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What does it mean to say that we've lost in Iraq?

Posted by Jan Frel at 2:52 PM on January 31, 2007.


Jan Frel: If you're willing to admit that we've lost in Iraq, don't stop there: what are the implications?
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Most of us want the U.S. troops out of Iraq. "Out of Iraq, now!" It's what we've heard at protests, and read in thousands of op-eds. This is the simple, isolated point the U.S. anti-war movement has been calling for ever since we invaded. It's what I want too, but that's not all I want. There has always been something about that didn't sit well with me, and it wasn't the equally myopic argument that withdrawing from Iraq would prompt even greater bloodshed.

Why is "Out of Iraq, now!" an impossible, dash-yourself-against-rocks approach to ending the occupation in my opinion? I think it's because it doesn't admit to the breakdown of the American political system that has allowed the invasion of Iraq to happen, or the existence of the American empire that was required to undertake it.

If you bring in these two elements -- that our 18th century political system is on its knees and the reality that there is an enormous empire operating in the name of the United States -- to the debate about Iraq, we might get somewhere. But there's also the issue that "out of Iraq" means a lot more than just leaving it.

And Bush has started alluding to it. A few times recently, I've watched him say that a loss in Iraq would be catastrophic for the United States. He hasn't quite made the connection that we have lost in Iraq, and that this adds up to a looming catastrophe.; just that if we did lose, it would be bad.

It's funny; I read about six or seven essays from the progressive side about Iraq every day, and there is also scant mention of the fact that we've lost, and what losing means. Just that the occupation is horrible and violent and expensive... so we need to get out now.

A swathe of Americans and folks aligned with democratic causes haven't quite made the connection that getting out of Iraq is an end to everything from pro-West smorgasbords like Davos to our "cheap and easy motoring lifestyles" as James Howard Kunstler puts it. There is a salvage-the-empire current that crudely recognizes this. Everyone from Howard Dean to Joe Biden is essentially calling for it: "redeployment." Yes, it's out of Iraq, but the soldiers stay in the region and continue the process of Mideast domination... The problem with this is that they are ignoring that we have occupied Iraq for a few years now -- a most radical act -- and set in motion a series of events that will happen wherever these troops redeploy to -- civil war in Iraq, an independent Kurdistan v. Turkey and Iran, a multination showdown of Shiites v. Sunnis, etc.

In other words, I think "redeployment" is neither a response to the kind of process that got us into Iraq in the first place, nor a response to the problems that our occupation of Iraq have given rise to. Dealing with Iraq itself is about regional diplomacy, UN peacekeeping, US reparations to Iraqis, a more equitable means of oil revenue distribution, among other things. "Redeployment" is an attempt to buffer this country from the psychic and material effects of losing a high-stakes military engagement: It's the wish that everything will go back to that wonderful "normal" we enjoyed in the 90's.

Two of the most radical things that can happen in a political state are when a nation declares war, and even more, when it loses that war. It will be devastating. Aside from the human and monetary side of things -- the loss of a war will rip through all of our lives, permanently scarring the way we relate not only to the political state, but our family and our friends. I can feel elements of it channeling through my own life. And the truth is, the loss of this war hasn't come back to us in any significant way yet. But it will.

There's an effort in its embryonic stages from the "Out of Iraq, now!" activists and writers: leveraging the 2008 presidential race to push for an exit. This will be another fruitless enterprise, because as I wrote above, it offers no critique of our political system or our empire, and it concedes to the undemocratic insanity of one president for 300 million people.

The idea of leveraging a president to end the occupation is an extension of the well-established habit of blaming George Bush for each breakdown of our civil liberties, when in fact it's a process that's been going on ever since the ink dried on the Constitution. Sure, Bush may have sped up the decay, but Jefferson encouraged us to utterly rewrite our Constitution every 20 years, not just amend it occasionally. The longer the state remains unchanged, the harder it becomes for it to enforce any laws other than those that protect itself.

A presidential candidate who was serious about the issue of Iraq would most certainly run on the platform of ending the presidency as it stands, and call for a total overhaul of the American political system. I don't think that is something you'll find even in Dennis Kucinich's playbook.

It is the executive itself that is at the heart of the problem. The presidency has turned into a hideous creature of the 18th Century; it has accreted enormous power, rapidly accelerated since the New Deal. Tie this into the debate about the state of political representation in this country: it's stalled at whether the District of Columbia should get a voting member in the House, which would make it 436 members for 300 million citizens. How can you take a serious look at a number like that and expect serious executive oversight and representation, even from a pure majority of progressive ideologues? You can't.

So, as I see it, the way out of Iraq and never having an Iraq again is to make these two questions central: Do we want an empire and what does democracy in the 21st Century look like?

Digg!

Tagged as: iraq, democracy

Jan Frel is AlterNet's senior editor.


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War Pimp Alert
Posted by: rwa on Jan 31, 2007 3:18 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
>getting out of Iraq is an end to everything from pro-West smorgasbords like Davos to our "cheap and easy motoring lifestyles"

Utter nonsense. Completely unsubstantiated war mongering. Shameful.
In reality we now pay almost three times as much for oil as we did prior to the invasion.

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» RE: War Pimp Alert Posted by: Jan Frel
» He has a point Posted by: SteveB
» RE: He has a point Posted by: Jan Frel
» RE: He has a point Posted by: rwa
» RE: He has a point Posted by: Jan Frel
» RE: He has a point Posted by: rwa
» RE: He has a point Posted by: lessbread
» RE: He has a point Posted by: Jan Frel
» RE: He has a point Posted by: lessbread
» Please define your terms Posted by: SteveB
» RE: Please define your terms Posted by: lessbread
» Here we go again... Posted by: SteveB
» RE: Here we go again... Posted by: Davidco
» RE: Here we go again... Posted by: sethmo
» RE: mostly pointless meandering Posted by: Edward George
» RE: PS Posted by: Edward George
"Out of Iraq" is just a first step
Posted by: SteveB on Jan 31, 2007 3:51 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
And step two is educating the public to the larger problem: the American economic and military empire.

The loss of the Iraq war, like the loss of the Vietnam war, provides a "teachable moment" that can spark a national conversation about whether we want to be a democracy or and empire - because we can't be both..

Bush has provided the opportunity, it's up to us to take it.

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» I think we agree... Posted by: SteveB
American Empire
Posted by: Xynyx on Jan 31, 2007 4:06 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I guess I wonder which essays you've been reading... or maybe you just haven't been reading the comments.

I seem to recall reading far too many comments to count wherein people mentioned the American Empire and the shame of it all and how it would not last and how it should not last.

And what of Arundhati Roy, Noam Chomsky, et al? Do they not also speak of American Empire?

Of course it's going to come down. If we're serious about democracy, it MUST. If the rest of the people in the world are ever to get a fair shake, all empires must fall. If that means our political systems must fall, then so be it.

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Failure of leadership, Failure of vigilance
Posted by: eddie torres on Jan 31, 2007 10:00 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Abroad, US leaders since 1991 have failed to map a collective American future because the enemy they trained for (USSR) is now a mild irritant, and the enemy they hoped to 'turn around' is now their chief creditor and competitor (China). The 'agent' they are now forced to deal with to obtain their oil is, unfortunately, an unfamiliar whirlwind of violence (Saudi-Kuwait-Iran-Iraq).

Domestically, US citizens have failed to protect their political and economic freedoms because their primary goal is to leach as much as they can from a predatory financial system that zeroes in on maximizing short-term gain. US-based religious fanatics prey upon the hopeless and are obsessed with their own apocalyptic demise.

The loss in Iraq is a pirate's life, but a financier's gain as well.

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Read Chalmers Johnson -
Posted by: thoughtcriminal on Jan 31, 2007 11:57 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Why Nemesis is at the US's door
By Chalmers Johnson, Asia Times Online, Feb 01 2007


When it comes to reporting the real world dynamics, few sources seem to come close to ATO. Here are a few quotes from the article:

"History tells us that one of the most unstable political combinations is a country - like the United States today - that tries to be a domestic democracy and a foreign imperialist....

As a continuation of my own analytical odyssey, I then began doing research on the network of 737 US military bases maintained around the world (according to the Pentagon's own 2005 official inventory). Not including the Iraq and Afghanistan conflicts, the US now stations more than half a million troops, spies, contractors, dependants and others on military bases in more than 130 countries, many of them presided over by dictatorial regimes that have given their citizens no say in the decision to let the US in.....

The combination of huge standing armies, almost continuous wars, an ever growing economic dependence on the military-industrial complex and the making of weaponry, and ruinous military expenses as well as a vast, bloated "defense" budget, not to speak of the creation of a whole second Defense Department (known as the Department of Homeland Security) has been destroying our republican structure of governing in favor of an imperial presidency. By republican structure, of course, I mean the separation of powers and the elaborate checks and balances that the founders of the United States wrote into the constitution as the main bulwarks against dictatorship and tyranny, which they greatly feared.

We Americans are on the brink of losing our democracy for the sake of keeping our empire. Once a nation starts down that path, the dynamics that apply to all empires come into play - isolation, overstretch, the uniting of local and global forces opposed to imperialism, and in the end bankruptcy.


Print the article out. Pass it along to strangers. This is where we are at - our so-called leaders are far worse than most people imagine, and their goal is no less then the overthrow of democracy in favor of empire.

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» RE: ead Chalmers Johnson - Posted by: monkeywrench
Dick's Got Something For You
Posted by: VannaLaRoche on Feb 1, 2007 5:16 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
See that oily bundle wrapped in the American flag and trailing yellow ribbons, tucked under the flabby arm of Dick Cheney? It's called Our Oil, and Dick's busy getting it for you.

Hold your applause until the War On Terrorism is ended, please.

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Yep – get ready for some uncomfortable lifestyle changes.
Posted by: monkeywrench on Feb 1, 2007 9:08 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
From the article:
" A swathe of Americans and folks aligned with democratic causes haven't quite made the connection that getting out of Iraq is an end to everything from pro-West smorgasbords like Davos to our "cheap and easy motoring lifestyles" as James Howard Kunstler puts it. "

Oh, some of us get it, all right; but, aside from it being "the right thing to do," I think that wanting to leave Iraq is an attempt to put the wildcat back into the box, trying to undo the greatest military, strategic and foreign relations blunder of the modern age, or, perhaps, of any age. Historians have had to go all the way back to 9 AD when Rome lost three whole legions in Germania to find any sort of parallel. What the Bush cabal (Bush is just the hood ornament on the Panzer Tank of State) has done is to make real the myth of Pandora's Box.

There are (thankfully, few) actions that are so foolish and destructive (global thermonuclear war comes to mind) that there IS NO way to fix them. Our invasion of Iraq may or not be one of those – but it is clear that, for us, there is no winning in Iraq; we had already lost the second we decided to invade.

Whether or not we are still involved, whether it takes a year or 50 years, correcting this colossal mistake will require a level of policing and diplomacy by multinational organizations, like the U.N. and the Arab League, that I'm not sure still exists. We once helped to rebuild both Japan and Europe; but today, there is no George C. Marshall, and we cannot even rebuild a country less populous than California – or, rather, won't. All we have is that other George, the one who blew it up in the first place.

And now, the Bush cabal wants to make the same mistake, a much bigger mistake, again with Iran, the "junkyard dog" of the Middle East. Apparently, no one, not The People, not the Congress, not the Supreme Court, can (or will) stop our madman president and his equally-mad cohorts; so pray that our whole system of life isn't consumed before Bush's self-ignited forest fire burns itself out.

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Good Piece
Posted by: Brutus on Feb 1, 2007 11:13 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
This is a very good piece and begs a lot of questions. The idea as some have stated in the comments that the war and empire costs America, well, not yet. It's all on credit and the strength of the dollar, until bill comes due, there's absolutely no doubt the US economy "benefits" mightily from the empire, especially as to how we currently value the "good life." Make no mistake, this benefit is spread from top to bottom.

It would be nice if the anti-war movement picked a couple issues that we need to deal with when the empire goes bust -- oil of course is the easiest. Let's say "Get out of Iraq, Get out of OUR CARS!"

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» Who benefits from empire? Posted by: SteveB
» True... Posted by: SteveB
Not possible.
Posted by: symcokid on Feb 1, 2007 11:20 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How can we have lost the War if we have gained access to Iraq's Oil on our terms, and in essence control of their Oil or should I say, " Grand Theft of Iraqi Oil"!

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The war was lost before it began
Posted by: NonnyO on Feb 1, 2007 12:43 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
How is "winning" a war during the commission of a war crime possible?

The invasion of Iraq was a war crime under the Geneva Conventions per the Nuremberg judgment.

There never was a "victory" to be had while committing a war crime. The whole world knows it. Most of the people of this country haven't figured that out yet because Lamestream Media has participated in the repetition of the administration's lies as regularly as the next commercial. It's a con job on a national and scale, and the dumbing down of America in the process because media perpetuates the lies and never tells us the truth.

IMPEACH the bam dastards already!

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BACK TO MARCH, 2003
Posted by: VZEQICVA on Feb 1, 2007 2:55 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I've have never understood anything this administration has said about Iraq. They are vague, non-specific and refuse to answer questions put to them by anyone. I don't believe I'm the ony one. Their language is deliberately confusing. But I have read countless books and papers. On day 3 of the invasion we were 'not winning'. Poor planning to start and NO PLANNING to get out. How do we punish people for death and destruction with no real explanation. Thanks, ANNA

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Dig deeper
Posted by: herbal on Feb 2, 2007 1:30 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Jan has a great direction but stops well short of defining the problem as well as the democratic goal. It is not just the Executive that is corrupted. Who elects the Congress? Did the House willfully and unflinchingly abdicate its Constitutional repsonsibiltiy to declare war to the Executive thereby further concentrating power in the Executive? Ten percent of Federal campaign contributions come from individuals. That leaves 90% to corporations and the vaunted by right wing but dying Unions. Corporations buy the Congress; the Congress that will not bite the hand that feeds. And they buy the Presidency. Who nominated GWB over a less incredible field of candidates? Who declared all Democratic candidates unelectable save Wall St. Kerry and his sabre rattling sidekick on a convention floor full of yellow Kucinich anti-war flags? Well, spell it out with CBS, ABC, NBC; GE, Westinghouse and Disney!

Then add the corporatiization (see Wikipedia: corporatism) of the American way with the designation of an official State Evangelical Church, operating from NORAD territory.

Add to the swill, anti-queer legislation sponsored by, well, closet gays like Ministers of thousands, Haggard, Finkelstein, Gannon, Foley, and RNC Chairman elect Mehlman!! Who doesn't believe in Equal opportunity and affirmative action?

We are talking about a real lapse; to quote the religious right, loss of family values; the value of democracy all through the stoned electorate because of saturation media honed to surgical precision by Madison Avenue and its surgical smart bombs of advertising. TV the opiate of the masses. Adbusters has got it right. It takes Canadians to get it right because we Americans are so blinded by our own corrupted trivialized violent culture. Take the SuperBowl sacrament this weekend. Throw a brick through your tv during the Star Spangled Banner before kick off. Then go to a dying 'mainstream' church like Presbyterian and join the real peace movement. Tell a Baptist about the Prince of Peace who is a Pacifist and disdains hypocrites. Reinvent a positive culture. Turn every Congressional voter of the war power transfer out of office in 2008 and 2010. And, yes, Jan, reinvent the Constitution by simply adding some choice adjectives and adverbs to reinforce its inherent passion for power to the People. Rant some more to honor Molly Ivins.

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