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Blog/counterblog: Hillary & flag-burning

Posted by Evan Derkacz at 4:33 AM on December 6, 2005.


Smart politics or Republican Lite?
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A worthwhile project while our reputation the world over turns to ash.

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Remember the quaint old days when flag-burning was so outrageous as a rights violation liberals would quiver with indignation? A Bush, a Patriot Act, and some enemy combatants later, outrage over criminalizing flag-burning feels like outrage at the exposure of a bare knee in a Hollywood movie.

I'm sort of kidding of course. Banning flag-burning is an important first amendment issue. It's just, you know, expectations have shifted.

The news that Hillary Clinton is signing on to legislation that "outlaws a protester intimidating any person by burning the flag, lighting someone else's flag, or desecrating the flag on federal property."

Matt Stoller opposes her stance while conceding that "[It's] not the biggest deal in the world, just a bit of of silly pandering."

But he makes a good point about Clinton's framing of the issue:

"The deeply disturbing piece here is the awful comparison of flag burning to cross burning. Cross burning is well-understood as a sign of terrorism. It was used to suppress blacks organizing themselves in both the South and the North from the post-Civil War era until the late 1960s. It was a sign of intimidation, of terrorism, or impending hate crimes. It was often a death threat. Flag burning has usually been the province of hippies and countercultural movements, and these have been relatively benign. They are certainly not equivalent in any way shape or form to the KKK or the legacy of slavery and segregation that cross burning represents."

The Carpetbagger argues that what's actually going on here is a compromise. While the act is being criminalized, it's not the constitutional amendment that conservative Republicans are pushing for. He writes:

"First, it's federal legislation, not a constitutional amendment. Second, I'm fine with protecting others' flags, since destruction of private property is illegal anyway. I'm not quite sure how they'd enforce flag damage that "promotes violence," but since this whole mess is about crass political exploitation anyway, I'm happy to let Judiciary Committee lawyers hash it out."

What's more, Senate Republicans don't like the bill, so it's basically an easy thing for Senate Dems to sign onto with impunity. It may be cynical, but it's hard to blame a Dem planning a presidential run for pursuing this approach.
(MyDD / Carpetbagger)

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Evan Derkacz is a New York-based writer and contributor to AlterNet.


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don't agree
Posted by: abby on Dec 6, 2005 7:47 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I'm sorry, I don't feel that forgiving at all. If it's MY flag and I bought it, and I feel like burning it to make a point or a comment on my feelings, that's MY right. Should I go to prison? I turned off Hillary long ago. She'll do anything that's popular at the moment in her determination to become the first woman president. A good vice president for her would be Joe Lieberman.

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Hillary is the Ashlee Simpson of politics
Posted by: lamar on Dec 6, 2005 9:23 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hillary Clinton is a piece of garbage, the very problem with the democratic party, and American politics in general: She's a star, a brand name, yet she ceased to have substance a long time ago. She's the pandering husk of a former politician. She's a super vetted, John Kerry-esqe, I can't make up my mind until the poll is out, worthless politician.

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Hillary, as was her husband, is working with PNAC
Posted by: jreinhart1 on Dec 6, 2005 9:35 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
It should be obvious by know that both have and are following the AEI/PNAC guidelines. Bill Clinton could care less about Iraq and it's people and showed us that to the number of 500,000+ additional dead per Madeline Albright. He also secured the Balkans for the US for the oil industry in taking a totally lopsided approach to the 600 years of war between these people of which, Bosnia and Croatia had slaughtered between 300K and 500K Serbians in their pro-Nazi death camps in WW II.

She is following up with destroying our constitution and bill of rights in being lock step with the current Bush administration. Ms. Clinton enjoys the sense power and could care less about American lives and livelihoods. Standing behind Rumsfeld in the worst planned war ever conceived by the USA ever to create a perpetual state of war giving the President essentially war powers for as long as this fake conflict takes place is the target she is aiming for.

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Hillary & Flag Burning
Posted by: AlanSmithee on Dec 6, 2005 10:32 AM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Hey, all the dems are trying to say with these stupid amendments is that it doesn't really matter what Hillary (or any candidate) stands for. Just shut up and vote. You don't have a choice anyway. (Oh, and be afraid of the republicans. Booga booga!)

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Do we know the truth about the KKK?
Posted by: lmiesse on Dec 6, 2005 12:26 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
http://www.reason.com/links/links120205.shtml

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