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Cry in your Molson

Posted by Joshua Holland at 7:34 AM on January 24, 2006.


We have a new PM up north: Stephen Harper
stephenharper
harper

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Conservative: 124 (99)
Liberal:103 (135)
Bloc Québécois: 51 (54)
New Dems 29 (19)

Mark steyn, one of the great twits of conservative opinion journalism, called it , "A SAD day for Michael Moore." The Sydney Morning Herald's headline screamed: "Poll result sends Canada on swing to right," and The Age's read: "Canada takes a right turn."

In the final weeks leading up to the poll both the Washington Post and the New York Times ran stories about the "backlash" against the Libs' "anti-Americanism." Because, you know, everything's all about us really.

Harper ran against the corruption plaguing the Libs. Dogged by the "sponsorship scandal," the Libs took a late hit at the end of December, when the Royal Canadian Mounted Police announced a criminal investigation into a possible leak of a key federal decision on income trusts ahead of a public announcement by the Finance Ministry (leak-gate?).

Harper kind of ran against gay marriage, but not too loudly. And he ran on crime, helped by a shooting incident in Toronto that shocked many Canucks. He said he'd pull Canada out of the Kyoto Accord, like his buddy Georgie W, and he was just all filled with manly excitement about a continental missile defense shield. Wouldn't want to waste those dollars (pronounced doh-lers) on healthcare and the like.

So now there's a Tory government, and the libs are out for the first time in 13 years. Paul Martin announced he'd step down from the party leadership.

I only follow Canadian politics casually, and you all can read the newspaper. So I want to throw this open to our many Canadian readers. I got questions.

Harper's going to have a minority government - no other party is likely to join a coalition. Can he get his agenda through? Will there be new elections quite soon? Who's next to lead the Libs? To what extent is this going to shake up the party? The biggest winners, proportionally, were the lefty New Dems (went from 19 to 29 seats), so is Canada in fact turning rightward? What else should we be watching in the next six months?

What's going on? Inquiring minds want to know.

Digg!

Joshua Holland is a staff writer at Alternet and a regular contributor to The Gadflyer.


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Yawn . . .
Posted by: Knowmad on Jan 24, 2006 8:07 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
First off Joshua, perhaps enough of the beer, poutine, hockey and funny talking comments. It really doesn't put you in a good light with us, and it illustates to Americans who understand our country how uninformed you are.
There, I did it . . . that actually qualifies as a major rant up here, what with us being so naturally polite and all. Now I need a nap.

Okay, I'm back. As to your questions: Well, very little changes really, as it's still a minority government. The interesting bit of irony here is that the Bloc, who's platform is Quebec independence from Canada, still has the swing seats to either side with the Conservatives, allowing them to actually do something, or the Liberals, thereby bringing about another non-confidence motion, and perhaps another election soon, much too soon, perhaps within a year. In addition to the campaigning, which is painful in its own right, our election process costs about $250 million; not much by U.S. standards, but enough to make most of us want to go through it as infrequently as possible.

As to right-leaning, the Conservatives are in many ways about the equivalent of your Democratic right. Thus this result is neither a banner day for neo-conservatism, nor a huge blow to our predominently liberal national mindset. The ratio of New Democrat - our most liberal party - gain is interesting and, I think, bodes well.

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» RE: Yawn . . . Posted by: JoshuaHolland
» RE: Yawn . . . Posted by: ankhet
» RE: Yawn . . . Posted by: CanuckKid
» RE: Yawn . . . Posted by: tclaverdure
» RE: Yawn . . . Posted by: Knowmad
» RE: Yawn . . . Posted by: tclaverdure
» RE: Yawn . . . Posted by: Jordon
Canada did not turn to the right-tclaverdure
Posted by: tclaverdure on Jan 24, 2006 8:24 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
No matter how the propagandists in the media try to spin this as a boost for Dumbya or a rejection of gay rights, or a rejection of kyoto etc etc here is the TRUTH.

63% of Canadians voted against the Conservatives. The NDP gained more seats and is very left wing this show a solid support for social democracy. Quebec seperation is DEAD as the Bloc only got 40% of the vote in Quebec (the only province where they run, they lost seats and sit at 50, though it must be noted they are social progessive in their policys, support kyoto big time, hate NAFTA etc. The liberals should have lost a lot of seats because Canada is real sick of Liberals talking like the NDP and acting more like Conservatives (a den of thieves), BUT did not lose many seats, Why??

Because Harper is such a lousy leader, scares people with his Homophobia, his anti-kyoto BS and his Bush boot licking etc. A moderate progressive conservative leader with some charisma would have wiped the liberals off the map and formed a majority, but Harper is like a Tom Delay type republican and his cabal of froth mouthed hate filled Members of Parliment are as sick as the worst congressional republicans. Bible thumping hate mongers, who don't give a rats ass about the poor and hate gays (typical modus operandi for the slugs).

So when this so called win is called a shift to the right call it bull shit, because it is. 63% of Canadians voted for a left or center left party HA HA HA. 18 months from now a new election and a big down turn for the NEOCONS that is my prediction. Anyway we need Proporional Representation big time as a Prime Minister with a majority in Canada is effectively a dictator. Look for Ignatieff or Stronach running to replace Martin, though Ignatieff would be a very poor choice as he supported the illegal invasion and destruction of Iraq (Dumb fucking harvard professor know it all neocon, liberal my ass). Stronach?? We will have to wait and see, as she plays her hands pretty cool it hard to tell what she believes (super rich, does not know povetry). Deep Sigh, if only a Tommy Douglas would emerge from the darkness.

My deep thanks for your concerns my progressive American friends.

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Canadian Coalitioning?
Posted by: Ish on Jan 24, 2006 8:31 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
In some ways yes, the Bloc will support the Conservatives, because the Bloc supports the federal government devolving powers and responsibilities on the provinces (specifically Quebec, but it will concede the same to all the others). In most other ways, the Bloc Quebecois are at the other end of the spectrum, being much more towards the left. If anything I would suggest that the Conservatives might have Liberal support (campaign from the left, govern from the right is almost a motto for them), which would give them enough seats to push things through. The Liberals are not likely to vote en masse with the Conservatives, however, as there are several different factions within the party (some closer to Conservatives, some closer to NDP, and even a few in the middle-- depending on the issue, of course). In Canada we have a habit of not so much voting FOR someone so much as voting AGAINST, which, I would suggest, is the case here (although I hope that the NDP keeps and increases their gains).

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Is there any chance...
Posted by: JoshuaHolland on Jan 24, 2006 8:34 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
That he can get the votes to pull out of Kyoto?

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» RE: Is there any chance... Posted by: CanuckKid
» RE: Is there any chance... Posted by: kashicat
Not a majority, so not a disaster
Posted by: sofun on Jan 24, 2006 8:40 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Now that the Reform party is in power, one of two things will happen - both good from a progressive view:

1. The loonies that Harper kept so well-bottled during the campaign will come out of the woodwork and remind Canadians who Harper and his main supporters and advisers really are - which means the government won't last long.

2. Harper will decide that the only way to keep power is to go against his instincts and govern more moderately than he would actually like to.

On a national scale, I don't think enough Canadians would tolerate a Mike Harris / George Bush style government for long - especially if it doesn't have a majority. So long as separtism support levels remain mediocre, large numbers of Bloc MP's are good for the country, as they mean more progressive members in Parliament.

The tired Liberals need a chance to regroup and elect a younger, more visionary leader without all their baggage. A Liberal majority or NDP-coalition is my prediction with the next 2 to 2.5 years.

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Uncertain about Canada's direction #1
Posted by: The Southpaw on Jan 24, 2006 8:45 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
As a Political Science student at a Canadian university, even I am fairly unsure about the direction that Canada is progressing, but I do know that Harper's victory wasn't as complete as expected. First, a lot of Conservative support during this election was the result of a reaction against the Liberals, not out of any particular agreement with Harper's policy. Many voters decided to support the CPC in order to teach the Grits a lesson, regardless of the potential political cost. Once Harper starts actually unveiling policy, he may find that his support will wane.

Next, the Liberals performed reasonably well despite an awful campaign. Martin threw out every wild accusation, and Peter Mansbridge of the CBC even remarked that every day of the campaign was a bad day for the Liberals. In essence, the Liberals handed Harper a victory, but they still received a third of the House. The Liberals barely even tried and they managed to lessen the gap between them and the Conservatives. The Tories had a golden opportunity to gain a majority and they failed. If they can't gain a solid foothold on power under these circumstances, they're not going too anytime soon.

I don't know who will lead the Liberals, but they now have a good opportunity to clean up the party and regroup. With 103 seats in Parliament, they have an excellent position to stymie Harper's agenda. As long as they don't bend over like the Democrats in the US, I'm confident that they can mitigate the worse excesses of the Conservatives.

The big gains made by the New Democrats are really quite telling. The NDP nearly doubled their hold in the House of Commons during this election, and will probably counter the Conservatives wherever they can. A Liberal-NDP alliance within Parliament can wield plenty of power in a minority government, so long as the Liberals keep their spine. The NDP worked to great effect in the previous Liberal minority, and their influence can only increase with their popular gains. As for the Bloc, I'm not sure about them. Much of their platform appeals to voters on the left, and they might feel threatened by Conservative gains in Quebec and be more supportive of the Liberals in this situation.

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Leadership ...
Posted by: JoshuaHolland on Jan 24, 2006 8:56 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Anyone want to inform the uninformed about the process of selecting a new leader?

tclaverdure said it's a likely race between Michael Ignatieff, an author and academic (named "Canada's sexiest cerebral man" by Maclean's magazine in 2003) and Belinda Stronach, a millionaire who left the Tories to join the Libs last year. Anyone else? How does this work?

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» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: sofun
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: sln70
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: sofun
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: sln70
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: sofun
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: sln70
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: tclaverdure
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: otto
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: kashicat
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: MrErik
» RE: Leadership ... Posted by: kashicat
kath
Posted by: kath on Jan 24, 2006 9:06 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Check out Rabble.ca. Some interesting commentary there.

Harper could form a coalition with the Bloc for anything that will give more power to the provinces. Both parties would benefit. Duceppe (Bloc leader) said "that while the Bloc and the Conservatives would unite to work on common issues, he warned that values conveyed by the rest of Canada would never take precedence over "Quebec values." So Harper will have to stay fairly "centrist" in order to not alienate Quebecers.

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Maynard
Posted by: maynard on Jan 24, 2006 9:39 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Must disagree (mildly - the Canadian way) with the comment that our Conservatives are analagous to American right-of-centre Democrats. This was true once upon a time, back when we called our right wing "The Progressive Conservative Party", but that party is dead, swallowed up whole by the Reform/Alliance Party; the Conservative Party of today - as represented by Mr. Harper - is far more "like" the American Republican Party - as represented by Mr. Bush. It wants Canada out of Kyoto; it favours participation in Bush's "missile defense system"; it backs the American Iraq adventure; it would like to privatise Canada's health-care system; it opposes gay and women's rights; and so on and on and on and on. Our Conservatives are neo-con, through and through. That's the bad news... but the good news is this: Harper may now occupy the prime minister's chair, but he doesn't have enough votes backing him to implement any of the dreadful things he might really want to do.

The (neo) Conservatives have polled only 37% of the popular vote - even less than George Bush's approval rating; the remaining 63% is divided among the Liberals, the Bloc and the NDP... and these are all, in American terms, "left-wing" political parties. The poor, corrupt, old Liberals represent our centre. This centre has certainly shifted a bit rightward under Paul Martin, but only relative to where it was under Chretien and Trudeau; the closest American analogue to what we call the "centre" would be the left wing of the Democratic Party. The Bloc is to the left of the Liberals; if there is an analogue in American politics to the Bloc, it would be found just to the left of the most radical-left-liberal-pinko-fringe element of the Democratic Party. Then we have the NDP - the big winner in last night's election. While Canadians may tell you that the NDP "isn't really very socialist anymore", it's all relative. If the NDP were an American political party, its members would all be either blacklisted or in jail. Has Canada swung to the right? Sort of... but, "right" and "left" can mean different things here than they do in the U.S.

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» RE: Maynard Posted by: redjenny
Thank you Joshua - Another Perspective
Posted by: EricLehner on Jan 24, 2006 9:44 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I appreciate your having raised the topic of the Canadian Election for your readers. The election result was positive for both Canada and our relationship with the United States in many ways.

The first point is that Canadians did not necessarily take a turn to the right. Many simply voted for an alternative Prime Minister whose policies and personality had a "down-to-earth" quality. He seems to be an intelligent, responsible and hardworking person that wants to make relationships stronger.

The second point is that he will not have unbridled authority, because a majority of Canadians voted for parties to the left of Mr. Harper. Interestingly, Canada's Green Party is gradually increasing its share of the popular vote too. If a system of Proportional Representation is adopted one day, the Green Party would also have seats in Parliament.

Lastly, Harper's most telling comments were during his acceptance speech. He noted that he is aware of his minority status, that Canada has a new government but is not a different country and that Candian values flow from the people upward; they are not defined by any single political party.

Therefore, I predict that things will work out fine. Canada will continue with a policy of moderation in all things. Are we mocked for this - yes. But the world could use more of this characteristic, not less. Moderation diminishes cruelty and hatred in the world. Moderation deserves to be spoken of in positive terms, as a deliberate policy and ultimately an important contribution to well being between people and amongst nations.

Best regards from Canada and thank you for your interest in the election.

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Coalition..
Posted by: sln70 on Jan 24, 2006 9:51 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This will have to shift depending on the topic. The NDP (I doubt) will budge from their social agenda.. but then Harper would have to be a complete moron or megalomaniac to believe it's a good idea to table anything remotely resembling the same-sex marriage bill, abortion rights, etc at this point. Or ever, during this turn as leader.

My mother, who wasn't going to vote (in protest) actually went and voted for the Conservative candidate. I had to control my temper. I said, "I guess you're too old to care anymore about a woman's right to choose." to which she responded "Oh, he'll NEVER take that away." I think her mindset is pretty indicative of the way a lot of the new conservative voters feel. If he shows those stripes he'll lose next time.. in a big way.

But then what the hell do *I* know? I was positive that would be another Liberal minority. I sincerely thought that the NDP would win more seats, that the Bloc would keep more, and the liberals would squeak it out.

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» RE: Coalition.. Posted by: redjenny
otto
Posted by: otto on Jan 24, 2006 10:11 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm a "yankee-Doodle Canuck" - dual citizenship and living now in Canada. I think most of the previous comments have put it together pretty well...I've been trying to figure out where the Quebec Bloc stand on anything except to become a country themselves. I have seen the Liberals about as liberal and useless as the Demcrats in the States, at least on business and corporate agendas. Martin cut all kinds of social programs as Minister of Finance; he and his family own a steamship line that has off-shore tax breaks and hires foreign workers more cheaply. The Liberals never kept promises to get out of NAFTA. They have secretly gone along with Bush on many things - like kidnapping citizens and letting them be shipped to torture-countries and even supporting the missile defense to some extent. I think Harper will either shoot himself in the foot and cause another dreadful election, or be cautious and not get in too much trouble. I'm happy with the NDP gains...but personally, I'm with Maude Barlow and her Council of Canadians; they don't trust any party once the corporate world starts working on them, so they get lots done with just grass roots activities (all over the world!)

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» RE: otto Posted by: JoshuaHolland
» RE: otto Posted by: tclaverdure
» RE: otto -- must read! Posted by: JoshuaHolland
» RE: otto -- must read! Posted by: tclaverdure
» RE: otto Posted by: otto
» RE: otto Posted by: otto
» RE: otto Posted by: JoshuaHolland
» RE: otto Posted by: kashicat
Anyone know ...
Posted by: JoshuaHolland on Jan 24, 2006 10:40 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The origin of the word "Grits"?

And thanks to all the readers who have made this thread oh-so-much-more informative than this morning's Toronto Star and Vancouver Sun.

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» RE: Anyone know ... Posted by: sofun
» Maynard on Grits Posted by: maynard
yay minority government
Posted by: mikewarren on Jan 24, 2006 10:47 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Can he get his agenda through?

No, not all of it. The Bloc is his "likely" ally and Duceppe is pretty classically "left-wing" as you call it in many areas (e.g. he won't agree to leave Kyoto). The biggest effect will, IMO, be giving more powers to the provinces with the Bloc's enthusiastic support.

Will there be new elections quite soon?

Probably. At least a year, but minority governments don't usually last long. Budgets are usually the sticking point.

Who's next to lead the Libs?

Don't know and don't care.

To what extent is this going to shake up the party?

Hopefully it will result in actual electoral reform, but I doubt it. For example, our first-past-the-post thingy means that the Conservatives won 100% of the seats in Alberta with 60% of the popular vote.

The biggest winners, proportionally, were the lefty New Dems (went from 19 to 29 seats), so is Canada in fact turning rightward?

Not really.

What else should we be watching in the next six months?

Kindergarden -- I mean parliament -- will hopefully get mired down in minutae and not do too much of anything useful -- this is the best part of minority governments.

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Please
Posted by: russianblue1 on Jan 24, 2006 11:04 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
tell us (or U.S.) how to wise up! America should look to Cananda for direction on compassion, intelligence, and the ability to recognize nuances in debates. It's a gray world out there and the Canadians seem to have a pretty good grip on reality without marginalizing or insulting an opposing point of view. PLEASE tell us how you do it! Is it the water? Can you send U.S. (or us) parts of your gene pool? Canada is looking better every day!!

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» RE: Please Posted by: Arianna
» RE: Please Posted by: tclaverdure
» RE: Please Posted by: Arianna
» RE: Please Posted by: tclaverdure
» RE: Please Posted by: Flavius Vivens
We still lean a little to the left...
Posted by: evva b on Jan 24, 2006 3:57 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
If you look at percentage of overall votes, Canada still leans a little to the left. With a proportional representation voting system our government would reflect this. See 2006: Another case of electoral dysfunction

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Molson's is American!
Posted by: darthcricket on Jan 24, 2006 5:01 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It was a sad day for hockey when the frothheads at Molson's got guzzled by Coors. This is a prime example of "deep integration" which was a boilingfrog deception for the right Liberals and is a wet dream for the Harper Conservatives. Deep Integretion is the same as a stealth, fifth column, invasion of Canada. Now that the two major players are onside with this one, we have to be very watchful of this, not to mention the exponentially valuable commodity of WATER!

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» RE: Molson's is American! Posted by: JoshuaHolland
» RE: Molson's is American! Posted by: tclaverdure
» RE: Molson's is American! Posted by: JoshuaHolland
» RE: off topic,but.... Posted by: crusty
» RE: Molson's is American! Posted by: MrErik
» RE: Molson's is American! Posted by: darthcricket
Harper is PM, but left-wing Canada wins.
Posted by: evva b on Jan 25, 2006 12:49 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Best of all possible outcomes
Posted by: kashicat on Jan 25, 2006 1:18 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm glad someone mentioned that Molson isn't Canadian now. It's sad; it was almost as old as Canada (older? I can't remember the dates), & we don't have many Canada-only, long-time companies left. Even the Bay is about to go, the last big one. Our history is being gobbled up.

Anyway. Canadians didn't vote *for* the Cons, we voted *against* the Liberals. A minority Con government was the very best outcome under the circumstances.

The mostly western-based Cons won't be able to claim they never get listened to, now. They even got seats in Quebec -- not on their own merit, but they still get to feel like they did. So they finally get to choose the Prime Minister & be the government. I'm glad they're happy.

But they have no real power. This will drive their wingnut base absolutely bonkers. Anything extreme that they might try would be prevented by the other three parties, which can join to outvote them. I think Harper will try to be as moderate as possible, but his wingnuts were obedient and muzzled themselves so hard during the campaign, that I bet they're going to feel he now owes them. I doubt they'll keep quiet long enough for Harper to get the country to believe he's in charge of a moderate party.

In fact, the more restrained they are by the other parties, the more the wingnuts must spew. They can't keep it in forever. The first time the Bloc doesn't cooperate -- out will come all the wingnuts' loathing, absolute loathing, for Quebec. Will they get seats in Quebec in an election after that? Not hardly.

There's no party that will cooperate with the Cons on anything socially radical. So that won't happen. Other things could conceiveably shift a bit more rightward, perhaps business-wise, but I'm not sure how much of that they'll be able to accomplish either.

And the longer they go without banning abortion, cancelling gay marriage, blah blah blah, the more the wingnuts will spew. I don't know if they'd split off and form their own party again -- but I know from my old days in the Reform party that they do NOT like compromise with "the enemy." And everyone is "the enemy" who doesn't agree with them.

So...the Liberals will have time to clean house, toss out the trash, and get ready to lead again. And the Cons will be restrained from doing much damage. And the wingnuts will spew, and we'll throw them out next time.

Gonna be fun.

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French/Canada Question, First Nations is the Answer
Posted by: CommonWealth on Jan 25, 2006 9:56 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
The French Separation Question is only a worry if you forget the First Nations (Indian, Red Man, Savage…)
When you have been here for at least the last 12,500 years, you tend to call it home after a while.
With that said, The French or Quebecois, who think they are a “Distinct” society, should really look Linguistically to see who is closer:
the English or Haida, or Cree or Mohawk etc…?

CommonWealth

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