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Bush's Gates Will Stay as Obama's Defense Secretary: Looks Like More War in Afghanistan

Posted by Ian Welsh, Firedoglake at 4:56 PM on November 25, 2008.


What this means is simple enough, a continued draw down in Iraq and a surge in Afghanistan.
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Gates is staying on as Defense Secretary. What this means is simple enough, a continued draw down in Iraq and a surge (tm) in Afghanistan. Gates was, in effect, Bush Senior's man at Defense, cleaning up another one of Junior's messes. This also raises the question of whether generals who have gotten too big for their jobs, are going to be reigned in as they should be. Petraeus has been acting as proconsul, doing high level diplomacy and effectively running US foreign policy in a big chunk of the world. This was a function of Bush's weakness, his need of someone popular to carry his corpse around, as well Condi's complete sidelining from serious decision making. Irrespective of one's views on Petraeus's competence and integrity, however, it's not a healthy situation, and the Obama administration should take back the roles which don't belong to any general.Gates seems unlikely to be the man to do that, but it's hard to imagine Clinton, for example, allowing anyone to usurp her prerogatives, so we shall see how it plays out.

Meanwhile the question in Afghanistan is whether a troop surge can "work". Throw in Karzai's request that the US leave, which I view as his realization that he needs to cut a deal with the other factions in the country and that the US isn't going to "win" in any meaningful sense, and the question has to be raised as to why the US should commit more resources to yet another country that doesn't want it there.More dangerously, Pakistan is being destabilized by the Afghan war. There is now a Pakistani Taliban seeking to overthrow the government, the economy is on the rocks and the loyalty and morale of the army is in question. Since the primary base for Afghani insurgents is actually in Pakistan, no solely Afghani strategy can work, but every US incursion into Pakistan destabilizes that country further, in an eerie and unsettling echo of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia.Since Pakistan is far more important than Afghanistan, and the collapse of Pakistan, with its nukes, would be far more disastrous than terrorists being able to have training camps in Afghanistan, it's unclear to me that the correct decision at this time isn't to just get out of Afghanistan and let Karzai cut his deal so that the destabilization of Pakistan dies down to a level where the government can patch it over.But keeping Gates onboard says that's unlikely to happen. Instead it's going to be double down time. Work or not, it's going to be an expensive and deadly gamble. Casualties will soar and so will the price tag. Iraq was George Bush's war. Afghanistan will be Obama's.Update: I've had it pointed out that a large part of the proconsul problem is a function of State's weakness, and that Gates wants that ended. That's a big plus in his column and indicates he may be able to handle the proconsul problem better than I indicate below.

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To be fair...
Posted by: TheAntagonist on Nov 25, 2008 8:41 PM   
Current rating: 2    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Our Messiah never promised that he wouldn't wage war. Nor did he promise to pull out of Afghanistan. Jumping Jesus on a pogo stick, give the guy a friggin chance! I'm holding my tongue for at least a year and half.

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» RE: To be fair... Posted by: pelican beak
» RE: To be fair... Posted by: TheAntagonist
» RE: To be fair... Posted by: Quannah
don't blame me
Posted by: jbro434 on Nov 25, 2008 9:44 PM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Don't blame me... I supported Kucinich! I guess we will keep throwing money down that hole.

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Haven't the Afghan people suffered enough already?
Posted by: LeftWright on Nov 26, 2008 2:10 AM   
Current rating: 3    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Beginning with Brzezinski's support of "terrorists", which he admitted began six months BEFORE the Soviets went in at the request of a legitimate government in Kabul, the U.S. has inflicted 30 years of horror and hardship on some of the poorest people on the planet.

How many more years of U.S. enabled warlords and heroin dealers must the Afghan people endure?

The Clinton administration signed off on bin Laden's move from the Sudan to Afghanistan, the Bush administration planned the invasion of Afghanistan BEFORE 9/11 and never made any serious attempt to catch bin Laden.

The war on terror is a fraud.

The truth shall set us free. Love is the only way forward.

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Ok with Gates, but not with Hillary
Posted by: Purple Girl on Nov 26, 2008 6:12 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Lets' give this guy a little slack, he was handed a cluster fuck to bgin with, under the command of sociopathic criminals. Rock & a hard place.Do I agree with everything he has done or said, NO..but I am also not in his circumstances nor aware of all aspects of the shit hole CheneyCorp started. Theres at least 30 yrs of Buried bodies to unearth before we know the full extent of what these Treasonous Oilmongers have done around the world- Iraq is most likely ONLY the tip of the Iceberg.we need someone (much like the financial market)who has been privvy to where all the corpsed have been disposed. If we bring in a 'fresh face' they will be able to hide or destroy to information. Much like breaking up the Mafia, another Organized Crime syndicate, You need someone from the inside, one of their 'confidants' to not only reveal their secrets,but also show how to unspin the web.
Honestly I wonder how many are shitting their pants when they here one of theirs has changed sides? Are they Cheering Them or are they just 'whistling past the Graveyard'?

As for Hillary she made my skin crawl when she proclaimed we could 'Oblterate Iran'..Sounded just like Mac's "bomb bomb bomb Iran" sing along written just for Hagee's 'End of Dayer's' Revival Meeting. Add to that the LIES she told- BADLY and her invoking the assasination of RFK THREE TIMES!!!! Hillary elicits the same hair raising goosebumps Cheney did when he was named VP! I don't Trust Her or her husband or her minions...and I voted, and defended, the Clintons Throughout the '90's!Hillary is still (and has always been) a Corporationist- just jumped ship in the 80's into the Democratic party to work the other side of the street- divide & conquer.
come On when we here about which candidates were closest not only in platform, but friendship it is Hillary & McCain, Not Hillary & Obama.Hillary is still a Republican...The ones who feel the corp controlled market will solve every woe. One who thinks Brick and Mortar is the reason this country exists...Not 'We the People'.And that is who she serves.She & Mac sit on the Armed Services..No clear mission, not enough troops or equipment, no exit stratedgy, no aftercare or fair compensation...What Oversight did Either push to provide for OUR Kids (husbands, wives, sister,brothers....)before they put boots down in Afghanistan and Illegally Invaded Iraq...apparently NONE!
considering the way Hillary ran her campaign (above and beyond her horrid voting record in the senate- appeasing this corrupt admin every step of the way), I don't want her near the WH,or the pres Elect.She still has that 'lean and hungry look about' her

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» RE: Ok with Gates, Hillary Posted by: Quannah
Choosing Gates
Posted by: Basenjis on Nov 26, 2008 11:04 AM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Those who are horrified that Obama would choose to keep Gates on have reason to be concerned. He is indeed one of the sociopaths that got us into this mess. He's been up to his eyeballs in Middle East skullduggery for years. He does know where all the bodies are buried. He certainly knows the territory.

Gates was in Iran during the Iraq-Iran War egging on the Iranis while others of the CIA were egging on the Iraqis. But he was merely following directions. Just taking orders.
Gates is a "yes" man. He seeks to please by following directions. He's another Alberto Gonzalez with an obseqious manner and a willingness to do whatever the big boss demands. This makes him very dangerous--in the hands of the wrong man.

I am hoping Obama will turn out to be the right man. I am more than willing to give him time to get it all together. Can't be fun to spend a contentious interregnum while living in a glass house. Is it possible, with the best brains in the business advising him, that he is blind to Gate's or any other of this current line-ups' past? When you consider the convoluted and twisted minds that have brought the United States to this point, to select someone informed and intimately familiar with this post, who has more on tap that Obama needs to know than Robert Gates?

If Obama can get a handle on the contorted events and manuevers of the past several years of our double and triple dealings in these Asian countries with their tribal loyalties, their language complexities, their religious sensitivities and a host of other cultural and historical elements that go into the mix, he stands a real chance of getting us out of there without further costly blunders. Keep Gates in as long as he is useful, but keep that eye on the ball.

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constructive critisism? anyone?
Posted by: WizardofOhm on Nov 26, 2008 7:07 PM   
Current rating: 5    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
I've heard alot of critisism towards this "pick" but none of it has been constructive. I hear no suggestions of who would be a better alternative. Why? because the job requirements go against what progressives want in their administration. We WANT someone who has been completely against the war to execute a quick exit strategy, we NEED somebody who has been fully involved with this debacle, preferably somebody who has had access to all the most top secret information. We WANT someone with no connections to the Bushies, when (as unfortunate as it may be) we NEED a bushy... at least for now.

I believe that this is just the first part of the only reasonable solution. We need a strong willed war antagonist to stand underneath Gates, gathering every ounce of information from him, to take over once he has the situation properly assessed. This is such a huge mess that it could easily take a year for an outsider to gather all the information needed, let alone develop a strategy out. A lot of liberals seem determined that we can all just get up and walk away. That's just our silly idealism getting in the way of rationale. The truth of the matter is that we are going to be stuck climbing out of this mess for a long time. Bush built us a deep hole, it's going to take a while to get out. And if we need to borrow one of his guys because he brought the only headlamp, so be it. As much as we hate it, so be it.

If anyone has a better solution, they should be screaming it out, but as of now all I hear is a bunch of grumbling. In the mean time, I'll be watching to see what happens underneath Gates.

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Democrats are the new Republicans
Posted by: HSencillo on Dec 4, 2008 4:47 PM   
Current rating: Not yet rated    [1 = poor; 5 = excellent]
Obama is backpedaling on war crimes and Gitmo because they are the Republican party that's "in disarray" and "not pushing back." Bullshit! The very fact that Obama would renege on these particular deals is Pure Republicanism. Obama has already sold us out.

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