20 Shocking Facts About US Elections

VerifiedVoting.org

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This is a much stronger article than the one it is linked to.

After hearing what Spoonamore has to say about the electronic voting process, you have to realize that if Obama does not have a plan to deal with who counts the votes, then he must know that he will not win.

We went through this in 2000 and 2004. Will Obama be the kind of patsy that Gore and Kerry were?

I know there is no way McCain could win in a fair election. Why are we still using the electronic machines?

It is becoming more and more apparent that all politicians are playing us for suckers.

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I agree this post is so important that it should get front page coverage. It is refreshing to hear a renowned computer security expert who pulls no punches about past stolen elections. I have been following election integrity issues since 2003 when alarmed Ohio citizens kept Ken Blackwell
from purchasing electronic voting machines that had no paper audit trail. It seemed obvious that anyone who would purchase an unauditable vote counting system was either corrupt or incompetent.

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Paper ballots or colored rocks work better than invisible voting black holes we now have shoved down our throats.

Sushi

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senator dick durbin from Illinois. let's see what happens. or if he even bothers.

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There is NO hope for the next elections!

We have finally been taken over by these parasites and may as well accept it. It is terribly sad that the vast majority of the people of this country either don't know what has happened to them, or are in denial. In any event, we certainly don't live in a democracy anymore.

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Are you telling me the GOP wants to rig elections?

God Almighty, what is this world coming to?

(WWIII if Insane McCain is elected)

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Spoonman leaves no lingering doubts; the Diebold voting machines are designed - optimized - for stealing elections in a multitude of ways. And there will still be a lot of them out there this cycle, and a lot of other intrinsically insecure computers in the mix, and a lot of states choosing to believe that somehow they can be fixed.

It is totally foreseeable that there will be massive fraud in enough key states this November to throw the election to McCain, unless Obama wins by a landslide - which doesn't seem to be in the cards. McCain just needs to be close enough to Obama to make his winning somewhat plausible - which someone called being "in the plausible zone".

Quoting Spoonman: "If we had a variance in the exit polling of even 2% from what actually was tabulated -- which is exactly how the Orange Revolution came about in Ukraine -- ... something is wrong." More than a 2% discrepancy is strong presumptive evidence - Spoonman calls it "proof" - of fraud. Those kinds of discrepancies were very rare in the US before 2000, but now they have become commonplace. In Ukrane, people took to the streets in huge numbers crying foul, and they didn't let up until their Supreme Court threw out the tainted results!

So what are WE going to do when the exit polls show that key states - and the presidency - have been stolen once again? The issue is "out there", and trust in the voting system has been shaken. We, the activists and the people too, know now that we cannot trust the system - lawyers, politicians and judges - to straighten this out. And we know now that we can't trust the Democratic Party or its champion to deal with it. If we want our country back, WE will have to deal with it!

It's all on the line now. We need to be laying the groundwork for a massive protest. We should get the idea out there that any state - or the Diebold machine part of a state - where the exit polls differ from the vote count by more than 2% will be regarded as stolen, and that millions will pour into the streets and won't quit until it's invalidated.

Millions in the streets demanding - what? Recounts? Yes, where possible, but you can't do a recount if electronic voting machines were used! Demanding the results be thrown out and the election rerun with paper ballots? Why not? Unreasonable? You bet! Against the law? Change it, now! It's high time to get unreasonable, and it won't take too much for the people to get there! They've *stolen our country*, and there is nothing reasonable about *that*!!

But how do we organize this, and how do we prepare the people for it? How do we establish that kind of communication with the people? It keeps coming back to that issue. We can expect not a word from any of the corporate media that this movement even exists, until it gets big enough for them to start thundering condemnation at us! And we can expect them to lie about and try to rig the exit polls! One way or another we simply must find a way to break their hold on what the people see and hear.

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If the voting machines themsleves cannot be trusted, imagine them in the hands of crooked Republicans determined to stay in office by any means necessary = another fixed election.

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one way or another, he will wind up the winner, no matter who is taken out in the process...

as to protest??? think the cages that are just awatin' in Denver for the convention with the little wall signs saying we use tasers are for laughs???

we waited too long and now have the prescient of the supremes making final election decisions, not voters...

cynical, yes... stupid, no here...

and yes right now live in ohio, the home of the rigged dibold machines and all...

any ideas around a rigged system out there that is actually workable these days are welcome...

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Why is it that my hometown of Goshen, NY has yet to acquire those new fangled electronic voting machines? We are a relatively small town but we're fairly modern. We're slightly less than sixty miles from New York City. What gives?

Could it be the fact that Goshen is a VERY reliable Republican town? So reliable, in fact, that it voted against its neighbor across the Hudson River, Franklin Roosevelt, all four times he ran for president!

Well, what the hey! That would explain volumes, wouldn't it?

Tom Degan
Goshen, NY
Jerome Corsi is a Liar and a Pervert

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Finally! Bravo to Alternet and Mr. Spoonamore for getting this issue heard, seen, out. In previous election years, few news sources were covering the fact that Diebold machines could not be trusted. This year, everyone who has read this article should take the time to contact your public representatives and demand an end to such a flawed system. The politicians are not concerned with our best interests, only their own. Take back your country, you have the power.

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The results of the 2008 election was accidentally released early. I think this was supposed to be a joke, but these days, it's difficult to be sure:

Diebold Accidentally Leaks

I especially like the part about pretending to count the votes on election night, just like always.

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MI's primary was Stolen by Corporationist (those Spoonamore is referring too)- disguised in both Red & Blue
The effort by so called 'Dems' to invalidate our primary with the 'date change' was their first move. This eliminated any real competition for Clinton- Edwards & Obama played by the Rules,Clinton did not.She claimed it would not count, but felt 'obligated' to include the lopsided votes to her "Popular vote" count.
Then they elicited the help of media to reinforce the idea the primary would not count and that 'Clinton was the only Dem on the Ballot'- effectively limiting which voters would bother to show up to the polls.
Then they intentionally scrambled the names listed on the Dem ballot- instead of alphabetical order like the republican ballot- My ballot read 'Kucincih,Clitnon,Dodd,Gravel, Uncommitted'...Was my vote for Kucinich read as a vote for Hillary by the Diebold Preprogrammed SCAMtron?
Why did the Sec of State Land (R)make the tax payers pay for 'short run' ballots (the more variations to a ballot, the smaller their runs, the smaller their runs the higher the cost).
And why did she have US pay for the necessary preprogramming of these scamtrons to correctly read each disricts unique ballot configuration? Or did She?
What benefit would a Republican get for throwing a Dem Primary...Well first perhaps it's she is a female and felt an allegeince to help her, or Her Boss the Governor pushed her to do so,Or a Buddy of Clintons in the senate who also sits on the Armed services, Or perhaps- like Limbaugh et al was helping Clinton would win the nomination and the Neo cons would have a better chance of solidary against having another Clinton in the WH- since Mac can't seem to inspire the base.Or more likely- considering Hillary's unabashed pandering to the Neocons during her campaign..she is a Cohort of CheneyCorp, just like Mac.Either of them in the WH guarantees the Corps a continued Run on Power & Influence over US.
If Michigan turns 'Red'- Arrests for Election Fraud should begin immediately.

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You can never make electronic voting work. It isn't like Electronic banking where every transaction is tied to a real account, and a real person or business. This lets auditors trace and verify transactions if needed. Voting, on the other hand, has to be anonymous. This means that if any voting machine or the central server is compromised, you might never even know there is a problem.

If you need to use electronic voting, you need a paper trail. When you vote, the machine registers your vote, and prints you a ballot, which you drop into the election box. The only way to do it.

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I have been designing computers from before the first microprocessor came out (something called the 4004) in late 1960's early 1970's and I tell you this guy is right! There is is no such think as a failsafe system that will prevent voter fraud.

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That's why I'm asking folks to take a note pad with then write my name Jeffrey Smith ( Jeffrey7) on it and hand it to the workers at the table and then you'll know just how strong your vote really is. They have to count it,record it,and make it public.
But it's the Electoral College we need to abolish,which is our right,and make true popular vote the way to go.
Write -in Jeffrey7 for Prez '08

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This is so dangerous it boggles the imagination. If this goes on long enough and there is a spark, an incident, to set it off Washington will burn. Literally.

I have said for a long time that this is the most dangerous issue of our time. If we cannot verify that the votes are counted correctly then it is a direct threat to our country and form of government.

Mass trials and executions will be the only way to go at that point. Let's see numbnut Rove decide he doesn't want to show up for his firing squad with that arrogant attitude of his. We can line him up next to Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and any other ambitious politico with delusions of grandeur and disrespect for our laws.

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Any sane, thinking person has to know these machines are rigged with no accountability. I would suggest that everyone register for an absentee ballot and vote that - it leaves a paper trail. I think most (?) states allow you to vote absentee even if you aren't. Living abroad it is a necessity - living in the United States as it now is - it's also a necessity if we are to have any hope of saving our democracy, our nation and our values.

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In our household we decided that to get our vote counted, we would go with absentee ballots. I tell everyone I can, to go down and register for an absentee ballot, they are counted by hand. As long as electronic voting can be rigged, we will continue our 'tradition' of absentee ballots. It takes some time but it's worth it knowing our votes are counted.

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... that this might just be a single component - a sub-plot! - of 'The Plot Against Liberal America' - see Alternet, Aug 18 - but is broadened to include the older, traditional idea of 'liberalism' as accepted by the founders. In reality, more accurately, of course this amounts to a plot against democracy and one more move toward fascism.

It seems that I read something by Greg Palast wherein he stated that lots of the paper ballots that officials had to deal with were just blatantly 'tossed' including absentee ballots. As I recall that was about the military's absentee ballots?? Anyone have the info on this? Is it reality?

On the face absentee ballots seem like a great idea with implications that could be powerful leverage if enough of us used them or even threatened to overwhelm whole precincts with them. The first 'threat' of course, would be that precincts would be unlikely to be prepared to handle a whole lot of hand counting. The secondary 'threat' level would be the revelation that exit polls still match hand counts, areas where lots of paper ballots are used would reflect same and enough paper (absentee) ballots would be a step toward revealing the subterfuge to Joe Six Pack - who hopefully might then care enough to get off the couch and make a noise about democracy.

Probably convert lots of Independents, 'Reagan' Democrats and honest and objective Republicans too!

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Some of my proposals as posted on OpEdNews.

I outline some steps to try to make elections safe and accurate.

Click for more...

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At what point do we arm ourselves against these infiltrators? When they come for your neighbor? ... for you?
Inkling

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This sort of thing was known about at least in 2004 and nothing was done about it. One wonders why. Isn't it a bit late now?

And who says a paper trail is so secure? If paper votes are counted by a machine, how many of us have ever seen the inside of such a machine, especially when it's operating? How do we know that the machine isn't reading the ballots and sometimes substituting one that it likes better from another pile? If ballots are counted by eye, who selected the counters and the watchers?

It seems like if one legal voter can prove that they were illegally denied the right to vote, or their vote was corrupted, then the election is proven invalid.

I see possibilities for an electronic system where where votes could be cast before election day (as with Oregon's mail-in ballots, and absentee ballots), counted before the final count and each voter who desired could check, perhaps on the Internet, how only their own vote was recorded. They could see others' votes from their own precincts, but only associated with codenames. They could also see the recorded totals and totals of totals, and add up the votes for themselves to check the final outcome.

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Anyone that has worked on a computer, or been in a store where the computer has "a glitch" should have this figured out by now. No matter how much double talk that these people continue to spew forth, we need to move away from these systems. They can be compromised too quickly!

That Spoon is finally willing to admit it, also shows that he has already been paid to point that it no longer matters to him - so he can speak the truth!

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