First we pass universal health care,
which will kill the GOP,
and then we will see rise of the new opposition party,
which will be to the left of the Dems,
and I'll maybe get a chance to feel better represented
by them than I do by anybody now.

What's the opposite of the "for-want-of-a-nail" story?

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It can either be a single-payer system or something like one or, as Obama has proposed again and again, a continuation of privately insured (perhaps with a token government insurance plan for real cheap) with certain promises towards "making it more affordable." These are not gradations either, but approaches to collective healthcare premised on very different ideological assumptions. In the case of the former, I completely understand and agree it would go far to bring America to the Left as it did in Europe. In the case of the latter though, I can't predict what will happen, but it sounds like more "government without government" mainstream, market-happy conservatism.

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Having gone as far as a single payer health care plan many would draw the line and become fervently against more government involvement. Single Payer Health Care would realign the political Parties along the lines we see in the EU. Republicans would actually become stronger but much more mainstream.

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Robert Pear writes in the NYTimes:

"Private health insurance plans, which serve nearly one-fourth of all Medicare beneficiaries, have increased the cost and complexity of the program without any evidence of improving care, researchers say in studies to be published today."

and:

"Payments to health maintenance organizations are, on average, 12 percent higher than what government would spend for beneficiaries in traditional Medicare, they wrote, while payments to private fee-for-service plans were 17 percent higher."

and:

"Karen M. Ignagni, president of America's Health Insurance Plans, a trade group, said two types of plans - HMOs and preferred provider organizations - had produced tangible benefits by coordinating care.

"But, Gold said, "these are not the types of plans that have been growing most rapidly." Instead, the private fee-for-service plans are growing fastest."


peace,
Paul

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If we get universal health care passed we will destroy the republican party because it will show once and for all the flaw in their philosophy that claims private industry can do a better job than the government in all areas. There are some areas where government control is a better answer. This in no way is an attack on capatialism, this is still the best economic system, but in areas where services are mandatory, such as health care, the profit motive has no place. Our police department and our fire department don't operate for profit.

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If conservatives are literally at war with everything you represent then how is moving to the "center" going to strengthen your position?

Unless this is purely grandstanding to tell the people "I tried" it makes no sense.

We see this again and again with the Rethugs, their strategy is to wage all out war on the progressive movement, tarnish its image so that it cannot ever raise its head.

How is unilaterally compromising your position, and your mandate, going to help you? The assumption is that they are intelligent, honest men acting in good faith to find the best working solution. But none of that remotely sounds like the Rethug party of the last 14 years at least, probably the past 30 years when the right wing think tanks were formed as war rooms to run the war that they were planning against us.

Recall, too, the internal scorched earth policy they followed against their own RINOs - their moderates are virtually all long gone. Only right wing extremists remain in any numbers. Just look at the LCV website where only a couple of Rethugs have scores much above say 25 out of a 100 (perfect progressive score).

peace,
Paul

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It seems to me that in a democracy where we elect representatives to voice our interests, the survival of a party isn't worth shit. What matters is whether or not the interests of the people are fairly represented and duly carried out. So the Republicans, in a quest to remain in power, are going to smugly screw over the poor and working class voters that they were so happy to manipulate in the culture wars? These voters are among those perhaps most in need of universal health care, but the representatives that they elected are going to construct big straw men and work against them...
This is sick.

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The GOP has to decide screw the population to stay in power? Sounds like business as usual for the GOP.

Business real fear is all the underpaid drones who need health care for family security will be free to look for the best economic solution, they might have to treat workers with some respect.

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We will all pay for "government" health care in some way or another, and that's fine. The alternative, which we have been suffering under, is to pay for health care AND for a massive, for-profit bureaucracy that drains off massive amounts of cash and denies needed care to millions.

Think of the government as "us" (it's really what it's meant to be, you know). That means that "we" are mass purchasing health care from the providers of it (doctors, hospitals etc...) and can negotiate a fee structure that allows providers to live comfortably and recipients to have unrestricted access for needed care. Fees can be "scheduled" for all services and materials and existing insurance companies can be hired to process claims. They should not be involved in clinical decision making. That way many jobs are preserved with minimal disruption, providers survive and we get the health care we need. The fairest methodolgy for collecting funding would likely be some kind of national sales tax.

A computerized monitoring system could be easily created to "red flag" providers or recipients who might be abusing the system. Providers would make more or less income dependent upon how much service they provide and recipients would choose them based on their reputation and availability rather than being channeled to them because they've cut a deal with some insurance plan.

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I still think it's wrong for insurance companies to profit from the unhealthy condition of our people. If health care were provided through a government program, maybe we would finally see wellness care and health education for people. I know the small business where I work is struggling to keep afloat, and still pay for our health care insurance. It may soon go, then what??? I would gladly pay higher taxes to not have health care as a worry. I think it's going to be very hard in this economic climate to mandate business to provide health insurance. And, it would go a long way to stabilize the market place if government took on this burden. Who cares if the Republicans disappeared, they haven't done anything for working class people.

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So perhaps the GOP might not want to use the universal option, and just scrounge around in the marketplace. They can get it at work, if they get to keep their jobs. Or maybe they are already wealthy from all the tax breaks and missing regulations they have enjoyed over the last eight years. Or maybe they are in Congress already enjoy the socialism to which the Democrats would like to become accustomed.

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Americans are afraid of ANYTHING that is different.
Alternative families
Anything NOT Christian
"Foreign" things
Languages other than English
Hair gel on airplanes
and . . . .
Universal healthcare

All of the above exist in other counties and cultures, but to Americans, who are so narrow, these are things to be feared.

Universal healthcare is new, complicated and so different from what they are used to . . . so they fear it.

They also fear alternative political parties . . . God forbid there would be something other than Dem or Repub . . . oh my God . . . that is soooooooo scary!

Yes, the GOP is dying a quick death . . . SO WHAT????? How about a "New Republican Party" Oh, dear . . . what is that???? I'm scared!

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Single-Payer healthcare, like that which would be provided by HR 676 may 'kill the GOP', but Obama's plan for mandated insurance could become the most powerful weapon in the republican arsenal. Mandating insurance is corruption, means loss of choice, and would ultimately fail to provide care due to the large profits leaching our healthcare dollars away from care. What republican pundit would not revel in having justification for all of the attacks they have leveled. Loss of freedom, financial irresponsibility, and a new one, previously reserved for the republicans, corporate corruption.

I have been following this closely, and it is , frankly, disturbing. Groups like Move-On and Divided we fail, are asking for greater pressure to be applied, to pass what they are now calling 'Universal Health Care', not Obama's plan really, which called for children to be insured, but one closer to Baucus', which would require everyone to buy insurance. All of this pressure, this momentum we have built, is being used by the insurance companies, who are being portrayed as 'generous' for 'agreeing' to force everyone to pay them.

Change without direction is chaos, and in this case, is resulting in the perfect opening for corruption. The difference between 'Single payer universal health care' and 'mandated insurance universal health care' must be pointed out, and all pressure clarified. When people just push, it may be the insurance companies they are pushing for. Those leaches who have for far too long divided our health care dollars between health care and private yachts vacation homes and lobbyists to ensure their position.

I support HR 676, I have read it, and encourage you to do so as well. Everyone would be covered, it would not limit choice, even natural and alternative medicine would be covered, at a huge savings over the private jets and million dollar CEO salaries we pay for now. Please write to your representative and senators, demand that they resist the pressure of these lobbyists, and encourage them to cut the middle man out of health care, these leaches do nothing to improve health.

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