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I thought it was time we moved past the now unhelpful, "How did we get into this mess?" However, I cannot let this astounding Downing Street memo go unmentioned.

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They Lied to Us

By Molly Ivins, AlterNet. Posted May 10, 2005.


I thought it was time we moved past the now unhelpful, "How did we get into this mess?" However, I cannot let this astounding Downing Street memo go unmentioned.
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Meanwhile, back in Iraq. I was going to leave out of this column everything about how we got into Iraq, or whether it was wise, and or whether the infamous "they" knowingly lied to us. (Although I did plan to point out I would be nobly refraining from poking at that pus-riddled question.)

Since I believe one of our greatest strengths as Americans is shrewd practicality, I thought it was time we moved past the now unhelpful, "How did we get into his mess?" to the more utilitarian, "What the hell do we do now?"

However, I cannot let this astounding Downing Street memo go unmentioned.

On May 1, the Sunday Times of London printed a secret memo that went to the defense secretary, foreign secretary, attorney general and other high officials. It is the minutes of their meeting on Iraq with Tony Blair. The memo was written by Matthew Rycroft, a Downing Street foreign policy aide. It has been confirmed as legitimate and is dated July 23, 2002. I suppose the correct cliché is "smoking gun."

"C reported on his recent talks in Washington. There was a perceptible shift in attitude. Military action was now seen as inevitable. Bush wanted to remove Saddam, through military action, justified by the conjunction of terrorism and WMD. But the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy. (There it is.) The NSC (National Security Council) had no patience with the U.N. route, and no enthusiasm for publishing material on the Iraqi regime's record. There was little discussion in Washington of the aftermath after military action."

After some paragraphs on tactical considerations, Rycroft reports, "No decisions had been taken, but he (British defense secretary) thought the most likely timing in U.S. minds for military action to begin was January, with the timeline beginning 30 days before the U.S. congressional elections.

"The foreign secretary said he would discuss this with Colin Powell this week. It seemed clear that Bush had made up his mind to take military action, even if the timing was not yet decided. But the case was thin. Saddam was not threatening his neighbors, and his WMD capability was less than that of Libya, North Korea or Iran. We should work up a plan for an ultimatum to Saddam to allow back in the U.N. weapons inspectors. This would also help with the legal justification for the use of force.

"The attorney general said that the desire for regime change was not a legal base for military action. There were three possible legal bases: self-defense, humanitarian intervention or UNSC authorization. The first and second could not be the base in this case."

There is much more in the memo, which can be found easily online. What's difficult now is placing the memo in the timeframe. Can you remember how little you knew about a war with Iraq in July 2002? Most of us who opposed the war concluded some time ago this was the way it went down. There was plenty of evidence, though nothing this direct and cold. Think of the difference it would have made if we had known all this three years ago. Now? The memo was a huge story in Britain, but is almost unreported here.

The memo does get us some forwarder. At least it finally settles this ridiculous debate about how Dear Leader Bush just wanted to bring democracy all along and we did it all for George Washington.

Enough said. What to do? Now that we're there, at least we're on the right side, not even withstanding the disgusting Ahmed Chalabi as oil minister. Unfortunately, our very support for the good guys is making it much harder for them. A tactical catch-22. I was impressed by the premise of Reza Aslan's new book, "No God but God," which is that all of Islam is undergoing a struggle between the modernists and the traditionalists, between reformers and reactionaries.

But in Iraq, which already had a secular state, we have the additional complication of sectarian/ethnic divisions -- your Sunnis, your Shiites, your Kurds -- not to mention, the tribalism within those divisions. (Am I bitter enough to point out once again that Paul Wolfowitz said under oath, "There is no history of ethnic strife in Iraq"? You bet your ass I am.)

Our most basic problem in-country is that having the U.S. of A. on your side automatically makes you about as popular as a socialist in the Texas Legislature: We are working against the guys we want to win by supporting them. This requires some serious skulling but is not, in politics, all that unusual a pickle.

There is a political solution. Like all politics, it requires a deal. What about letting the interim government make a deal with the Sunnis for us to withdraw -- as in, "You cooperate with us, and we'll get the Americans out of here for you." We can't make that deal, but the Iraqis can.

Digg!

Molly Ivins is a best-selling author and columnist who writes about politics, Texas and other bizarre happenings.

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ScottP
Posted by: ScottP on May 10, 2005 11:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As always I like Molly's column! But there is one flaw at the conclusion. Any US supported government in Iraq has no credibility, and is considered to be untrustworthy. Besides that the US is in the position of being a scapegoat for everything that has gone wrong since we invaded. Therefore no deal can be made. As in Vietnam, we have to simply leave and let others sort it out. Arguments that we need to stay to fix things are specious, like thinking my cat can fix the vase she knocked off the table. Thinking that we can withdraw in some elegant manner and leave the current government to take over and establish a thriving democracy is equally specious. Every day we stay we make the solution uglier and more distant.

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» RE: A teensy correction Posted by: Meta4Life
» RE: ScottP Posted by: Sandy47
CrissCross
Posted by: CrissCross on May 11, 2005 3:37 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't think a withdrawal can be done elegantly, either, but then, I don't believe B*$h and co really want our troops to withdraw. They need a continual American military presence to ensure their dominence and control over those oil fields. After all, that IS the real reason why U.S troops were sent there, and that's why that huge, expensive embassy and all those permanent bases are being built. Maintaining a military presence serves their purpose, should the Iraqis get any ideas that their oil belongs to them, and wish to sell it elsewhere.

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» RE: CrissCross Posted by: nakis
impeach george, at least
Posted by: allen on May 11, 2005 3:41 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
ivans is one of the few columnists left in american media that does not get all her exercise genuflecting to george, licking his boots and kissing his behind. however, she should take the implications of the memo a bit further. clinton was impeached for having sex with an intern. bush is killing our children. impeachment? maybe. seems to me when saddam is brought to trial bush and all his senior advisors should stand in the dock with him. at the very least all his senior advisors should go to jail. they all lied to congress which is a federal crime even if one is not under oath. george bush should pay for his crimes.

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W should be sent to jail!
Posted by: apodapa on May 11, 2005 5:06 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
George W, Bush is, has been, and always will be, a rich little snot. He has been getting away with being such all of his life. Do you think that any other human being in this country, who had a D.U.I was aimless drunk and a cocaine addict, participated in highly inappropriate business dealing, then joined a cult, could ever reach the office of the Presidency without the help of his former Yalie CIA President father and the establishment power elite?
Thank goodness, not God, that Molly Ivans is from Texas and knows all too well what she writes is all true.

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zoza
Posted by: zoza on May 11, 2005 6:18 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
All arrogance falls. McCarthy, Nixon and his gang, Newt and hopefully Delay very soon. However, all of these were brought down by the media. In the case of little George and his gang of knuckleheads, the main stream media is nowhere to be found. That is turning out to be the real crime in this ongoing incredible "story of the century".

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» RE: zoza Posted by: raffers
Election 2008
Posted by: antishrub on May 11, 2005 6:27 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Molly Ivans for President!

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» RE: lection 2008 Posted by: Kym525
» RE: lection 2008 Posted by: Mary Eman
» RE: lection 2008 Posted by: Samantha Vimes
If a free media leads,impeachment and regime change will follow....
Posted by: Cindy on May 11, 2005 7:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Thank you once again Molly Ivans! Your columns should be front page on every newspaper in this country!
I agree with the comments that these are impeachable offenses. I also agree that unless the media: print and broadcast begin the steady drumbeat of reporting on these crimes against humanity and sanity, this administration and their backers will once again escape the consequences for their actions. The Congress will only act if the people demand it. People will only be inspired to demand action if the sources of their news make these actions the story. Period!

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nana82731
Posted by: nanapantyhead on May 11, 2005 8:03 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Re: impeachment
Dubya is certainly a rich little snot, but also a sick (as in mentally deranged) one...now if this doesn't frost one's behind, don't know what does...our country is being run by an
asylum full of unconscious, comatose, monsters... impeach? dang right - the whole cotton picking bunch of hypocrites...but, who out there will stand up FIRST and shout it loud and clear for the whole world to hear and assist in slam dunking the whole administration. Ya'll keep up the good writing though, maybe someone powerful will pretty soon get the message that BUSH and Co. SHOULD BE DULY PROCESSED..... God help us all,

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MTguy
Posted by: MTguy on May 11, 2005 8:08 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
So we're not outraged by the contents of this memo: Bush had his mind made up before the facts were in. When they did come in, they were too thin to base any substantive action upon.

He took us to war anyway.

Is it the 2008 election yet? I don't impeachment is a possibility with the way the Republicans in DC are thinking lately...

Her comparison between what Clinton did and what happened to him and what Bush did and what is NOT happening to him is pretty stark and a real statement on the Republican Party as a whole. I've voted for Republicans in the past, but I fear those days are over for me...forever.

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» RE: MTguy Posted by: jang
This is not the first smoking gun...
Posted by: peaceful_moi on May 11, 2005 8:23 AM   
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The secret British memo confirms previous news. According to Paul O'Neill, Bush's first Treasury secretary (and one of his only truth tellers), the Bush Administration decided to attack Iraq at the National Security Council meeting of February 1, 2001, just after they took office. The meeting concluded with Bush saying, "Fine, go find me a way to do this." (Ron Suskind, "The Price of Loyalty," 2004, page 86.)

On September 11th, they found the way...

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» RE: This is not the first smoking gun... Posted by: Iamnotafruittree
I am curious
Posted by: manustrium on May 11, 2005 8:31 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Is something like what when down here illegal? I am abhorred by it of course, and it seems like it should be. Is there anything in our country's federal documents to prevent this type of thing or hold people accountable when it occures? or is it within the bounds of operation leaving the public to hold those accountable through election? i mean, would an impeachment be possible even under ideal circumstances? were there any oaths broken or anything? I am trully only curiouse (and a little ignorant) and i hope i don't get flamed for asking.

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» RE: I am curious Posted by: nakis
» RE: I am curious Posted by: manustrium
» RE: I am curious Posted by: mungojelly
» RE: I am curious Posted by: manustrium
What to Do? May I suggest. . .
Posted by: monkeywrench on May 11, 2005 9:32 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Enough said. What to do?" Well, Molly, enough has NOT been said, at least by the American media: after dutifully reporting the existance of this memo, the story, predictably, was pushed overboard, to be superceeded, once again, by smarmy stories like the endless saga surrounding a certain skinny rock singer. Referring to our "mainstream" media, a friend of mine once said: "People will eat s**t, if it's the only thing on the menu."

As for what to do? That's simple: impeach President Bush, and remove from office everyone responsible for the travesty of Iraq. After all, unlike Clinton, who only lied about a little nooky in the oval office, Bush lied to Congress, the U.N., the American people, and the world about Iraq, stirred up a hornet's nest of Muslum anger, created a new terrorist recruitment center and training ground, and got thousands of American troops and Iraqi civilians killed in the process. If all of that isn't grounds for impeachment, what is??!!

It is up to the American people to tear themselves away from "Survivor," "American Idol," "Oprah," and all of the other media-generated distractions, demand REAL news, learn the truth about their hijacked government, and yell by the millions at their legislators that they're "as mad as hell, and won't take it anymore!" God knows, the chickenhawks in Congress won't do a damn thing unless their cushy careers are in jeopardy. "We, the People" have the power to put Congress' collective feet to the fire, and remove them from office if necessary – IF we EVER wake up!

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Shaping Intelligence
Posted by: Word Lackey on May 11, 2005 10:04 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I found it interesting that the memo also said, "the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy."

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How do you define lies?
Posted by: Kajamian on May 11, 2005 1:15 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I like the one about looking to see if his lips moved.

However, there are a lot of apologists who maintain that "the administration was depending on bad information" therefore they told us what they thought was the truth. So they aren't responsible. Now we know there isn't even a "pass" for the first round of lies. Repeating the same rhetoric you KNOW is wrong, over and over, louder and louder, can't be anything else.

That they were not under oath at the time is also bogus. The oath had to do with "I, ___, do solemnly swear... protect and defend the Constitution of the United States... so help me God!" I believe every one of these folks had their hand on the Holy Book when they said it.

Realistically speaking, we need an honest media going after their hides (protect and defend PBS and NPR). Or as with Tom DeLay, we'll have to wait until the pain gets a bit higher. We need to have more of the moderate and intelligent Republicans on our side first. The worst case would be having Mr. Bush stand in the docket and be found "unimpeachable". Then we would look like fools before the world!

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» RE: How do you define lies? Posted by: rkewen
What to do?
Posted by: Meta4Life on May 11, 2005 1:41 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It seems obvious to me (and to some others here, I see) that impeachment proceedings are not out of line here. If the Republicans can impeach Clinton for lying about the infamous blow job, then the American people can certainly insist B43 and his lackeys answer for lying under oath to congress, and thereby sentencing many tens of thousands to death in Iraq.

Lies, Damned Lies, and the British Leak

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The Merchant Murder Class of 2005
Posted by: pjrsullivan on May 11, 2005 3:03 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
America today is in a position of many other previous Anglo-Zionist Crown Colonies. We provide the cattle, corn and cannon fodder for their criminal profits.

A defining vote was taken yesterday in the house, to put $82 dollars into this continuing criminal escapade. With full knowledge of the gross criminality that this is all about, many Democrats voted to continue this inhumane criminal enterprise.

The son of the great civil rights leader, Reverend Jackson, who is in the house of representatives, voted yes to fund this continuing infamy.

We need to bring this critical vote up at the next election. Or as in the words of the appointee of the Supreme Felons, "Your either with us, or against us."

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A view from abroad...
Posted by: Johannes on May 11, 2005 3:50 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hello folks, here is one point of view from Europe. The Europeans are no saints in international politics and therefore are not in a position to judge anyone. However, what really astonishes me is the silence of the American media about the Intelligence Memo and the Edison / Mitofsky election report and election irregularities in general. I find this very, very scary. Is it really so that the American media is so biased now that it keeps silent on these matters? Also, the silence of John Kerry and other Democrats is surprising. Do they think that all the discussion is based on some baseless conspiracy theory? How long does it take until we have the same situation in Europe? Wait - we already have: Italy. There, the prime minister Silvio Berlusconi practically owns the media - and has been able to control it to a scary degree. He has literally changed laws in order to keep himself out of jail - and I'm not kidding. But now, finally, he seems to be in trouble. How long GWB can survive, is an interesting question. Until the end of his term? Really, if Clinton got impeached because of his cigar logistics, surely starting a baseless war would fling a president out of the office in no time at all?

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» RE: A view from abroad... Posted by: Zarquan
» RE: A view from abroad... Posted by: kdeldisco
» RE: A view from abroad... Posted by: ljsullivan1166@earthlink.net
tatateeta
Posted by: tatateeta on May 11, 2005 8:00 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I don't think Bush can be impeached because the republicans run our world and they will vote against impeaching him. And the press,I weep for what passes for the press today. (and speaking of the press, why hasn't that douchebag, Novak, been indicted for treason?) They have not been doing their job for a long, long time.

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PJH
Posted by: PJH on May 11, 2005 9:06 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I LOVE Molly. She says "all of Islam is undergoing a struggle between the modernists and the traditionalists, between reformers and reactionaries". You know, that sounds just like what is happening in this country. Must be contagious. I also agree with other writers: the US military is not going to make the investment in pride and blood, build new military bases, and walk away. If the brass were forced to do that, shades of 'Nam, there would be a rash of suicides, or worse. There was never any thought about leaving Iraq, that's why there was never a plan to deal with the aftermath of the invasion. More damned lies.

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humblecitizen
Posted by: humblecitizen on May 11, 2005 9:07 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
11-May-2005
What is happening to us??
Have we lost our dignity??

With all the DOCUMENTED crimes committed by Bush and his cronies, we should be able to, AT LEAST, impeach them.

WE ALL NEED TO CALL OUR US REPRESNTATIVES, WHATEVER THEIR POLITICAL AFILIATION, AND DEMAND THE ENTIRE BUSH CABINET IMPEACHED.

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» RE: humblecitizen Posted by: lothlorien
Pachamama
Posted by: pachamama on May 12, 2005 6:12 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Oh dear. Molly started out well enough but then she hit the wall: "Enough said. What to do? Now that we're there, at least we're on the right side..."
Do we really believe this? Because if we do, we are accepting the fundamental premise of the US government, that it does not matter how we got there, since we are now fighting the good fight and supporting the good guys. Ivins open support of the puppet government of Iraq IS supporting the US. THEM is US! The U.S. installed the government, such as it is, precisely to defend U.S: interests: oil control and political domination of the region. If the US were to withdraw, these guys would be hanging on the back of US humvees. They would not last a minute without US military support and they are NOT good guys. Until we understand this, and demand a complete and immediate withdrawal of US troops, we are capitulating to the Bush rationale for all past, present and future atrocities in Iraq.

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llaznyc
Posted by: LLaznyc on May 12, 2005 12:44 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I've listed E-mail addresses to all US senators. Lets start telling them exactly how we feel.

http://www.senate.gov

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Dearlove, Strangelove what's the diff
Posted by: Dave Schneider on May 13, 2005 9:53 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From Dearlove to Strangelove and Bush and his merry band of international prankster profiteering war-makers you gotta love this group! From grandpappy Prescott doing business with the Nazis down to present times, the bottom line is the bottom line, except, of course, for all the people doing the dying ... .
P.S. Say did Saddam attack us on 9/11 or was it someone else?
Dave Schneider - San Francisco

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Fool Molly twice...fool her again and again and again and ...
Posted by: Meremark on May 16, 2005 4:16 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
"Enough said" ?!?! Hell no, t'ain't nuff said. When every Gold Star family has heard every Bush-supporter reporter say 'I am sorry you grieve. I am responsible for your loved one,' then, maybe we can tally up to see if anywhere near enough's said.
Voices shout 'Media Reform.' Forget reform. Would you have a daughter marry O.J., he's 'reformed,' you know? If the banker embezzles deposits, but 'reforms,' would you deposit more money? No. So NOT 'media reform.' REPLACE Media misbegottens! NO MORE MONEY props to a Status Quo. CANCEL subscriptions. BOYCOTT Cable TV.
Then what? Then this: You'll find other news and entertainment sources. Because they're there. You'll find them. You have to ACT, get at it and do it, and not sit lazy until media'they' do your part for you.
Same with Congress. Voices shout "Call Congress. Write Congress." It is not like Congress don't know. It is like they bet their tick position burrowed into the power shorthairs that YOU will ONLY TALK, and NOT WALK yourself to enlist, and aim your life to dump them.
Lastly, Molly, my dear Molly. You 'weren't going to go back to how we got here, but ... there was this smoking gun memo and all.' Were you "bitter enough to point out Wolfowitz (lied)? You bet your ass"! Sorry, Molly, 'bitter' don't cut it when YOU CAN CHANGE THE WORLD.
"At least we're on the right side." No, Molly, we are not. Please think. You were lied to. But do you go back and correct yourself? Without a smoking memo or confession? I wouldn't put MY ass on it that you'd do that.
"Islamic fanatics conducted 9/11." No, Molly, they did not. You were lied to. But do you go back and issue a correction, and invalidate (repeal) every act and measure falsely done on a false 9/11 basis? Again: For my ass, (really, everyone's ass) being bet? I love you, Molly, but ...
A small test wager: Would you click here and read this? It says Bushgoons served us 9/11, not Islamists. As broadcast on C-Span2(BookTV) a fortnight ago, so it's not from some murky paranoid corner of the internet.
Molly, one lie means a web of lies around the same spider, and you get tangled tighter trying to tell them apart. CUT the TIES. Save OUR LIVES. NOT this CONGRESS, NOT this MEDIA. ACT like it's the world's ass on the line -- it is.

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Buggywhips and the White House
Posted by: osisbs on May 17, 2005 9:28 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Can you imagine where this country would be if the CEO of Buggywhip Intl. had been president of the USA back in 1880? The automobile would never have seen the light of day. Germany just build a train from Shanghai to the Shanghai airport that goes 550 kph (340 mph) and we're shutting down our high-speed Amtrak. We're so far behind that the race is, essentially, over.

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