Home
Archive
Newsletters
Video
Blogs
Discuss
About
Search
Donate
Advertise
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
Advertisement
  • AlterNetYour turn

Support AlterNet
Do you value the information you're getting from AlterNet? Please show your support with a tax-deductible donation.


Feedback
Tell us how we're doing.

Advertisement
Advertisement

How we (essentially) stole Iraq's oil

Posted by Joshua Holland at 1:57 AM on May 9, 2006.


It was always part of the plan.
bloodforoil
usoil

Share and save this post:

      

      

Share on Facebook       

AlterNet Social Networks:
follow us on twitter
find us on Facebook

Got a tip for a post?:
Email us | Anonymous form

Get The Mix in your
mailbox!

 

Scott Adams, the father of Dilbert, has a question:

I don't understand the theory that we attacked Iraq for oil. Can one of you geniuses explain that to the rest of us?

I like a good conspiracy theory as much as the next person. And I certainly think governments are capable of doing bad things. But I don't understand the concept of attacking Iraq "because of oil." What does that even mean? [...]

Seriously. Can anyone explain what the plan was?

Sure, Dilbert's dad.

And let me just say that if I had a nickel for every time someone airily dismissed the anti-war crowd's chants of "no blood for oil" by pointing out that we could always buy the oil on the open market, or that Iraq's government still controls it I'd … well, I'd have quite a few nickels.

The first thing one needs to understand is the difference between the old-school paleo-colonialism so popular among Brits wearing pith helmets in the 19th century and the shiny new brand of neo-colonialism that we perfected in the 20th. The essence of the latter is this: of course we'll respect your sovereignty and abide by your domestic laws, as long as we can help write them.

That's the heart of it. In her book, The Bush Agenda, Antonia Juhasz detailed how, six months before the invasion, the administration brought in a group of oil executives to advise them on Iraqi oil policy (this, as Bush was swearing up and down that he had no intention of going to war). The State Department also set up a consulting group under the "Future of Iraq Project" called the "Oil and Energy Working Group." After some back and forth among the various consultants, a consensus was reached that Iraq's oil "should be opened to international oil companies as quickly as possible after the war." What a shocker!

But they couldn't just say that, or Dilbert's father wouldn't be able to scratch his head at those unruly anti-war types. The administration did a great job of deflecting the criticism; Bush called Iraq's oil wealth its "patrimony" and promised it would stay in the hands of the Iraqi people.

And when Paul Bremer was serving as the "dictator of Iraq" (in the words of UN envoy Lakhdar Brahimi) and instituted his infamous "100 rules" -- rules that privatized Iraq's state companies, threw open its economy to foreign investment, established a flat tax and instituted a dozen other measures on the Chamber of Commerce's wish-list -- oil was excluded.

And the war-hawks said: See?

But what Iraq ended up with was a law, written by our oil execs, that gave their companies a far greater cut of Iraq's oil wealth than they can get anywhere else in the Middle East.

I'll let Antonia Juhasz explain the deal:

Essentially the United States crafted a new oil law for Iraq that provides for production sharing agreements [PSAs], which are contractual terms between a government and a foreign corporation to explore for, produce and market oil. Production sharing agreements are not used by any country in the Middle East, or in fact by any country that's truly wealthy in oil. They're used to entice investors into an area where the oil is expensive to produce or there isn't a lot of oil.

But Iraq has potentially the largest oil reserves in the world and they're very easy and cheap to get to -- in Iraq, you essentially just stick a pipe in the ground and you get oil. There's absolutely no reason for Iraq to enter into PSAs, but there's every reason for Western oil companies to want them -- they provide the best terms short of full privatization of the oil.

Iraq has eighty known oil fields. Seventeen of them have been discovered. Under the new oil law -- written into the constitution -- those seventeen will be under the control of the Iraqi national oil company.

That's what Bush meant when he talked about preserving Iraq's "oil patrimony." But …

All undiscovered oil fields are now open to the PSAs. That means, depending on how much oil there is in Iraq, foreign companies will have control over at least 64 percent of Iraq's oil and as much as 84 percent.

PSAs are the worst possible deals for countries; last week economist Mark Weisbrot referred to one in Latin America that gave the government a healthy cut of one percent of its natural gas revenues.

That isn't just a law that can be dismissed down the road by Iraq's legislature with a simple vote; it was built into the country's Constitution, a document that Iraqis approved without having a firm grip on its details (read my interview with Juhasz for some insight into how that happened).

And it's not just about oil; combine the Oil Law with the rest of Bremer's orders. They not only slashed corporate taxes and allowed foreign investors to take 100 percent of their profits out of the country, they gave them -- by law -- the same status as Iraqi firms. That means that all the things countries like Iraq do to turn foreign investment into a little bit of development are off the table: foreign multinationals can't be asked to invest in the local economy or hire a certain number of Iraqi workers or build schools and health clinics or any of the other strategies that are common in poor but resource-rich countries. All of those rules worked their way into the Constitution as well.

None of this is a conspiracy theory; all of it is well-documented in the public record. There were endless position papers put out by industry groups urging the ouster of Saddam in order to open Iraq's economy, and they lobbied quite openly. Juhasz details all of it in her book. People like Dick Cheney, George Schultz and Henry Kissinger warned that American firms were being left out of the fun; while 36 prcent of Iraq's oil ended up in the U.S. during the sanctions years, it mostly came through foreign middle-men -- Saddam gave very few contracts to American firms. That wasn't acceptable and we took him out. It's not a conspiracy when the "conspirators" spent years writing Op-Eds in the Washington Post.

The best evidence that Iraq was an economic invasion, though, is the whole history of our relationship with his government. Saddam was supposed to be our boy in the Middle East after the Shah fell in Iran. He didn't become the Next Hitler™ when he gassed the Kurds. Although always a brutal tyrant, Saddam became a real monster, according to the U.S. government, six months before the first invasion, when, after a very prolonged negotiation with Bechtel, he put the kibosh on the Aqaba pipeline project, a project that both Reagan and Bush 41 wanted badly. That's when we decided we couldn't work with him and the rest, as they say, is … you know.

I hope that helps, Scott.

Digg!

Joshua Holland is a staff writer at Alternet and a regular contributor to The Gadflyer.


On the religious right 'nuts,' liberals, and catching a break
A response to a colleague...
Post by Evan Derkacz. October 17, 2006.
Bush thinking of 'replacing' Iraqi government? [VIDEO]
A whole new definition of Democracy.
Post by Evan Derkacz. October 16, 2006.
Religious right rally's first gaffe
Church opposes bigoted agenda
Post by Evan Derkacz. October 16, 2006.
Advertisement
Comments Turn comments off sitewide Give us feedback »
Comments closed.
The comments for this story have been closed. Thank you to everyone who participated.
View:
oil the simple economic
Posted by: solrev on May 9, 2006 4:12 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In 2004 the US oil companies produced approximately 8.5 million barrals of home grown oil a day. We imported approximately 10.5 million barrels a day. The US has no oil reserves. If your in the business of pumping oil, you better find some other oil to pump. When the US oil is depleted anyone can build a refinery buy oil on the open market and compete. Better not let any refineries just set there to be bought buy potential competiters.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: oil the simple economic Posted by: symcokid
Chomsky's question.
Posted by: douglashoyt on May 9, 2006 5:47 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Would the USA have invaded Iraq if it exported only pickles and cabbage?

Any thinking person would know the answer is "no."

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Chomsky's question. Posted by: yellow
I don't see...
Posted by: caitlin on May 9, 2006 6:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
how anyone can be truly surprised that US leaders would make military and foreign policy decisions with oil as their guiding value. First of all, that's how it's been since World War I, when mechanized weaponry became a big part of the battlefield. Second, wars throughout all of history have been all about securing access to resources. This idea of wars with noble, lofty intentions based in human rights is simply PR and has no basis in reality. Finally, oil/energy is a HUGELY PROFITABLE business - our entire society would grind to a crushing halt without it. We need that energy, whether we want to admit it or not, and many of us are more than happy to pay out the nose for it. With so much money at stake, it makes sense that Big Energy would do whatever they could to ensure the continuance of their fortunes.

The idea just isn't that far-fetched to me. What, do we suddenly expect the robber barons to go Robin Hood on us or something? That's the impression I get when people dismiss the connections between oil and US military/foreign policy as mere crackpot conspiracy theory.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» yup Posted by: Iconoclast421
Best Laid Plans
Posted by: Wacre on May 9, 2006 8:09 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
While I believe that this was Washington's intent (to allow American oil companies free reign over Iraq's vitually untapped oil/natural resources; what we generally call democracy over here), I really doubt that it will amount to a hill of beans when all is said and done because when the Iraqis realize what they have signed on for--and when Iran's influence grows even stronger--I suspect that they are going to pull a Chavez or a Morales on us.

Which is to say that they are going to nationalize their oil resources (which can only be prevented, I suspect, if the United States maintains a large military presence there though this is a somewhat dubious--and perilous--position because it will eventually penetrate that the American presence in that country is fueling the rebels. By the way, prefer to use rebels as opposed to terrorists because if someone had invaded our country I highly suspect that those of us that defend it however we could would be called terrorists) and kick our oil companies to the curb.

And the worse thing is (for the Bush Administration and whatever administration that follows it after his impeachment) is that the American public will be so skeptical of their governments' motives that they will not be able to reinvade (perhaps because the "Vietnam syndrome" will be replaced by it's more modern equivalent: The "Iraq syndrome").

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Learning? Posted by: brasilaron
AHOPE
Posted by: ahope on May 9, 2006 8:39 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Josh, while much of what you've written is true (as you say, it's a matter of public record) it's just not correct for the anti-war crowd to declare that the invasion was "all about oil." That blanket statement strikes me as a dangerously incomplete explanation. Not only is it a (gross) oversimplification of what's happened, it also seems to preclude thoughtful debate and discourse. Certainly, strategic concerns and domestic oil interests played a role, the question is how much of a role? Maybe more, maybe less, reasonable people can disagree. Personally, I think that while oil concerns may have provided an acute, short-term excuse for the administrations actions, there were (are) much more powerful and subtle cultural, historical, socio-political and even economic factors at play.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: AHOPE Posted by: decembrist
» you're right Posted by: Iconoclast421
» RE: you're right Posted by: ConnecttheDots
» RE: AHOPE Posted by: sk
Oil Wars and the "Peak Oil" phenomenon
Posted by: Senqi on May 9, 2006 8:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Good article and good comments (so far)..

I think we (industrial societies especially) are in for
quite a ride when oil production peaks and starts to
decline.. Our economies can't handle that, I'm afraid..

In that sense, the desperate attempts of the US are
understandable, though despicable..

Another informative article can be found at:

http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0505-23.htm

= The Real Oil Story: The Oil in Iraq

Peace and good luck!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Keep in mind
Posted by: Iconoclast421 on May 9, 2006 10:56 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Keep in mind that the goal is not always finding more oil, or getting more access to oil for our major oil companies. It's really about securing oil. By turning Iraq into a terrorist state, we have effectively removed Iraqi oil from the market. The potential risk of pumping in Iraq adds to it's cost, making our own domestic oil more economical to produce. At $70 a barrel, many previously capped wells in America can become economical again. Peace in Iraq = greater oil production = lower price per barrel = more capped wells in the US. In fact one can argue that higher oil prices are better for our economy. But what it really comes down to is whether you are primarily a consumer or producer/investor in the energy sector. Obviously this administration is heavily influenced by the producer/investor side, and we on the other side are paying the price.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Yes, it was premeditated
Posted by: moshejp on May 9, 2006 11:02 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
There was no plan for Iraq only in the sense that things didnt go as they'd planned.

See some of the (volumnous!) plans going back to 2001 that Josh might have been talking about are here

Reports From the Future of Iraq Project - declassified from State Dept in response to FOIA request

Thanks Josh

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Iraqi oil
Posted by: mdf1960 on May 9, 2006 11:03 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The Iraqi oil was previously in the hands of the dictator Saddam Hussein, not "the people." Hussein did buy some support by public works and welfare like all politicians, but a huge amount of the oil money went into his pockets and those of his friends. Can't you leftists see that government ownership just puts control of resources into the hands of another elite? I suggest that an Iraqi oil corporation be formed and shares ~given~ out to the Iraqi people. That would be true ownership and control. Enough fairy tales about how things would be a utopia if only we had the "right" people running the government.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Iraqi oil Posted by: *Jeff*
» RE: Iraqi oil Posted by: Graeme
Simple Question = Complex Answer
Posted by: kenn on May 9, 2006 11:39 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It's never so complex a task than to answer a simple question. The reality is likely there was a number of people who lobbied and "educated" the President and his staff on going to war, with very few (e.g. British History Professors) arguing against.

Likely the reasons had something to do with;
- Money (Iraq was about to accept Euros for Oil)
- Oil (2nd largest known (easy) deposits, hedge against possible collapse of Saud)
- Israel (reminder to Arabs that you have a body guard)
- Short term history (sense of job not finished)
- Geography (a great spot for a base or two or three)
- Politics (likely no, but yes if based on American currency (see above)) and sympathetic to US Middle East policy.

It unlikely had anything to do with freeing the people of Sadam, or bringing stability to the region as the best stability is stasis or "no change".

Depending who writes history, we might get more insight on the reasons for the war in Iraq, but my guess is there are too many facets to single it down to one line item. Certainly the risk of currency change over or neutrality to Euro from US created a big enough risk both foreign and domestic to make this a go. You'll note that "mission accomplished" flight deck speech was timed to this demise and return to US dollar exclusively for oil in Iraq and not the end of hostilities.

Simple question, complex answer.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Other Factors
Posted by: Rendwich on May 9, 2006 1:29 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The first thing I noticed was how much this all reminds me of the Carter years. I haven't seen any lines of cars at gas stations, though, and apparently people are driving as much as ever. So really, the price of a barrel of oil is going to have to get much higher before any of this is "news" at the level of Carter.

Second, I totally agree that the Iraqis will not put up with being screwed in a bad deal, constitution or not. If they don't like the deal, they will tear it up.

Third, what does this sentence mean?

"Iraq has eighty known oil fields. Seventeen of them have been discovered. "

That is a mind-boggler. How do you discover something that is already known? Those kinds of sentences cast doubt on everything else a writer is puttiing out there. It may just be a simple mistake, no idea. But it's a HUGE simple mistake.

Fourthly, the price of a barrel of oil is totally controlled by OPEC, which is to say, the Saudis. Here's how they do it, and have been doing it for decades:

1. Slowly ratchet up the price of a barrel. Any excuse will do. Popular ones: "We're running out!" "Dictator X is on the loose!" "The White Devil is leaning on us too hard!" etc.

2. Watch in amusement as oil exploration in the US and other non-OPEC territory explodes. Old, bad wells get pumped again, new, bad wells get drilled. It's worth it because oil is expensive (for the moment)!

3. When many, many, many banks have loaned all kinds of money to many, many, many wildcatters and new exploration companies, it's time for the big trick. Just start pumping more of that OPEC crude. Cut the barrel price by 1/3, by a 1/2, whatever.

4. Watch in even greater amusement as the western world declares bankruptcy en masse. All those bad wells are no longer profitable.

This is important because the big guys understand this. You don't see Shell and Exxon falling for this crap. That's why they're making so much money right now, they aren't plowing it into new, bad wells because they have seen this five or six times already, and they know there is plenty of oil out there. Those big companies are just riding the cash wave, just like the Saudis, just like OPEC.

Of course we care about Iraq because of oil, but it's not the *Iraqi* oil in particular, it's the whole oil-producing region of the world. The good news is that democracy, even badly-designed, poorly executed democracy is great for Iraq and also great for us, because it makes the oil-producing part of the world more stable. There is such a thing a win-win situation, and this is one of them.

I have no doubt that a minority of Iraqis would love to go back to the days of Saddam, just like a minority of Americans would love to go back to the Taft administration. But, overall, their sea of oil is turning out to be a huge, lucky asset in getting them some human rights and laws instead of a very cruel dictator.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» Other Factors, and are you crazy? Posted by: brasilaron
» RE: Other Factors, and are you crazy? Posted by: Pseudo Morals
» RE: Other Factors Posted by: Graeme
The Good Ole Days
Posted by: rlb2005 on May 9, 2006 2:50 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Yes, many an Iraqi can only wish for a dictator who kills his enemies in mass when they rebel. Yet, dictators do not starve a half million children, since they have to be selective on which ones to kill. Dictators do not destroy the infrastructure of their country, esp, that portion which will spread disease throughout the land,i.e. water treatment plants, hospitals, etc.. Dictators normally don't level whole cities, they may kill a lot of inhabitants. Dictators try not to stir up sectarian war and strife, because once one group gets strong enough they will try overpower the Dictator. Saddam was terrible, but it took several years at least 20+ to kill the number of people we have killed or contributed to their death in only three. Now if Saddam is guilty of killing folks for uprisings and he was the nation's leader, what are invaders and occupiers guilty of if they kill uprisers (insurgents, terrorists, Baathist, etc..)

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Rendwich
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Graeme
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Graeme
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Graeme
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Rendwich
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Liberty777
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Rendwich
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Graeme
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Rendwich
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: dave236412
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Graeme
» RE: The Good Ole Days Posted by: Graeme
oil for war
Posted by: xaxado on May 9, 2006 3:44 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Warfare divides into two broad categories -- those requiring fuel-based "delivery systems" (conventional war), and all others. THE PRIZE by Daniel Yergin documents in exquisite detail how previous conventional wars were won and lost over timely delivery of fuel for combat vehicles.

For example, Rommel's North Africa tank campaign aimed at securing Middle Eastern oil (including Iraq's) for the Nazi war machine. It failed only because allied air control over the Mediterranean deprived it of fuel. Japan and Germany both lost WWII, quite literally, because they ran out of gas.

The Twentieth Century's World Wars were won primarily with American oil, via supply lines defended by the US military. With subsequently depleted reserves
Americans are no longer positioned to fuel a protracted conventional war.

In a long conventional war, the US would lose to any enemy controlling large supplies of securely deliverable oil. For anyone wishing to participate in such a war, control of the Middle East is a prerequisite. You must be ready to start the war there -- Hitler amply demonstrated the folly of considering oil as a combat objective.

Being a dominant superpower requires a "central command" from which vehicles suitable for a "long war" can be based and fueled. Such a base must be defensible, with round trip distances to targets matched accurately to real world vehicle cababilities (Hitler fell just short of of capturing Russia's southern oilfields because logistical calculations failed to take into account poor fuel mileage due to muddy roads).

Iraq is a uniquely sensible location, from a military standpoint, for a superpower central command. The oil underground is of such quality that it can be used in vehicles almost without refining. And many potential enemies are within easy striking distance -- a "target rich environment" if there ever was one.

North America, by contrast, represents a poor military headquarters for conventional warfare. Oil supplies are dwindling, and most potential enemies are reachable only through very long and vulnerable routes.

To the extent that Iraq can stand as the world's pre-eminent military base, it can have special benefit to North America by guarding many major tanker traffic choke points. But otherwise, why bother? Conservation makes better defense policy than combat, with superior security.

The US, by most historic standards, has few enemies. Setting up the best base ever from which to fight a protracted conventional war requires definition of an enemy. What force could arise in the future with such haunting evil that a country must be stolen and demolished in preparation?

Antonia Juhasz in THE BUSH AGENDA calls our attention to a merging of corporate and miliary objectives. We should well ponder that nexus.

What if, after all, the great war to be fought from Iraq is not between nations, but against a "stateless" enemy. Terrorists may be stateless, but in numbers and resources they appear to be small timers.

What if, by contrast, some great corporations, rising to a perceived "manifest destiny" implied by their demi-godly status as immortal "artificial persons", declared a new kind of war on mere mortals. This would be war on a grand scale. Homeric.

How could corporations do such a thing without their own military? Perhaps they could find a sympathetic "mercenary" force, well equipped, borrowed from an otherwise unchallenged nation, paid for in part by the hapless donor citizenry.

What would a rogue stateless fusion of military and economic power look like, were it to be concealed in plain sight? What ruses would it construct, what false rationales? How would the secrets be kept?

Iraq raises many unasked questions. The place of oil is a key part of the puzzle.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: oil for war Posted by: Lincoln fan
Hogwash
Posted by: Bechtel spokesman on May 9, 2006 4:14 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The rest, as they say, is . . . hogwash. The demise of Bechtel's Aqaba pipeline proposal had nothing to do with the first Gulf War. Iraq rejected the pipeline in 1985. The failure of the proposal caused nary a blip in U.S.-Iraq relations; as late as 1989, President Bush issued a national security directive to increase economic and political ties with Iraq. What triggered the Gulf War, lest we forget, was Saddam's invasion of Kuwait. By then, the pipeline was a distant memory. (Jonathan Marshall)

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Hogwash Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Hogwash Posted by: Lincoln fan
Skeptic
Posted by: poelmanc on May 9, 2006 7:28 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Basically this article really just rants against the fact that we set up Iraq to be a capitalist democracy after we toppled Saddam, it doesn't even remotely prove that we invaded Iraq for oil. Of course we're not going to set it up along the socialist "the government owns all the oil" model as the author would presumably wish, like the other middle eastern oil producers; our whole point was to set up a capitalist democracy in the middle east to offer a third path, an alternative to the false dichotomy of dictatorship and islamic fundamentalism that pervades the region. Just to avoid being accused of an oil grab, we set up a national oil company (a rather socialist deviation from our otherwise capitalist norm) and gave it ownership over all of the existing oil fields. Yet the author twists that around as if it's some sort of evil conspiracy that we allow private enterprise to invest in and own future oil field developments!

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Skeptic Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: poelmanc
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: Lincoln fan
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: rlb2005
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: Pocahontas
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: poelmanc
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: poelmanc
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: symcokid
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: yellow
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: poelmanc
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: yellow
» RE: Skeptic Posted by: symcokid
» Says it right there Posted by: Joshua Holland
» RE: Says it right there Posted by: poelmanc
» RE: Says it right there Posted by: Graeme
» RE: Says it right there Posted by: yellow
Is Self Interested War Necessarily Wrong?
Posted by: bgkennedy2000 on May 10, 2006 4:09 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Let's assume the primary strategic purpose of the War in Iraq was to secure access to oil fields and break OPEC, and let's assume that this action is in America's economic self interest. Let's also assume that when the decision to go to War was made, it was reasonable to project that life for the average Iraqi would be better after the American led invasion than under Hussein. Under these assumptions, why is it necessarily wrong, ie immoral, to invade?

I know you're probably laughing out there, but take this seriously. Can't an action be simultaneously for the actors advantage and the betterment of others?

We can have a seperate argument on whether or not the assumptions above were reasonable when the decision to go to War was made, but for argument's sake, let's just take the assumptions as true.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

Schnieder
Posted by: Schnieder on May 13, 2006 8:42 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Here is a Google--Israel + oil pipeline + Iraq.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]

» RE: Schnieder Posted by: symcokid
More ...
Posted by: Joshua Holland on May 15, 2006 9:37 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Up in The Mix.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »] [Rate this comment: 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - 5]