifetime Posted by: robert.noll

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We are all felons that didn't get caught!
Posted by: Javan on Mar 14, 2009 4:09 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our government is making criminals out of all of us with these stupid laws that we all break!

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I wrote of legalizing marijuana a while back.
Posted by: Mary MacElveen on Mar 14, 2009 4:44 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On February 7th, I wrote of this very subject when it was originally reported that the Stimulus Package would be $780 billion dollars. To read my column, please go to this link: http://tinyurl.com/cpqzs7

Rick Sanchez of CNN had on as his guest this past week, a Harvard economist,Jeffrey Miron who feels the same way.

Best,
Mary MacElveen
http://www.marymacelveen.com

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"Institute on Global Drug Policy" is a front-group
Posted by: DignityForAll on Mar 14, 2009 4:47 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Prohibition advocate, Eric Voth, M.D., is chairman of the Institute on Global Drug Policy, this is not an independent organization, but was founded by the Drug Free America Foundation, as a pseudo-intellectual anti-drug-reform front-group.

The Institute on Global Drug Policy has been criticized in Lancet Infectious Diseases:
----
As stated on the Drug Free America website, “the Institute is charged with creating and strengthening international laws that hold drug users and dealers criminally accountable for their actions”. Rather than supporting the unfiltered consideration of evidence-based policy, the Institute on Global Drug Policy supports “efforts to oppose policies based on the concept of harm reduction”. Of particular note, the Institute on Global Drug Policy's website presents itself in the form of an online open access journal. To our knowledge, this is the first time a lobby group such as the Drug Free America Foundation has created for itself a venue for the dissemination of opinion essays, which to the untrained eye could easily be mistaken for a scientific journal.
----

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How to conduct a poll?
Posted by: DignityForAll on Mar 14, 2009 4:58 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
----
Nadelmann of the DPA believes support would have been higher if the question was whether or not marijuana should be taxed and regulated.
----

This is a really good idea, ask "Do you believe that marijuana should be taxed and regulated?" How much does it cost to conduct a professional poll? How does this work?

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» RE: How to conduct a poll? Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: How to conduct a poll? Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: How about prohibiting hypocrits? Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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Actually, cannabis underwent the first stage towards criminalization during the Great Depression.
Posted by: JenniferBedingfield on Mar 14, 2009 6:21 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When FDR signed into law the overtaxation of cannabis, he pretty much opened the door to Big Oil and Corporate America getting an unfair advantage in the market. If you want to wait until we have another Great Depression just so that cannabis gets legalized, you're pathetic. We need to legalize cannabis NOW !

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Rational Behavior
Posted by: ProgressiveManiac on Mar 14, 2009 6:21 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article seems to be saying that our economic collapse will cause people to act rationally to solve the problem. We can hope so.

I think the history of man does not suggest this, however.

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Gil Kerlikowske; Shill For Drug Gangsters, Cartels & Terrorists
Posted by: aahpat on Mar 14, 2009 7:32 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
President Obama appointed Gil Kerlikowske (transcript) as the latest drug czar, or Director of the Office of National Drug Control Policy. In other words Kerlikowske is the latest shill for the cartels and drug gangs of the world. The ONDCP is the U.S. government's official voice for preserving and protecting the drug gangster business, drug cartels and stateless terrorist armies that all thrive on profits derived from the continued illegality of drugs.

(more) at my blog, Aid & comfort

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» What a load of ..... Posted by: aahpat
» you misspelled your username... Posted by: isnamthere
» Whatever you say, asshat Posted by: isnamthere
» RE: Whatever you say, asshat Posted by: aonghus36
» If asked..... Posted by: aahpat

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Too poor to persecute?
Posted by: rsteeb on Mar 14, 2009 8:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can no longer afford the luxury of turning productive taxpaying citizens into burdensome prisoners over cannabis "offenses". Hallelujah.

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» RE: Too poor to persecute? Posted by: Blacktiger1

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Portugal's drug decriminalization
Posted by: Gabba_Gabba_Hey on Mar 14, 2009 8:05 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Salon has something today on how Portugal decriminalized drugs seven years ago, and has had success:

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2009/03/14/portugal/

There is maybe some irony in this, in that Glenn Greenwald will be talking about it to the libertarian (notoriously libertarian?) Cato Institute.

I'm not a libertarian and I read mostly left/liberal news sites. But I can't recall that anyone in the MSM or on these left/liberal sites, including AlterNet, has ever written about or even mentioned that Portugal decriminalized drugs 7 years ago! Americans all hear about pot in the Netherlands - but how about Portugal? This is news to me and quite a surprise.

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My No. 1 issue with marijauna reporting...
Posted by: YogiBear on Mar 14, 2009 8:31 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If marijuana were legal, more kids would smoke it and face health, addiction and learning problems, says Voth

...are paragraphs like this. Nowhere does it mention that the drug is not addictive. Allowing these hyped statements at face value, unchallenged, just because someone is opposed to it says so, has a lot to do with what kept us in a state of refer madness.

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Good luck collecting taxes on pot.
Posted by: rafaeltoral on Mar 14, 2009 8:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let me start off and say I am all for legalization. I dont really care what rationalization they use. However, its not going to be an easy thing to tax.

Beer is fairly easy taxed. Its alot easier to buy your beer at the store for a few bucks than try and make your own. You dont really save much money making your own.

Tobacco is also easily taxed. Its way easier to buy a pack of smokes than to try and produce your own. Its just too much trouble rather than going to the party store.

Marijuana on the other hand is expensive. The proposal I heard was a 50 dollar tax per ounce of pot sold in California. One would assume that the final price including tax would be at least 150 dollars for said ounce. An ounce might last the average smoker 1-3 months.

Once cost of materials are paid for one could grow a few pounds of pot a year virtually cost free. People arent going to pay 150 dollars an ounce during a financial crisis when they could easily grow their own superior pot for next to nothing. If they got caught they would have to pay the tax, bid deal. Many people grow today with the possibility of a prison sentance.

I have the utmost confidence that the people in power can and will convince themselves of whatever they must to further their agenda.
I have seen this time and time again. Luckily this time the outcome might be good.

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» Wanta trade??? Posted by: fsuthai
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» RE: Wanta trade??? Posted by: fsuthai
» There are many ways to tax it. Posted by: isnamthere
» Why would i purchase a tax stamp? Posted by: rafaeltoral
» RE: Here is another way Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» Dear Sr. Lauren Posted by: isnamthere
» RE: Dear Sr. Lauren Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: Dear Sr. Lauren Posted by: isnamthere
» RE: examples of religious use Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: more examples of religious use Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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36 Years
Posted by: pj1fwb on Mar 14, 2009 9:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I surely hope that I will live long enough to see the day that ANYONE can smoke pot if they want too! I have used off and on for 36 years and have always felt the need to look over my shoulder,like I was a criminal! Please, for the sake of everyone in this country-Legalize IT! The prisions will then have room for the REAL crimials! Too many lived have been ruined by this backwards ruling for too many years!Gateway drug! PLEASE!!! The youth of America would be better off! Maybe they wouldn't all be on anti-depressants! There is a way out of this economy, you have stated the way very well!

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» RE: 36 Years Posted by: Sister_Lauren
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Plants are NOT Narcotics !!!!! Marijuana is a PLANT,duh
Posted by: picket on Mar 14, 2009 10:10 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Comparing Coca leafs with Cannabis: the Prohibitionists call Marijuana a narcotic.

"Let me chew my coca leaves"...New York Times..3/13/09..
Evo Morales is asking the UN Commission on Narcotic Drugs to take away the illegality of chewing coca leaves,[1961,Convention] which people have been dong for thousands of years in South America.
Plants have alkaloids..tobacco-nicotine, coffee-caffeine, coca leaf-cocaine.. BUT.. as Morales states.."To be made into a narcotic, alkaloids must typically be extracted, concentrated and in many cases processed chemically". The paste extracted from a plant MAY be a narcotic .

The Plant Itself Is Not !!! Shout it from the highest mountain !!Maybe your so-called Leaders will hear.

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no...the recession cannot legalize marijuana...
Posted by: Annapurna1 on Mar 14, 2009 10:44 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
and heres why ..

the economy will either recover too quickly and destroy the incentive to legalize marijuana.. or else the economy will recover too slowly and generate a repugnican backlash that will coercively stop the debate...either way..the time window closes before any action can be taken...

there is a remote outside chance that the legalization debate will continue after a quick recovery.. and a much smaller chance that a future fascist govt wont stop the debate.. but neither are worth quibbling over...

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Do it
Posted by: RipVanWil on Mar 14, 2009 11:47 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I been smoking pot for 30+ years and still am sharp as a tack. I am willing to bet that more than half of todays politicians fire up a big fat one on a regular basis!

RT
Privacy Center

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» RE: Do it Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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Legalize pot and get kids off tabacco and alcohol
Posted by: cori on Mar 14, 2009 11:51 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pot doesn't kill you- tabacco does.
Pot doesn't result in thousands of car accidents that kill people. alcohol does.
Pot doesn't cause liver damage like alcohol.
There was a recent report on the CBC that discussed the affects of pot on rats and found that although it caused initial memory loss, very shortly after stimulated the growth of new memory cells. It actually imporved rats memories. It it an effective medicine for pain and also helps people with mood and bi polar disorders without all the horrible side effects that the existing medicactions on the market have. Pot is also a good mild stress reducer and much safer then medications. It has been legalized in the Netherlands and is pretty much legal in Canada and their people aren't all turning into junkies and going crazy. It is time to stop filling our prisons,at a cost of $40,000 per yr per inmate, so that tabacco and liquor lobbyists can get their way. Also, If pot is legalized it will bring in tremendous revenues, be a regulated industry and get rid of drug dealers. Putting poeple in jail for pot while tabacco kills 400 million people around the world is insanity and of course since prisons are now a growth industry, that we pay for, making pot illegal makes these private corporations rich at our expense while destroying lives.

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Why stop there?
Posted by: teel on Mar 14, 2009 11:55 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Make them all legal, cocain, heroin, acid... whatever drugs are out there make them legal.

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» RE: Why stop there? Posted by: bizeeb
» RE: Why stop there? Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: Why stop there? Posted by: teel

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make pot legal and get kids off tobacco and alcohol
Posted by: cori on Mar 14, 2009 11:58 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
LEGALIZE POT AND GET OUR KIDS OFF TOBACCO AND ALCOHOL
Pot doesn't kill you- tobacco does.
Pot doesn't result in thousands of car accidents that kill people, alcohol does.
Pot doesn't cause liver damage like alcohol.
There was a recent report on the CBC that discussed the affects of pot on rats and found that although it caused initial memory loss, very shortly after stimulated the growth of new memory cells. It actually improved rat’s memories. It is an effective medicine for pain and also helps people with mood and bi polar disorders without all the horrible side effects that the existing medications on the market have. Pot is also a good mild stress reducer and much safer then medications. It has been legalized in the Netherlands and is pretty much legal in Canada and their people aren't all turning into junkies and going crazy. It is time to stop filling our prisons, at a cost of $40,000 per yr per inmate, so that tobacco and liquor lobbyists can get their way. Also, If pot is legalized it will bring in tremendous revenues, be a regulated industry and get rid of drug dealers. Putting people in jail for pot while tobacco kills 400 million people around the world is insanity and of course since prisons are now a growth industry, that we pay for, making pot illegal makes these private corporations rich at our expense while destroying lives. And guess what people still buy liquor and tobacco all around the world anyway.

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Tell Obama to legalize Pot
Posted by: cori on Mar 14, 2009 12:00 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
www.whitehouse.gov
call the congress 202-224-3121

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» More important than Obama Posted by: aahpat

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legalise pot will nor stop the maffia
Posted by: richholland on Mar 14, 2009 12:30 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
we have legalised marihuana, but the bussiness is sometimes in criminal hands.

the good times were when the USE of marihuana was allowed (tolerated) and the ten plants for own use were tolerated.

When you get legalisation the trade will be in the hands of corporations and prizes go up.

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» Jusxt plan rong Posted by: aahpat

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It's not that
Posted by: peter g on Mar 14, 2009 1:18 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
complicated.
Maryjane inspires one to laugh at the powers that be instead of being afraid.
This is what they fear most.

peter g

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» RE: It's not that Posted by: isnamthere
» RE: It's not that Posted by: lightwing1
» RE: It's not that Posted by: dadanbetty

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The Easy way to End the Drug War...
Posted by: Nodarse on Mar 14, 2009 1:27 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As I stated in a previous post.

It's simple.

1. Stop worming your way OUT of Jury Duty.
2. Once on a Jury, DON"T vote to convict anyone of a drug offense.

Jury Nullification will end this nonsense once and for all.

If the Incarceration Industry in this country cannot lock up exonerated drug offenders, then the "War on Drugs" is DEAD!

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Legalize Responsible Adult Supervision of Drug Sales
Posted by: aahpat on Mar 14, 2009 3:07 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Under the current drug war policy responsible regulated adult supervision of drug sales is prohibited. Irresponsible addicts and gangsters control the morals and ethics of drug sales to children.

In a legalized regime responsible regulated adult supervision would control most drug sales. Licensed members of the community, reflecting and respecting community values, would actively work to prevent premature involvement by children with drugs.

Drug warriors and drug war supporters just say no.

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the views of a farmer in Nebraska
Posted by: zooeyhall on Mar 14, 2009 3:20 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am an active grain and dairy farmer in Nebraska. I grow corn and soybeans on 640 acres. We have been on our farm for 70 years and my late dad talked more times of how farmers like himself around here grew industrial hemp during World War II. He said it was a very good paying crop, and the crop he raised on only 20 acres in one year enabled him to buy a new tractor. He could never understand why after the war it was suddenly banned. Now the only hemp you see grows as a weed in ditches and waste areas.

I think hemp would be a great crop to bring back, especially for Nebraska. We get the hot dry weather in July and August which these plants absolutely love, and unlike corn does not require irrigation. According to what dad told me, it grows so quickly and vigorously that it outgrows weeds so that no chemical herbicides need to be applied. Also much of the existing farm equipment such as planters and tillage tools are readily adaptable to hemp growing.

Also--I think the government should allow growing of the "drug" type hemp. They could do it very much the way that tobacco farming is done today. Certain farmers have an allotment to grow X amount of acres. Then the government could tax it just like they do tobacco. Then they could make money off of "drug" hemp production, rather then the spending money on incarceration.

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Resistance to the legalization of marijuana
Posted by: willymack on Mar 14, 2009 5:26 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Will come mainly from banks, the same crooks we're rewarding with our tax dollars for their theft of.....the taxpayers. You see, they also launder the illegal drug money and pay crooks in congress to look the other way. As is with so many repressive and seemingly silly laws, the root cause is MONEY, and in the case of marijuana, a lot of it.

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darkmark
Posted by: darkmark on Mar 14, 2009 6:19 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
legalize it. it would be a blow to those that use fear to control the citizens that put them in power. removing one more tool from the monsters in both parties that love to use "be afraid be afraid." and there are so many people in the usoa that are hooked on fear. there's a habit that needs breaking.

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Instead mentioning only pot, why not discuss INDUSTRIAL HEMP.
Posted by: maxpayne on Mar 14, 2009 7:06 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
These articles which talk only about pot and nothing else of Cannabis are seriously retarded. Nobody cares about the culture crap. We the people need economic solutions and it would do better to enlighten the readers more on the industrial side of Cannabis and keep the "pot" crap at bay. Hell, even the conservatives in North Dakota are getting some better brains these days !

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INDUSTRIAL HEMP - New Wave of Economic Future
Posted by: scottportraits on Mar 14, 2009 7:16 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Look into and study out the vast uses and applications for industrial hemp. It is ecologically safer than cotton, corn, and de-forestation.
California would not only make over a billion a year, and save 150 million enforcing 'pot-laws', but industrial hemp would generate jobs, and earn into the trillions.
Legalize industrial hemp, now !!

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» Hemp Production Board in WWII Posted by: zooeyhall

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By the way, my wife and I eat and drink quite a lot of hemp protein and oils and we haven't
Posted by: maxpayne on Mar 14, 2009 7:37 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
had any problems. Hell, we haven't failed a single drug test either.

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Good luck on that one. Obama's got drug czars running the place.
Posted by: Wayne Etheridge on Mar 14, 2009 9:20 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
.

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TIME TO QUIT BEING AFRAID
Posted by: mindtrvlr on Mar 14, 2009 10:45 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I see everybody is in agreement. Legalize. But it seems that the ordinary joe is afraid to speak up in front of the community and really state how he or she really feels for fear of retrobution from neighbors, employers, school officials and so on. Also a lot of people fear speaking out as they may fear being put on watch list by Law Enforcement. These are all lame excuses. Thats why we are in this mess now. We have let the Government and the elite control us for far too long. Speak up now and really be heard by all. Put up posters, write your Congressmen. Vote for candidates that feel the same way. If we just sit back and complain, nothing is going to happen. And, now is the time. It is a big subject on the news right now. Lets make it happen.

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Religion...shmeeligion
Posted by: paulmagillsmith on Mar 15, 2009 3:16 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It says in the outstanding 'great' religious repressive, oppressive, controlling work, Leviticus, that it is almost criminal to handle the skin of a pig. How many football players, from Pop Warner to the NFL, would currently be incarcerated if we relied on that absurd document as a basis for law?

Keep your nose out of my bag of pot & I'll keep my nose out of your outdated business (the church), and your damed lousy book (whichever suspect one you let lead you like a bull with a nose ring)...deal?

Pot use might be illegal now, but it was never immoral.

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» RE: eligion...shmeeligion Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: eligion...shmeeligion Posted by: aonghus36

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Marijuana tax potential: cities & states + sign petition
Posted by: marijuanalobby on Mar 15, 2009 4:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes, We Can America:
See how much our US Cities, States, Country and households could save on taxes if Marijuana were decriminalized, then sign the petition:
MarijuanaLobby.org Change we can engage in...

Yes, We Can America:
A) save what’s left of our forests,
B) ease the suffering of chemotherapy patients, and
C) create desperately needed revenue streams for American communities during their time of greatest need.

MarijuanaLobby.org seeks to enable American Patriots and Policy Makers in their continued efforts to decriminalize responsible Marijuana use in the United States by providing a petition portal specific to the issue of marijuana decriminalization, and by providing additional tools with which to empower citizen activists through education and public discourse.

MarijuanaLobby.org believes passionately, Marijuana use should not be a crime. The MarijuanaLobby.org is the on-line portal for Patriotic Americans interested in repealing Marijuana prohibition laws, both Federal and Local.

MarijuanaLobby.org is redefining the Lobby Influence pieces of democracy, for the people by the people as our founders had originally intended.

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Thoreau
Posted by: kafka, f on Mar 15, 2009 7:23 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why should Madoff be incarcerated and the nationally renowned tax shelter crusader Mike Hamersley, of the California Franchise Tax Board, remain free? Madoff merely engaged in a time tested simple transparent scam and unlike the current Treasury Secretary, Geithner and Mike Hamersley apparently did not cheat on his taxes. Hamersely continues to purvey a scam so diabolical and a scam which has destroyed so many families’ lives that he is allowed to hold a high level job in the Government confiscating earnings from honest citizens who unlike Mike Hamersley did not lie to the Senate or the IRS about taxes. Hamersely told the Senate tax fraud was hiding the true facts from the IRS and engaging in paper transactions. Emails show Hamersley purveyed tax shelters for KPMG which resulted in tens of millions of tax fraud based on Hamersely’s definition of tax fraud to the Senate which hit the trifecta, sham paper losses, lying to the IRS, use of sham foreign companies and back dating (according to Hamersley’s definition of backdating). Why shouldn’t Bernie be free if the government not only allows Hamersely to be free but continue his charade on behalf of the Government?
Why should Bernie Madoff be in the pen while KPMG remains a going concern and not indicted for its part in the greatest ponzi scheme in history which has resulted in a $50 Trillion destruction of world wealth? KPMG audits many of financial institutions which were the purveyors of this ponzi scheme. KPMG received 100s of millions in fees from these institutions to sign off on the fraudulent financials (check out Citi’s level three assets and the 100s of billions of exposure it has to bad debts or Citi’s $32 Trillion of derivative ticking time bombs). Madoff is nothing compared to KPMG and at least apparently Madoff paid his taxes. KPMG engages in massive tax fraud with its fraudulent foreign Bermuda captive sham foreign insurance company, Park, where not only does KPMG cheat on its own taxes but cheats its partners through contrived reinsurance arrangements devised by the good KPMG soldier, Claudia Taft. Why does everyone hate Madoff but not KPMG, Madoff’s crimes are simple and a drop in the bucket compared to the malfeasance purveyed by KPMG.

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» RE: Thoreau Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: Thoreau Posted by: EsquireCA

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Please Write to Congress: Ask Them to Sponsor The Industrial Hemp Farming Act of 2009!
Posted by: superfeduphoosier on Mar 15, 2009 7:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Please Write to Congress:
Ask Them to Sponsor The Industrial Hemp Farming Act of 2009!

Please click here to write to your Congressional representatives and ask them to consider becoming an original cosponsor for the Industrial Hemp Farming Act of 2009.

Check out our March 11, 2009 National Action Alert for more information on the introduction of the bill. Our State Hemp Legislation page has more information on the status of hemp bills on the state level.

Please contribute to the Vote Hemp Farmer Fund!

Vote Hemp depends entirely on contributions from supporters like you to do our work. Your contribution to our Hemp Farmer Licensing and Legal Support Fund will help North Dakota farmers.

Also, check out our News Coverage page, "The Hemp News Update" and "Vote Hemp Report: ND Farmers' Lawsuit Update" for the latest on the on the North Dakota Hemp Farming Controversy.

Vote Hemp is a national, single-issue, non-profit advocacy group founded in 2000 by members of the hemp industry to remove barriers to industrial hemp farming in the U.S. through education, legislation and advocacy. We work to build grassroots support for hemp through voter education, registration and mobilization, as well as defend against any new laws, regulations or policies that would prohibit or restrict hemp trade.


Industrial hemp is the non-psychoactive, low-THC varieties of the Cannabis sativa plant. Hemp has absolutely no use as a recreational drug. Please click here to learn more about the farmers' case in North Dakota.

Also, please check out this Vote Hemp videoThe Market for Hemp Products






For more information please see our FAQ:
How much is the hemp foods market worth in the United States?

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Legal Pot
Posted by: RipVanWil on Mar 15, 2009 2:40 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All I know is that I have been smoking pot for 30+ years and I'll keep on going regardless!

RT
www.privacy.at.tc

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» RE: Legal Pot Posted by: mindtrvlr

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Drug War Economics
Posted by: jaylindberg@hotmail.com on Mar 15, 2009 6:08 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My name is Jay Lindberg and I am the author of a book called Drug War Economics. If you would like a copy of it, just send me an email and I will send you a copy as a PDF attachment, (Its free).

The first edition was released in 2001 and the second edition in May of 2005. One chapter is dedicated to Marijuana prohibition called "Why is hemp/ Marijuana illegal.

Marijuanahemp prohibition has nothing to do with health and safety and everything to do with politics, economics and illegitimate power. The industrial and pharmaceutical competitors to hemp/marijuana are major proponents of marijuana prohibition. They are also the founders of most of the organizations that promote the war on drugs.

Organizations like the PDFA (Partnership for a Drug Free America) were founded by Alcohol, tobacco and Pharmaceutical companies). The major corporate sponsors for DARE are industrial competitors to hemp based products and media beneficiaries of prohibition.

One note - I found research from the Department of Transportation (DOT) stating the impairment to driving under the influence of marijuana does on exceed the effects of a .08 alcohol level. (This research was not easy to find and it is of course never quoted.)

When you combine the value of hemp/marijuana prohibition to certain sectors of corporate America, the power of the Drug War bureaucracy itself, and the prison industry created to enforce it, you realize what has been created is an extremely dangerous form of Police State tyranny.

The point I am making is that Drug War budgets are not sustainable and the war itself is not simply a failed or flawed policy. The drug War is corrupt to the core and marijuana hemp prohibition is simply part of it.

A war based on lies is an unjust war and the foundation of marijuana prohibition lacks even an ounce of truth. (If they could defend marijuana prohibition with the truth they would be doing it.)

This article is proposing that the government can simply no longer afford to fight all aspects of this war on drugs and out of economic necessity, marijuana prohibition may finally end. This solution is a best case scenario.

My concern is that the corruption associated with marijuana prohibition is too entrenched and this country will go bankrupt and balkanize before marijuana prohibition ends. (I guess it will have to go bankrupt before it gets fixed.)

Conclusion: Legalization and Industrialization, without taxation is the best policy. A government with money to burn is a fire waiting to happen.

Bringing hemp on line as an industrial raw material could easily generate over a trillion dollars worth of domestically produced products that compete in the global economy. Those figures come from the value of components of the hemp plant (cellulose, fiber and seed) and their industrial applications. As far as the potheads go, let them grow their own pot and shut down a major component of the Black market.

Jay Lindberg
jaylindberg@hotmail.com

Author Of "DRUG WAR ECONOMICS" send me your email and I will send you a free copy as a PDF attachment. You will not be disappointed.

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Unlike tobacco or alcohol . . .
Posted by: wildswan on Mar 15, 2009 7:01 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
marijuana can easily be produced by anyone with access to water, sunshine, dirt and seeds. Well, tobacco can too but it's really hard to grow and cure. I've tried it. And I know making alcohol - even beer or wine - is no job for an amateur. But I think almost anybody could grow "weed" - maybe it is time for a joint and a return to the garden . . .

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I hear marijuana will make me less of a doofus than I am today.
Posted by: FLYING DOOFUS on Mar 15, 2009 11:15 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But then again I've been drinking too much alcohol and smoking and eating too much chocolates.

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Not Sure the Best Solution
Posted by: Royt6 on Mar 16, 2009 8:01 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think there have been liberals behind closed doors just waiting for this moment. I do not agree its best for America though. I know for a fact that my kids will probably see this as a "pot is ok" sign which it is not.

Rob
Lose Stomach Fat

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THE SOONER THE BETTER...
Posted by: Lick My Clit on Mar 16, 2009 2:12 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For users and non-users alike !

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they keep pot illegal.....
Posted by: eosrk on Mar 16, 2009 6:11 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
but it's ok to get fucked up on alcohol and get cancer from cigarettes...and both are TAXED TAXED TAXED TAXED

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» RE: they keep pot illegal..... Posted by: MobileSucks

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DREAM ON
Posted by: MobileSucks on Mar 17, 2009 9:36 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
nm

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Drug laws don't fund terrorism so much as lead to the social dynamics that cause it
Posted by: TrembleTheDevil on Mar 29, 2009 2:50 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Every campaign of terrorism throughout human history has been an indigenous reaction to social injustice.

For America, just as the Civil Rights movement of the 70's was fading the Drug War began - and an increasingly disproportionate number of blacks have been thrown behind bars ever since.

That's the greatest threat to America's national security, find out more at:

Tremble The Devil

(the last few chapters deal with drug laws)

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Lets say it in Bob Pisani words:
Posted by: cyberlogger on Apr 8, 2009 6:23 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the whole country needs a Bong break. Not everything on a crisis is bad, its slows us down before we spin away.

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Alternet Comments:

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Ending the Drug War is a NATIONAL SECURITY ISSUE
Posted by: aahpat on Mar 13, 2009 11:36 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As long as pot and other intoxicant drugs remain illegal the profits from them support international cartels and terrorist organizations.

Rep. Loretta Sanchez of California this week proposed allowing California to run a legalization pilot program. She did so as chair of the Committee on Homeland Security, Subcommittee on Border, Maritime and Global Counterterrorism.

As long as the government prohibits responsible regulation of the distribution of drugs the profits from drugs will help to fund criminal and terrorist anarchy.

The war on drugs is a national security debacle. Pot profits are a major support of the cartels that are in league with terrorist groups around the world. I have written a letter to Rep. Sanchez about the national security atrocity that is the war on drugs. The letter is online here: http://mysite.verizon.net/aahpat/aandc/sanchez.htm

If you agree with the letter then please copy it, co-sign it and FAX it to the Homeland Security Committee and Rep. Sanchez. Both FAX numbers are posted on the letter.

(By FAXING your correspondence to your representatives your missives do not get lost in the blizzard of email they receive. By FAXING them rather than sending hard copy mail your missives get into their office TODAY rather than sitting in a Postal Service security bin for months waiting to be tested for anthrax.)

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Hemp is to marijuana as water is to gin
Posted by: P.E.A.C.E. on Mar 13, 2009 1:48 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Law enforcement's supposed inability to tell the difference between 'marijuana' and "industrial hemp" is all that stands between America and environmental, economic and social recovery.

Prohibition of all strains will end as soon as the true value of industrial hemp is widely appreciated for its critical importance to mitigating climate change and addressing food insecurity & malnutrition. Cannabis is as essential to sustainable human existence on Earth as water is.

Consider the tragic absurdity if an equivalent excuse was used during alcohol prohibition. Water would have been "prohibited" because of law enforcement's inability to differentiate between water & gin.

Both water AND Cannabis are unique and essential natural resources. The availability of both determines either abundance & health, or scarcity & illness. If you don't know the true value of Cannabis, then you cannot possibly decide whether it is legal or not. Our government refuses to acknowledge the true value of the world's most useful, potentially abundant, nutritious agricultural resource, but it doesn't mean that "We the People" have to go along with the erroneous valuation of a corrupt government.

Cannabis hemp seed is the only common seed with three essential fatty acids. Because it is both unique and essential, hemp has never been within the rightful jurisdiction of any court.

Drugs don't make seeds. Herbs do. Every "god" that's ever been worshipped agrees that every one of us has been given "every herb bearing seed...and every green herb" as stated in Genesis 1:29, on the first page of the Bible.

That means essentially that the freedom to farm "every herb bearing seed" is the first test of religious freedom. End of argument. The world's oldest global culture doesn't require permission from a corrupt and dysfunctional bureaucracy to exist.

Cannabis agriculture is the best available proportionate response to global warming and global broiling, by increasing UV-B radiation. If people don't wake up to the fact that Cannabis is the world's most valuable and nutritious agricultural resource, then our species won't see the end of this century.

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Decriminalization vs. Legalization, Pt I
Posted by: atheistcable on Mar 13, 2009 10:04 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article could have been better written. What annoys me most is the casual interchanging of "decriminalize" and "legalize."

Decriminalize, as the article states, is: "a minor offense punishable by a low fine."

I am opposed to decriminalizing drugs. I favor only legalization.

A decriminalized drug cannot be sold in a commercial establishment. It cannot be taxed. It cannot be withheld from people under the age of 18 (or 21, if a state so chooses). If decriminalized, enforcement becomes low-priority, so the drug continues to be sold, untaxed, in residential neighborhoods which breeds turf wars. Disputes cannot be bloodlessly settled in a court of law. Only legalized drugs can.

Unregulated drugs means that the buyer may or may not get what is claimed by the corner dealer. As in the case of heroin, one most likely will not know the strength of the drug--and is more likely to overdose.

In short: Decriminalization is bad policy.

Legalized drugs can be sold in a store, merchants can ask for ID, underage people can be excluded. If underage people are caught with Schedule One drugs, police can find out how they got the drug and go after adults who gave or sold it to them.

As is the case with legal cigarettes and alcohol, drug dealing will not take place in residential neighborhoods.

Then let's take a statement made by Eric Voth, M.D. "Pointing to alcohol and tobacco, which are taxed, he argues the resulting revenue hardly compensates for the social and public health damage wreaked by both substances, including spillover use among youth."

What do we mean by "youth"? If a 21-year-old is "youth" then let's be clear and specific. No jurisdiction is required to sell drugs to people under 21. I don't see why a state could not raise the age limit for Schedule One drugs to 28, for example.
(continued)

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Decriminalization vs. Legalization, Pt II
Posted by: atheistcable on Mar 13, 2009 10:19 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When Dr. Voth expresses opposition to legalization out of concern for health damage, he is assuming that the drug war is working.

No it is not! I live in an area of North Minneapolis that is notorious for drug dealing. I know that the law is utterly irrelevant to those who want to sell, buy and use drugs. I am quite unconvinced that legalization will make any difference on how many people will buy drugs, and if they will be buying more drugs than before. Removing the "Forbidden Fruit Effect" could actually reduce purchase and consumption of Schedule One drugs. As a society, we need to experiment. Legalize everything nationwide for a 5 year period and observe. This is called the Scientific Method.

The other problem with "health damage" concerns is purity of drugs. Legalization will guarantee purity of what is being advertised. Additionally, when we talk about regulation, we could make a law stating that all Schedule One drugs must be sold in a box. Inside the box would be literature--truthful, scientific and without exaggerations--about what the drug will do. On the literature will be URLs directing the consumer to get more information from an official website. This will help to prevent much health damage.

Example: in the 60s when LSD was the rage, I was tempted to experiment. But before I did, I went out of my way to find information that would explain the upside of LSD--and the downside. Well, there was enough downside (psychological ramifications) that I decided not to take LSD or any other hallucinogen. Finding this information was not easy.

Likewise with alcohol. When I learned, in 1968, that excessive drinking could destroy more brain cells in a day than what normally takes place, I stopped drinking alcohol on the spot.

People need scientific information. When they get it, it can do wonders in controlling drug use: from tobacco, alcohol, to all other drugs. All the police do is eat up tax dollars, terrorize and negate our Constitutional rights.

More on "health damage." No one ever mentioned the biggest health hazard to illegal drugs: Turf wars. You know, bullets flying here and there. Maybe if we coated bullets with Vitamin C, they might be healthier. I don't know. But today's bullets kill. Dr. Voth: is this "health damage"?

If we legalized (not decriminalized) all drugs, guns and bullets would suddenly have no place even in economically-depressed areas like I live in. This is another reason why all drugs--not just marijuana--must be legalized. Every year, the majority of the thousands of homicides in this country, are drug-related.

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Many uses for hemp and pot - this aint one of 'em.
Posted by: drugs on Mar 14, 2009 12:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
both the medical pot movement and the "use pot to stimulate the economy" movement are bad for pot and pot users. the reason that pot should be legalized is this:

because pot should be legalized. thats it. no stupid reasons. no stupid excuses. it (cannabis and hemp) should be used as a:

1) recreational drug
2) a recreational drug with medicinal purposes
3) a drug
4) a medicine
5) an herbal remedy
6) an industrial material
7) a way to make paper without the use of sulfer
8) through 5,875,324,536).....
fuck you.

we dont need a reason. just DO IT. are you a correctional officer? border patrol agent? just a workin stiff? just doin your job? 401k? question. question. question. time to put your ass on the line. time to ask yourself: what the fuck am I doing?

goin for that sheriffs job? good. when you see abuse at your local correctional facility, county jail, state prison, municipal lockup, do something. blow that whistle . put your ass on the line. you could get shanked tomorrow. better blow the whistle today and save your soul. wanna get more piss thrown at you? didnt think so. blow the frickin whistle. you have the power. you have it. why is the nonviolent prisoner getting figuratively butt-raped by the convicted murderer? make it stop. you don't deserve this! you are a human being.

Legalize it. Lost souls are missing and want to come home.

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GOOD TIMING FOR A NATIONAL BONE BLAST
Posted by: HANGTRAITORS on Mar 14, 2009 3:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
MAKE US STUPID, CALLOUS AND INDIFFERENT WHILE THEY FORCE FUCK US WITH BANKER OWNED COMMUNISM

LETS GROW INDUSTRIAL HEMP AND DESTROY THESE POISONOUS PETROCHEMICAL NAZI MONOPOLIES

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We, The Stoners
Posted by: Revolutionary (Direct) Democracy on Mar 14, 2009 3:46 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
FREE AMERICA

PLANT YOUR SEEDS

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Not in our lifetime
Posted by: mizipi on Mar 14, 2009 4:04 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The number one reason reefer will not be legalized is this: Anyone with a bucket of dirt or a garden with sunshine and water can throw some seeds into the dirt, wait a few months and then it is ready to harvest. No way to tax that. I grew-up kind of poor, yet we never lacked for food, because we grew corn, beans, melons, tomatoes, peppers, etc. We did have to prepare the soil and use fertilizers, but our family of six had more than we could eat and gave away a lot of the excess. No where in this world today is reefer legal. It is a form of government control and governments never give-up any power.

On the subject of revenue for the government. If our government gave us freedom, liberty and justice and the right to the pursuit of happiness, then they would not have to waste time trying to control the economy and create jobs. I never remember studying American history and learning that the founders of this nation ever said a word about the economy or jobs.

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» Ummmm.... Posted by: Fencerider
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» RE: Ummmm.... Posted by: bizeeb
» RE: Ummmm.... Posted by: Sister_Lauren
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We are all felons that didn't get caught!
Posted by: Javan on Mar 14, 2009 4:09 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our government is making criminals out of all of us with these stupid laws that we all break!

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I wrote of legalizing marijuana a while back.
Posted by: Mary MacElveen on Mar 14, 2009 4:44 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
On February 7th, I wrote of this very subject when it was originally reported that the Stimulus Package would be $780 billion dollars. To read my column, please go to this link: http://tinyurl.com/cpqzs7

Rick Sanchez of CNN had on as his guest this past week, a Harvard economist,Jeffrey Miron who feels the same way.

Best,
Mary MacElveen
http://www.marymacelveen.com

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"Institute on Global Drug Policy" is a front-group
Posted by: DignityForAll on Mar 14, 2009 4:47 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Prohibition advocate, Eric Voth, M.D., is chairman of the Institute on Global Drug Policy, this is not an independent organization, but was founded by the Drug Free America Foundation, as a pseudo-intellectual anti-drug-reform front-group.

The Institute on Global Drug Policy has been criticized in Lancet Infectious Diseases:
----
As stated on the Drug Free America website, “the Institute is charged with creating and strengthening international laws that hold drug users and dealers criminally accountable for their actions”. Rather than supporting the unfiltered consideration of evidence-based policy, the Institute on Global Drug Policy supports “efforts to oppose policies based on the concept of harm reduction”. Of particular note, the Institute on Global Drug Policy's website presents itself in the form of an online open access journal. To our knowledge, this is the first time a lobby group such as the Drug Free America Foundation has created for itself a venue for the dissemination of opinion essays, which to the untrained eye could easily be mistaken for a scientific journal.
----

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How to conduct a poll?
Posted by: DignityForAll on Mar 14, 2009 4:58 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
----
Nadelmann of the DPA believes support would have been higher if the question was whether or not marijuana should be taxed and regulated.
----

This is a really good idea, ask "Do you believe that marijuana should be taxed and regulated?" How much does it cost to conduct a professional poll? How does this work?

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» RE: How to conduct a poll? Posted by: Sister_Lauren
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Actually, cannabis underwent the first stage towards criminalization during the Great Depression.
Posted by: JenniferBedingfield on Mar 14, 2009 6:21 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When FDR signed into law the overtaxation of cannabis, he pretty much opened the door to Big Oil and Corporate America getting an unfair advantage in the market. If you want to wait until we have another Great Depression just so that cannabis gets legalized, you're pathetic. We need to legalize cannabis NOW !

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Rational Behavior
Posted by: ProgressiveManiac on Mar 14, 2009 6:21 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This article seems to be saying that our economic collapse will cause people to act rationally to solve the problem. We can hope so.

I think the history of man does not suggest this, however.

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Gil Kerlikowske; Shill For Drug Gangsters, Cartels & Terrorists
Posted by: aahpat on Mar 14, 2009 7:32 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
President Obama appointed Gil Kerlikowske (transcript) as the latest drug czar, or Director of the Office of National Drug Control Policy. In other words Kerlikowske is the latest shill for the cartels and drug gangs of the world. The ONDCP is the U.S. government's official voice for preserving and protecting the drug gangster business, drug cartels and stateless terrorist armies that all thrive on profits derived from the continued illegality of drugs.

(more) at my blog, Aid & comfort

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» What a load of ..... Posted by: aahpat
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Too poor to persecute?
Posted by: rsteeb on Mar 14, 2009 8:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
We can no longer afford the luxury of turning productive taxpaying citizens into burdensome prisoners over cannabis "offenses". Hallelujah.

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» RE: Too poor to persecute? Posted by: Blacktiger1

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Portugal's drug decriminalization
Posted by: Gabba_Gabba_Hey on Mar 14, 2009 8:05 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Salon has something today on how Portugal decriminalized drugs seven years ago, and has had success:

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2009/03/14/portugal/

There is maybe some irony in this, in that Glenn Greenwald will be talking about it to the libertarian (notoriously libertarian?) Cato Institute.

I'm not a libertarian and I read mostly left/liberal news sites. But I can't recall that anyone in the MSM or on these left/liberal sites, including AlterNet, has ever written about or even mentioned that Portugal decriminalized drugs 7 years ago! Americans all hear about pot in the Netherlands - but how about Portugal? This is news to me and quite a surprise.

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My No. 1 issue with marijauna reporting...
Posted by: YogiBear on Mar 14, 2009 8:31 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If marijuana were legal, more kids would smoke it and face health, addiction and learning problems, says Voth

...are paragraphs like this. Nowhere does it mention that the drug is not addictive. Allowing these hyped statements at face value, unchallenged, just because someone is opposed to it says so, has a lot to do with what kept us in a state of refer madness.

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Good luck collecting taxes on pot.
Posted by: rafaeltoral on Mar 14, 2009 8:33 AM   
Current rating: 4    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let me start off and say I am all for legalization. I dont really care what rationalization they use. However, its not going to be an easy thing to tax.

Beer is fairly easy taxed. Its alot easier to buy your beer at the store for a few bucks than try and make your own. You dont really save much money making your own.

Tobacco is also easily taxed. Its way easier to buy a pack of smokes than to try and produce your own. Its just too much trouble rather than going to the party store.

Marijuana on the other hand is expensive. The proposal I heard was a 50 dollar tax per ounce of pot sold in California. One would assume that the final price including tax would be at least 150 dollars for said ounce. An ounce might last the average smoker 1-3 months.

Once cost of materials are paid for one could grow a few pounds of pot a year virtually cost free. People arent going to pay 150 dollars an ounce during a financial crisis when they could easily grow their own superior pot for next to nothing. If they got caught they would have to pay the tax, bid deal. Many people grow today with the possibility of a prison sentance.

I have the utmost confidence that the people in power can and will convince themselves of whatever they must to further their agenda.
I have seen this time and time again. Luckily this time the outcome might be good.

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» Why would i purchase a tax stamp? Posted by: rafaeltoral
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» Dear Sr. Lauren Posted by: isnamthere
» RE: Dear Sr. Lauren Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: Dear Sr. Lauren Posted by: isnamthere
» RE: examples of religious use Posted by: Sister_Lauren
» RE: more examples of religious use Posted by: Sister_Lauren

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36 Years
Posted by: pj1fwb on Mar 14, 2009 9:29 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I surely hope that I will live long enough to see the day that ANYONE can smoke pot if they want too! I have used off and on for 36 years and have always felt the need to look over my shoulder,like I was a criminal! Please, for the sake of everyone in this country-Legalize IT! The prisions will then have room for the REAL crimials! Too many lived have been ruined by this backwards ruling for too many years!Gateway drug! PLEASE!!! The youth of America would be better off! Maybe they wouldn't all be on anti-depressants! There is a way out of this economy, you have stated the way very well!

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Plants are NOT Narcotics !!!!! Marijuana is a PLANT,duh
Posted by: picket on Mar 14, 2009 10:10 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Comparing Coca leafs with Cannabis: the Prohibitionists call Marijuana a narcotic.

"Let me chew my coca leaves"...New York Times..3/13/09..
Evo Morales is asking the UN Commission on Narcotic Drugs to take away the illegality of chewing coca leaves,[1961,Convention] which people have been dong for thousands of years in South America.
Plants have alkaloids..tobacco-nicotine, coffee-caffeine, coca leaf-cocaine.. BUT.. as Morales states.."To be made into a narcotic, alkaloids must typically be extracted, concentrated and in many cases processed chemically". The paste extracted from a plant MAY be a narcotic .

The Plant Itself Is Not !!! Shout it from the highest mountain !!Maybe your so-called Leaders will hear.

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no...the recession cannot legalize marijuana...
Posted by: Annapurna1 on Mar 14, 2009 10:44 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
and heres why ..

the economy will either recover too quickly and destroy the incentive to legalize marijuana.. or else the economy will recover too slowly and generate a repugnican backlash that will coercively stop the debate...either way..the time window closes before any action can be taken...

there is a remote outside chance that the legalization debate will continue after a quick recovery.. and a much smaller chance that a future fascist govt wont stop the debate.. but neither are worth quibbling over...

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Do it
Posted by: RipVanWil on Mar 14, 2009 11:47 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I been smoking pot for 30+ years and still am sharp as a tack. I am willing to bet that more than half of todays politicians fire up a big fat one on a regular basis!

RT
Privacy Center

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Legalize pot and get kids off tabacco and alcohol
Posted by: cori on Mar 14, 2009 11:51 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Pot doesn't kill you- tabacco does.
Pot doesn't result in thousands of car accidents that kill people. alcohol does.
Pot doesn't cause liver damage like alcohol.
There was a recent report on the CBC that discussed the affects of pot on rats and found that although it caused initial memory loss, very shortly after stimulated the growth of new memory cells. It actually imporved rats memories. It it an effective medicine for pain and also helps people with mood and bi polar disorders without all the horrible side effects that the existing medicactions on the market have. Pot is also a good mild stress reducer and much safer then medications. It has been legalized in the Netherlands and is pretty much legal in Canada and their people aren't all turning into junkies and going crazy. It is time to stop filling our prisons,at a cost of $40,000 per yr per inmate, so that tabacco and liquor lobbyists can get their way. Also, If pot is legalized it will bring in tremendous revenues, be a regulated industry and get rid of drug dealers. Putting poeple in jail for pot while tabacco kills 400 million people around the world is insanity and of course since prisons are now a growth industry, that we pay for, making pot illegal makes these private corporations rich at our expense while destroying lives.

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Why stop there?
Posted by: teel on Mar 14, 2009 11:55 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Make them all legal, cocain, heroin, acid... whatever drugs are out there make them legal.

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» RE: Why stop there? Posted by: teel

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make pot legal and get kids off tobacco and alcohol
Posted by: cori on Mar 14, 2009 11:58 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
LEGALIZE POT AND GET OUR KIDS OFF TOBACCO AND ALCOHOL
Pot doesn't kill you- tobacco does.
Pot doesn't result in thousands of car accidents that kill people, alcohol does.
Pot doesn't cause liver damage like alcohol.
There was a recent report on the CBC that discussed the affects of pot on rats and found that although it caused initial memory loss, very shortly after stimulated the growth of new memory cells. It actually improved rat’s memories. It is an effective medicine for pain and also helps people with mood and bi polar disorders without all the horrible side effects that the existing medications on the market have. Pot is also a good mild stress reducer and much safer then medications. It has been legalized in the Netherlands and is pretty much legal in Canada and their people aren't all turning into junkies and going crazy. It is time to stop filling our prisons, at a cost of $40,000 per yr per inmate, so that tobacco and liquor lobbyists can get their way. Also, If pot is legalized it will bring in tremendous revenues, be a regulated industry and get rid of drug dealers. Putting people in jail for pot while tobacco kills 400 million people around the world is insanity and of course since prisons are now a growth industry, that we pay for, making pot illegal makes these private corporations rich at our expense while destroying lives. And guess what people still buy liquor and tobacco all around the world anyway.

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Tell Obama to legalize Pot
Posted by: cori on Mar 14, 2009 12:00 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
www.whitehouse.gov
call the congress 202-224-3121

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» More important than Obama Posted by: aahpat

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legalise pot will nor stop the maffia
Posted by: richholland on Mar 14, 2009 12:30 PM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
we have legalised marihuana, but the bussiness is sometimes in criminal hands.

the good times were when the USE of marihuana was allowed (tolerated) and the ten plants for own use were tolerated.

When you get legalisation the trade will be in the hands of corporations and prizes go up.

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» Jusxt plan rong Posted by: aahpat

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It's not that
Posted by: peter g on Mar 14, 2009 1:18 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
complicated.
Maryjane inspires one to laugh at the powers that be instead of being afraid.
This is what they fear most.

peter g

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The Easy way to End the Drug War...
Posted by: Nodarse on Mar 14, 2009 1:27 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As I stated in a previous post.

It's simple.

1. Stop worming your way OUT of Jury Duty.
2. Once on a Jury, DON"T vote to convict anyone of a drug offense.

Jury Nullification will end this nonsense once and for all.

If the Incarceration Industry in this country cannot lock up exonerated drug offenders, then the "War on Drugs" is DEAD!

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Legalize Responsible Adult Supervision of Drug Sales
Posted by: aahpat on Mar 14, 2009 3:07 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Under the current drug war policy responsible regulated adult supervision of drug sales is prohibited. Irresponsible addicts and gangsters control the morals and ethics of drug sales to children.

In a legalized regime responsible regulated adult supervision would control most drug sales. Licensed members of the community, reflecting and respecting community values, would actively work to prevent premature involvement by children with drugs.

Drug warriors and drug war supporters just say no.

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the views of a farmer in Nebraska
Posted by: zooeyhall on Mar 14, 2009 3:20 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I am an active grain and dairy farmer in Nebraska. I grow corn and soybeans on 640 acres. We have been on our farm for 70 years and my late dad talked more times of how farmers like himself around here grew industrial hemp during World War II. He said it was a very good paying crop, and the crop he raised on only 20 acres in one year enabled him to buy a new tractor. He could never understand why after the war it was suddenly banned. Now the only hemp you see grows as a weed in ditches and waste areas.

I think hemp would be a great crop to bring back, especially for Nebraska. We get the hot dry weather in July and August which these plants absolutely love, and unlike corn does not require irrigation. According to what dad told me, it grows so quickly and vigorously that it outgrows weeds so that no chemical herbicides need to be applied. Also much of the existing farm equipment such as planters and tillage tools are readily adaptable to hemp growing.

Also--I think the government should allow growing of the "drug" type hemp. They could do it very much the way that tobacco farming is done today. Certain farmers have an allotment to grow X amount of acres. Then the government could tax it just like they do tobacco. Then they could make money off of "drug" hemp production, rather then the spending money on incarceration.

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Resistance to the legalization of marijuana
Posted by: willymack on Mar 14, 2009 5:26 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Will come mainly from banks, the same crooks we're rewarding with our tax dollars for their theft of.....the taxpayers. You see, they also launder the illegal drug money and pay crooks in congress to look the other way. As is with so many repressive and seemingly silly laws, the root cause is MONEY, and in the case of marijuana, a lot of it.

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darkmark
Posted by: darkmark on Mar 14, 2009 6:19 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
legalize it. it would be a blow to those that use fear to control the citizens that put them in power. removing one more tool from the monsters in both parties that love to use "be afraid be afraid." and there are so many people in the usoa that are hooked on fear. there's a habit that needs breaking.

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Instead mentioning only pot, why not discuss INDUSTRIAL HEMP.
Posted by: maxpayne on Mar 14, 2009 7:06 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
These articles which talk only about pot and nothing else of Cannabis are seriously retarded. Nobody cares about the culture crap. We the people need economic solutions and it would do better to enlighten the readers more on the industrial side of Cannabis and keep the "pot" crap at bay. Hell, even the conservatives in North Dakota are getting some better brains these days !

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INDUSTRIAL HEMP - New Wave of Economic Future
Posted by: scottportraits on Mar 14, 2009 7:16 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Look into and study out the vast uses and applications for industrial hemp. It is ecologically safer than cotton, corn, and de-forestation.
California would not only make over a billion a year, and save 150 million enforcing 'pot-laws', but industrial hemp would generate jobs, and earn into the trillions.
Legalize industrial hemp, now !!

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» Hemp Production Board in WWII Posted by: zooeyhall

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By the way, my wife and I eat and drink quite a lot of hemp protein and oils and we haven't
Posted by: maxpayne on Mar 14, 2009 7:37 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
had any problems. Hell, we haven't failed a single drug test either.

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Good luck on that one. Obama's got drug czars running the place.
Posted by: Wayne Etheridge on Mar 14, 2009 9:20 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
.

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TIME TO QUIT BEING AFRAID
Posted by: mindtrvlr on Mar 14, 2009 10:45 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I see everybody is in agreement. Legalize. But it seems that the ordinary joe is afraid to speak up in front of the community and really state how he or she really feels for fear of retrobution from neighbors, employers, school officials and so on. Also a lot of people fear speaking out as they may fear being put on watch list by Law Enforcement. These are all lame excuses. Thats why we are in this mess now. We have let the Government and the elite control us for far too long. Speak up now and really be heard by all. Put up posters, write your Congressmen. Vote for candidates that feel the same way. If we just sit back and complain, nothing is going to happen. And, now is the time. It is a big subject on the news right now. Lets make it happen.

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Religion...shmeeligion
Posted by: paulmagillsmith on Mar 15, 2009 3:16 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It says in the outstanding 'great' religious repressive, oppressive, controlling work, Leviticus, that it is almost criminal to handle the skin of a pig. How many football players, from Pop Warner to the NFL, would currently be incarcerated if we relied on that absurd document as a basis for law?

Keep your nose out of my bag of pot & I'll keep my nose out of your outdated business (the church), and your damed lousy book (whichever suspect one you let lead you like a bull with a nose ring)...deal?

Pot use might be illegal now, but it was never immoral.

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» RE: eligion...shmeeligion Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: eligion...shmeeligion Posted by: aonghus36

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Marijuana tax potential: cities & states + sign petition
Posted by: marijuanalobby on Mar 15, 2009 4:42 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes, We Can America:
See how much our US Cities, States, Country and households could save on taxes if Marijuana were decriminalized, then sign the petition:
MarijuanaLobby.org Change we can engage in...

Yes, We Can America:
A) save what’s left of our forests,
B) ease the suffering of chemotherapy patients, and
C) create desperately needed revenue streams for American communities during their time of greatest need.

MarijuanaLobby.org seeks to enable American Patriots and Policy Makers in their continued efforts to decriminalize responsible Marijuana use in the United States by providing a petition portal specific to the issue of marijuana decriminalization, and by providing additional tools with which to empower citizen activists through education and public discourse.

MarijuanaLobby.org believes passionately, Marijuana use should not be a crime. The MarijuanaLobby.org is the on-line portal for Patriotic Americans interested in repealing Marijuana prohibition laws, both Federal and Local.

MarijuanaLobby.org is redefining the Lobby Influence pieces of democracy, for the people by the people as our founders had originally intended.

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Thoreau
Posted by: kafka, f on Mar 15, 2009 7:23 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why should Madoff be incarcerated and the nationally renowned tax shelter crusader Mike Hamersley, of the California Franchise Tax Board, remain free? Madoff merely engaged in a time tested simple transparent scam and unlike the current Treasury Secretary, Geithner and Mike Hamersley apparently did not cheat on his taxes. Hamersely continues to purvey a scam so diabolical and a scam which has destroyed so many families’ lives that he is allowed to hold a high level job in the Government confiscating earnings from honest citizens who unlike Mike Hamersley did not lie to the Senate or the IRS about taxes. Hamersely told the Senate tax fraud was hiding the true facts from the IRS and engaging in paper transactions. Emails show Hamersley purveyed tax shelters for KPMG which resulted in tens of millions of tax fraud based on Hamersely’s definition of tax fraud to the Senate which hit the trifecta, sham paper losses, lying to the IRS, use of sham foreign companies and back dating (according to Hamersley’s definition of backdating). Why shouldn’t Bernie be free if the government not only allows Hamersely to be free but continue his charade on behalf of the Government?
Why should Bernie Madoff be in the pen while KPMG remains a going concern and not indicted for its part in the greatest ponzi scheme in history which has resulted in a $50 Trillion destruction of world wealth? KPMG audits many of financial institutions which were the purveyors of this ponzi scheme. KPMG received 100s of millions in fees from these institutions to sign off on the fraudulent financials (check out Citi’s level three assets and the 100s of billions of exposure it has to bad debts or Citi’s $32 Trillion of derivative ticking time bombs). Madoff is nothing compared to KPMG and at least apparently Madoff paid his taxes. KPMG engages in massive tax fraud with its fraudulent foreign Bermuda captive sham foreign insurance company, Park, where not only does KPMG cheat on its own taxes but cheats its partners through contrived reinsurance arrangements devised by the good KPMG soldier, Claudia Taft. Why does everyone hate Madoff but not KPMG, Madoff’s crimes are simple and a drop in the bucket compared to the malfeasance purveyed by KPMG.

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» RE: Thoreau Posted by: aussidawg
» RE: Thoreau Posted by: EsquireCA

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Please Write to Congress: Ask Them to Sponsor The Industrial Hemp Farming Act of 2009!
Posted by: superfeduphoosier on Mar 15, 2009 7:45 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Please Write to Congress:
Ask Them to Sponsor The Industrial Hemp Farming Act of 2009!

Please click here to write to your Congressional representatives and ask them to consider becoming an original cosponsor for the Industrial Hemp Farming Act of 2009.

Check out our March 11, 2009 National Action Alert for more information on the introduction of the bill. Our State Hemp Legislation page has more information on the status of hemp bills on the state level.

Please contribute to the Vote Hemp Farmer Fund!

Vote Hemp depends entirely on contributions from supporters like you to do our work. Your contribution to our Hemp Farmer Licensing and Legal Support Fund will help North Dakota farmers.

Also, check out our News Coverage page, "The Hemp News Update" and "Vote Hemp Report: ND Farmers' Lawsuit Update" for the latest on the on the North Dakota Hemp Farming Controversy.

Vote Hemp is a national, single-issue, non-profit advocacy group founded in 2000 by members of the hemp industry to remove barriers to industrial hemp farming in the U.S. through education, legislation and advocacy. We work to build grassroots support for hemp through voter education, registration and mobilization, as well as defend against any new laws, regulations or policies that would prohibit or restrict hemp trade.


Industrial hemp is the non-psychoactive, low-THC varieties of the Cannabis sativa plant. Hemp has absolutely no use as a recreational drug. Please click here to learn more about the farmers' case in North Dakota.

Also, please check out this Vote Hemp videoThe Market for Hemp Products






For more information please see our FAQ:
How much is the hemp foods market worth in the United States?

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Legal Pot
Posted by: RipVanWil on Mar 15, 2009 2:40 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All I know is that I have been smoking pot for 30+ years and I'll keep on going regardless!

RT
www.privacy.at.tc

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» RE: Legal Pot Posted by: mindtrvlr

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Drug War Economics
Posted by: jaylindberg@hotmail.com on Mar 15, 2009 6:08 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
My name is Jay Lindberg and I am the author of a book called Drug War Economics. If you would like a copy of it, just send me an email and I will send you a copy as a PDF attachment, (Its free).

The first edition was released in 2001 and the second edition in May of 2005. One chapter is dedicated to Marijuana prohibition called "Why is hemp/ Marijuana illegal.

Marijuanahemp prohibition has nothing to do with health and safety and everything to do with politics, economics and illegitimate power. The industrial and pharmaceutical competitors to hemp/marijuana are major proponents of marijuana prohibition. They are also the founders of most of the organizations that promote the war on drugs.

Organizations like the PDFA (Partnership for a Drug Free America) were founded by Alcohol, tobacco and Pharmaceutical companies). The major corporate sponsors for DARE are industrial competitors to hemp based products and media beneficiaries of prohibition.

One note - I found research from the Department of Transportation (DOT) stating the impairment to driving under the influence of marijuana does on exceed the effects of a .08 alcohol level. (This research was not easy to find and it is of course never quoted.)

When you combine the value of hemp/marijuana prohibition to certain sectors of corporate America, the power of the Drug War bureaucracy itself, and the prison industry created to enforce it, you realize what has been created is an extremely dangerous form of Police State tyranny.

The point I am making is that Drug War budgets are not sustainable and the war itself is not simply a failed or flawed policy. The drug War is corrupt to the core and marijuana hemp prohibition is simply part of it.

A war based on lies is an unjust war and the foundation of marijuana prohibition lacks even an ounce of truth. (If they could defend marijuana prohibition with the truth they would be doing it.)

This article is proposing that the government can simply no longer afford to fight all aspects of this war on drugs and out of economic necessity, marijuana prohibition may finally end. This solution is a best case scenario.

My concern is that the corruption associated with marijuana prohibition is too entrenched and this country will go bankrupt and balkanize before marijuana prohibition ends. (I guess it will have to go bankrupt before it gets fixed.)

Conclusion: Legalization and Industrialization, without taxation is the best policy. A government with money to burn is a fire waiting to happen.

Bringing hemp on line as an industrial raw material could easily generate over a trillion dollars worth of domestically produced products that compete in the global economy. Those figures come from the value of components of the hemp plant (cellulose, fiber and seed) and their industrial applications. As far as the potheads go, let them grow their own pot and shut down a major component of the Black market.

Jay Lindberg
jaylindberg@hotmail.com

Author Of "DRUG WAR ECONOMICS" send me your email and I will send you a free copy as a PDF attachment. You will not be disappointed.

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Unlike tobacco or alcohol . . .
Posted by: wildswan on Mar 15, 2009 7:01 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
marijuana can easily be produced by anyone with access to water, sunshine, dirt and seeds. Well, tobacco can too but it's really hard to grow and cure. I've tried it. And I know making alcohol - even beer or wine - is no job for an amateur. But I think almost anybody could grow "weed" - maybe it is time for a joint and a return to the garden . . .

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I hear marijuana will make me less of a doofus than I am today.
Posted by: FLYING DOOFUS on Mar 15, 2009 11:15 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
But then again I've been drinking too much alcohol and smoking and eating too much chocolates.

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Not Sure the Best Solution
Posted by: Royt6 on Mar 16, 2009 8:01 AM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I think there have been liberals behind closed doors just waiting for this moment. I do not agree its best for America though. I know for a fact that my kids will probably see this as a "pot is ok" sign which it is not.

Rob
Lose Stomach Fat

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THE SOONER THE BETTER...
Posted by: Lick My Clit on Mar 16, 2009 2:12 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
For users and non-users alike !

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they keep pot illegal.....
Posted by: eosrk on Mar 16, 2009 6:11 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
but it's ok to get fucked up on alcohol and get cancer from cigarettes...and both are TAXED TAXED TAXED TAXED

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» RE: they keep pot illegal..... Posted by: MobileSucks

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DREAM ON
Posted by: MobileSucks on Mar 17, 2009 9:36 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
nm

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Drug laws don't fund terrorism so much as lead to the social dynamics that cause it
Posted by: TrembleTheDevil on Mar 29, 2009 2:50 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Every campaign of terrorism throughout human history has been an indigenous reaction to social injustice.

For America, just as the Civil Rights movement of the 70's was fading the Drug War began - and an increasingly disproportionate number of blacks have been thrown behind bars ever since.

That's the greatest threat to America's national security, find out more at:

Tremble The Devil

(the last few chapters deal with drug laws)

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Lets say it in Bob Pisani words:
Posted by: cyberlogger on Apr 8, 2009 6:23 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
the whole country needs a Bong break. Not everything on a crisis is bad, its slows us down before we spin away.

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