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How FOX Won and Obama, Clinton, and Democrats Lost

Posted by Brave New Films, Brave New Films at 9:00 AM on May 3, 2008.


Breaking down Clinton's O'Reilly appearance

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DJK writes:

No Republican would go to speak at a MoveOn event. John McCain won’t be going to YearlyKos or the Take Back America conference, and you won’t be hearing him on Air America or see him talking to Keith Olbermann. So why are Democrats told and why do they continue to believe they should go on FOX?

Chris Bowers wrote a great piece for OpenLeft that explains why it’s important for Democrats not to legitimize FOX by appearing there, and why Barack Obama’s appearance on FOX News Sunday was a huge step backwards in the Left’s efforts to identify FOX as what it is — a Republican propaganda mouthpiece. I voiced some similar opinions in a post here.

And then Hillary Clinton appeared on the O’Reilly Factor. Apparently the chance to join FOX and the Republicans to talk about Rev. Wright for the 8 millionth time was enough to make her forget the way that FOX has talked about her, her husband, her daughter, her friends, and Democrats for the last 12 years.

I’ve been seeing and reading a lot about these two appearances in the past few days, and “conventional wisdom” seems to be saying that going on FOX is a very good thing for Democrats to do. When I was on MSNBC last Friday, I was the only one on the panel who felt that Obama was making a big mistake going on FOX. But, as is usually the case, CW is completely wrong.

Democrats, especially prominent ones like Clinton and Obama, should not go on FOX. Never.

I’ve been hearing some talk about how Obama’s appearance might have actually been a very clever strategy, that by distancing himself from MoveOn and progressive blogs (who didn’t want him to go on FOX), Obama could claim that he is not beholden to liberals and can court more moderate Democratic voters, and even Republicans. I imagine the Clinton campaign is probably thinking the same thing. Unfortunately, to believe in a “strategy” like this reveals a total lack of understanding of what FOX is, as well as the mood in the US in 2008.

First, as Bowers and I have pointed out, no Democrats, no matter how conservative they might be, watch FOX, so there are no votes to be gained there. All FOX does all day is say that Democrats are liberal, atheist, Marxist, Communist, gay, racist, hypocritical, tax-raising, America-hating, troop-bashing, terrorist supporters — any Democrat who watches FOX regularly would have to be a self-hating masochist to subject himself to that kind of daily abuse. Also, FOX viewers overwhelmingly don’t vote for Democrats — you only need to look at the 2004 election where 88% of FOX viewers voted for George W. Bush with only 7% voting for John Kerry. Only registered Republicans produce margins that vast — probably because most FOX viewers are registered republicans.

FOX viewers also won’t be impressed that Democrats like Obama and Clinton are trying to reach out to them because FOX viewers don’t want to join forces with Democrats — they want to beat them into submission, irrelevance, or extinction. They don’t want to find common ground — they want to amplify differences. It’s shocking to me that after 12 years of constant abuse, Hillary Clinton doesn’t realize that FOX viewers snarl like Pavlov’s dogs at the mere mention of her name. And with FOX’s long history of hating black people from Al Sharpton to OJ Simpson, Obama never had a chance. A Democrat trying to win votes on FOX is like a Democrat trying to win votes at the Republican National Convention, or Sammy Davis Jr. trying to win fans at a KKK rally. FOX viewers are not open to being swayed — these are the same people who still think that Bush is doing a great job.

Second, there’s nothing to gain from Obama and Clinton distancing themselves from progressives because I don’t get the feeling that moderate Democrats are freaked out by MoveOn, the Center for American Progress, DailyKos, or Firedoglake. But it’s the Right’s control over the media that creates the “conventional wisdom” that MoveOn is a scary fringe organization that should be shunned, not a grassroots progressive organization with over 3 million members. Actually, I’d guess that practically all Democrats (and a majority of Americans in general) share the priorities of the progressive movement — universal healthcare, increased environmental protection, increased regulation of corporations, an end to the Iraq war, an energy policy based on renewable resources, and accountability for the Bush administration. Who would want to run from that? Distancing themselves from progressives won’t win moderate votes, but it will certainly anger, sadden, or disappoint progressives, who are the Democrats’ base and their most consistent champions, defenders, and contributors. The only people who want the Democrats to distance themselves from their base are republicans. Only Republicans say that Clinton and Obama are too liberal, not Democrats, and Republicans will say that about virtually every Democrat to the left of Joe Lieberman.

So Obama and Clinton literally have nothing to gain from going on FOX. FOX has been very quiet about Obama’s interview on Sunday, either because FOX is busy picking it apart for soundbites to be distorted and lied about at a time of their choosing, or they are too flush with excitement about new Rev. Wright statements — there’s only 24 hours in a day, and Rev. Wright stories and analysis takes up about 23.8 of them. And since Clinton’s interview is being spread over two nights, it’s too early to see if there’s any immediate fallout from that.

But, more likely, it’s because FOX knows that it already won. This is where so many Democrats who have applauded Clinton and Obama’s decisions to go on FOX have completely missed the point.

By going on FOX without attacking them and calling them out for what they are, Obama and Clinton lost, the Democrats lost, and FOX won. Obama and Clinton will win no votes, and they reinforced and enhanced FOX’s most prized possession — the illusion that they are a legitimate news organization, not a Republican propaganda machine. And with that, Obama and Clinton have legitimized every anti-Democrat smear and lie to emanate from FOX as being the result of actual journalism, not simply the dissemination of Republican talking points and misinformation. And if both Democrats and Republicans are claiming that FOX is a fair news outlet, why wouldn’t the rest of the press? As we’ve shown with FOX ATTACKS! Obama 2 and THE FOX IS WRONG! Obama, they already have, and the traditional media’s parroting of FOX has had an enormously destructive effect on both the media and the American democracy that relies on it.

And Obama didn’t just legitimize FOX and their tactics by inference and association. in the case of Rev. Wright, he did it specifically by saying that Wright is a “legitimate political issue”, despite the fact that after non-stop, prolonged coverage on every network, it isn’t now, even if it once was. This also gives FOX permission to continue their non-stop coverage of Wright — after all, Obama himself said it was “legitimate”. Obama went on to say that it was wrong to caricature Wright and his church by repeating 30-second soundbites, but he never called out FOX for being the worst, most consistent user of that technique. Clinton did a similar thing last night when she agreed with O’Reilly that she is a “polarizing” personality without noting that FOX is largely responsible for creating that perception of her (though FOX has recently toned these down to help Clinton win the nomination so she can presumptively lose the election to McCain). There is very little in the American media and political system that is as polarizing as FOX.

One would hope that with FOX’s history of covering Obama and the Clintons, they would know better than anyone what FOX is and provide much-needed leadership in the effort to delegitimize FOX. They could lead the way in asking their fellow Democrats not to go on FOX — what better way to show that FOX is a Republican propaganda machine than if Republicans are the only ones who appear on it? But at this important time, neither Obama nor Clinton seems prepared to demonstrate that leadership.

Expect to see ads for FOX featuring Obama and Clinton in the weeks and months to come. And expect FOX to use Clinton and Obama’s appearance to "prove" their "legitimacy" forever.


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Prove their legitimacy?
Posted by: Lauren on May 3, 2008 12:02 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I thought it was more like Hillary showing her colors, Obama being fooled.

She figured, he did it, so can I. FAUX Used them both. As planned. The networks are awfully quiet about all this because they just realized they thought they were getting caught with their hand in the cookie jar, but just realized it is in fact, a bear trap. They are scared as hell. Oh look here comes a bear.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200805020010?f=h_top

Fantastic comment there by Dem02020. An extract, you'll want to read the whole thing.


Ok, so it's obvious that the newscast producers at NBC, ABC, and CBS know well enough about David Barstow's "Message Machine: Behind TV's Analysts, Pentagon's Hidden Hand", because it's not only about them, but because they were asked for information in the writing of it...

So then why are they continuing to ignore the danged thing, like as if it were a bum on a New York street with his hand out?

I can only guess these several, perfectly understandable reasons, as to maybe why:

Embarrassment... Shame... Guilt?

Or maybe some sort of legal liability, if not a criminal one, then perhaps a Regulatory one... because of course, what NBC and ABC and CBS have done, and do, they did and do by way of an FCC License (which is a privilege, revocable, not a Right)... they did it on a Public Resource of ours, the PUBLIC AIRWAVES, that We (through our FCC and our agents in Congress that oversee the FCC) Licensed them to use, as a powerful privilege, to broadcast to us the American People.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Prove their legitimacy? Posted by: Lauren
» RE: Prove their legitimacy? Posted by: bornxeyed
» RE: Prove their legitimacy? Posted by: Lauren
Oil company question
Posted by: Lauren on May 3, 2008 12:16 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Billo did a white wash of the 'blame' of the industry and Hillary not only agreed the companies were basically blameless, but also agreed that the political parties, including the Democrats were to blame. She immediately mentions a bunch of folks to blame, spread it all around.

Talk about throwing your own people under the bus?! Wow. How much do you think the oil companies paid Billo for that one?

(Now mind you, she and Billo are war criminals - working up a good cover story together. Does it look good enough? Are you going to buy it? Did you buy 9/11?)

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Oil company question Posted by: Lauren
FAUX NEWS Why Bother?
Posted by: williameon on May 4, 2008 3:49 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Faux Network!
Bizarro T.V.
Totally
FAKE and Unbalanced!
Do they really think the Ignorant Brainwashed fools who watch this stuff will vote for Them?
All the Corpirate Mind control Networks Stink
Faux is the Worst!
Spewing PURE, totally unadulterated
BU__! SH__!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» FAKE and Unbalanced Posted by: Ellie1
Way To Go Dems
Posted by: Skelly on May 4, 2008 6:00 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I couldn't wait to vote Dem this fall, but thanks to the House Dems refusing to battle Bush over Iraq and because of neither Obama or Clinton standing up and saying that yes, I am a Liberal and I'm here to get in your face, get used to it, deal with it we get this sad, sorry showing on Fox. Well, count me as a protest vote. Socialist, Green, whatever lefty is on my Virginia Ballot gets my vote. Never vote for a Quisling.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Obama shows no Fear, Hillary Proving she is a Neo Con
Posted by: Purple Girl on May 4, 2008 6:03 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama I felt was fearless in taking on the Corp Neo Con beast. Granted Chris Wallace is a disappintment as a legitmate 'News ' man. but slightly more 'Creditable' Then BillO.
As for Hillary her meeting with Scaife(?) was the beinging of her hand 'tipping'. Then her statement she's "obliterate Iran with Nukes' was the undeniable Red Flag. It baffled me until I found 'Sermons' from that insanely Dangerous Cult leader Hagee who want a Pre-emptive strike to be carried out on Iran to ignite th e'End of Days' self fulfilling Prophecy- stupid doctrine if Not for the Fact there are Many Gov't 'leaders' who support Him and his doctrine ( Not just Mac's endorsement ,but Liebermann's Praise!!!) This Man and his followers should be on the Terroist Watch list and any Public'Servant ' should be kicked out of Office and investigated for what they have done to support his Deadly agenda. I foolish though Hillary was just a Corp covert Operative- Now I realize she was Signalling she is in total agreement with Hagees plan and will be one of his 'Warriors for God' once in the Oval Office. This Assciation is far more Detrimental to our National Security then anything Rev Wright said When misconstued by the Media.

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Of course Obama and Clinton went on FOX
Posted by: Ghoulman on May 4, 2008 9:22 AM   
Current rating: 1    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
... it's a network. It is a giant corporation. All American politics is beholden to corporations. Do you think Hillary gives a damn about The People? Do you think Obama does? Neither are any different than George W. Bush. They will have the same policies as the GOP, they will just spin it differently. American foreign policy never, ever, has changed. Certainly the war part. You thought the Cold War being over would bring peace? Nah, that's not American policy.

Americans even like to say they "won" the Cold War. The corporate news is just propaganda and the fact that most Americans believe this myth (along with Saddam has WMDs, and so on and so on) goes to show the networks importance to those in power. Moveon and the others are simply not important in the creation of the American myth. Thus Hillary and Obama will not appear.

If you are actually a so called progressive person, one who cares about your children's future, actual Christian values, and a world where the USA isn't a feared war mongering land of hate... vote for Ralph Nader! The only guy with an actual record of standing up to corporatists on behalf of The People of the United States of America.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Vote Nader? No thanks! Posted by: Ellie1
» RE: Vote Nader? No thanks! Posted by: metryjen
Article Got It Wrong
Posted by: desidid on May 4, 2008 12:36 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I believe that Hillary was seeking the Reagan Democrat vote, a bloc that is vehemently opposed to social spending and civil rights. I don't believe that Barack can talk about inclusion and a new kind of politics while ignoring a segment of the population who strictly watches Faux news. Also unlike Hillary I'm sure his expectation isn't that Faux news watchers will "get it" and flock to his campaign.

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» RE: Article Got It Wrong Posted by: Lauren
» RE: Article Got It Wrong Posted by: willymack
The Truth About It
Posted by: Weathervane on May 4, 2008 3:14 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
When is someone people listen to going to say, The Clintons are Republicans?

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fox
Posted by: cwilsondrum on May 4, 2008 7:21 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
clinton has no self respect and no shame. she doesn't know what fox is all about? how can anyone that stupid be president. I personally want fox news' fcc license taken away. nazi,racist,criminal enablers and propaganda machine,with bobble-headed ignorant journalism school rejects for employees on "newsy-type smear shows".

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Anyone who listens to anything that man spouts!and believes
Posted by: donl51 on May 5, 2008 7:32 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
should be castrated so as not to spread their seed of stupidity into society!....The sooner we all forget this menace exists the better off we'll ''all'' be!!

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» THAt man? Posted by: Ellie1
An Open Letter to Barack Obama
Posted by: wilty on May 5, 2008 9:24 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Senator Obama:

By submitting to FOX, the Democrats continue in their folly of appeasement, sucking up to the
"Big Bad Wolf" which is the Republican Party.

Why won't they stop playing games with these fascists, who create and change with whimsy, all the ground rules. Why do they insist in playing all their games away, instead of on their own turf? Why even play with these thieves and criminals, in the first place.

Hillary is all bluster, wearing those figurative silly mega shoulder pads, drinkin' shots with the boys, and swaggering around with her saber a'wavin' towards Iran.

Hear that, see it, Barack? We need you to stand up with courage, and stare that evil Republican monster in the eye, until IT blinks. Barack, you are needed now, more than ever, to set the example of taking the higher road, but slay that dragon if you must.

This is no time to be distracted or sucked in by all the puffery, nonsense and false issues that the Republicans and their Goebbels Network rain all over the place. Barack, be sure that most of us, the American people, need, deserve and want a courageous leader, right now, and if you have to slam that monster SOB to the wall, and cut off its head, by all means, do so!!

This crap has to stop, right NOW!! And YOU must be the one to DO it!!!

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oxheadone
Posted by: oxheadone on May 5, 2008 2:07 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It would be really ironic if an insigniificant black preacher could be the basis of electing McCain, an angry old man trying to win the Vietnam war, the next president of the US. We know that about 30% of US voters are unreconcilable (racial and religious)bigots. Tying Obama to an angry black man may be enough to scare the marginal people into voting their fears rather than their hopes.

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Far left Stuck on Stupid!
Posted by: Ky Lake Dave on May 5, 2008 2:22 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
DJK writes:
DJK asks,
"No Republican would go to speak at a MoveOn event. John McCain won’t be going to YearlyKos or the Take Back America conference, and you won’t be hearing him on Air America or see him talking to Keith Olbermann. So why are Democrats told and why do they continue to believe they should go on FOX?"

Answer,
Moveon, YearlyKos and Take Back America are pissant little websites with a loud but small block of voters. Fox is the largest cable news outlet in the world. Clinton and Obama need to have eyes and ears listening to them and Fox is where the eyes and ears are. I know the far left hate the Fox News network but alas the First Amemendment of the Constitution protects Fox News' Freedom of Speach just as vaidly as the Air America Network. Fox News speaks to a hell of alot more people than Air America. I think 1 metro local news station has a larger market share than Air America nationwide. Cry slobber scream and kick your feet but Fox News draws Millions of Voters and Voters are what Presidental Nomines are looking for. So go grab you crying towel and face reality.

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JReum
Posted by: Jreum on May 9, 2008 9:25 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
FoxNews is the largest and most popular cable network in existance, so, it would be stupid, not to appear on FoxNews.

Those other organizations, written about are biased and dishonest.

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